Anyone for a trip to mars?

[devinpatterson]

The alien-PVP link, the timeline, the meteor origin and the game effects all sound brilliant. :biggrin: Really, they're all very cool ideas.

 

Great, if nothing else it will patch up our history and let us begin to crystallize our story.

 

 

Already come up with a few concepts for hazmat suits that I'll post when I have time. One idea I really like (but can't take credit for since it came from a drinking buddy) is grappling hooks that come out from the heavy armour to hold the suit in place in a storm. Not sure if we could work that or not but it'd be a nice static detail to add nonetheless.

 

Cool, I think the hazmat suits (and the other "sealed" suits) will feature prominently in the mod, so I'd be great to have some custom ones.

 

As far as the grappling hook I think there is something we can do like that. There is a push command (PushActorAway) and we could make it active when there is a big storm if the grappling hook isn't deployed.

 

As for the bio-research, I can see where you're coming from now. I'd been thinking of the Mars mission purely post-war, with the ruins being recently uncovered. If the alien data had originated from the Mars project in the first place though, then I agree it would definately make sense to study the stuff on Mars before shipping it to Earth, if for no other reason than to test in an environment where new samples are readily available and any dangers won't effect Earth. Nice way to make it a solid part of the story!

 

Sorry if I seemed a bit negative before. I had this intense fear that we were going to find ourselves re-making Mothership Zeta. You have set my mind at ease. Thank you, I should have had more faith. :blush:

 

No worries, I know exactly how you feel about Zeta :(

 

I think the thing that was so deceptive with FEV, was it is so prominent in the fallout storylines, that it's easy to assume it was a large part of genetic tech pre-war. But I think the scenario we have now, will let us get around that and still use the FEV for everything and anything we want on the project.

 

 

 

I'm 100% fine including them, especially if they fit the story. The reason craters make such an ideal location is they have naturally occuring limits (like bloody great stone walls). If we make other locations we'll just have to make sure it's not impractical in terms of work generation. The more locations we can fit into the main crater (size as yet undefined) the better, since it means one worldspace, one LOD pass, no requirement for transport, etc.. If a great location fits well somewhere else on the planet we shouldn't let the crater's boundaries prevent its creation. Just try to be as conservative as possible and focus on building locations essential to the main storyline initially. We can always add more later.

 

Sounds eminently sensible, especially in light of our current workload, and I couldn't agree more. I'm thinking that for other locations we might use a rocket plane as a activtor. Assuming you'v aquired the gps locations (or whatever the equivalent ver is of the American satellite) a message box pops up with available destinations (maybe we can use some of Jasons launchs as a short animation before the moveto command). Then you pop up at your new locale in a small/sheltered area next to teh rocket. This way the player is completely boxed in and we won't have to mess with any additional worldspaces unless we want to.

 

 

Assuming we go with OM, the crater isn't going to have any sandstorms, even if some of it isn't terraformed yet...

if we have a "summit" location, then it could be going through one of those whole-planet, monthlong dust storms...

 

I think the summit location is pretty much out of the question. No one is going to want to generate a worldspace with an unrestrained view of the vista. We need to stick to our little crater. I don't know if that implies a few miles across or 10, but it's a finite and bound world space.

 

You could do a little panoramic view like they did in the divide (lonesome road) at the start. Remember just after you pass through the gate you have an open view that looks like a mile or two before the dust/haze snuffs the detail. Then you get into the rest of the mod and everything is pretty tight/restrained. So it'd be more as eyecandy. But much more than that would be asking us for a lot of work, and without LOD (which for a large area is gonna give your cpu a real work out) it's probably going to be too clunky to have anything action wise going on. Honestly the location will probably have more to do with background story than actual landscaping in geck, because most everything that happens will be interior cells or the small crater worldspace.

 

 

some random geek/geck idea? The Canals of Mars being an actual functional place with thin atmosphere by use of Geck Terraforming. Also can we have some heat resistant armour alloys from the Asteroid mining by Rob Co.? (hey there's lots of Irridium in those Nickle Iron rocks)

 

I know the canals are a alluring prospect but we liquid water doesn't actually exist on Mars (has to do with the atmospheric pressure). The special alloy armors are a good idea, but I think we should go with West Tek since they make power armor. Not positive on the asteroid mining, I'm much more inclined to have any mining sites on Mars or Phobos. But we can write some notes and background info that could describe asteroid mining, I just try not to stray from lore if possible.

Edited February 25, 2012 by devinpatterson

[devinpatterson]

Oh also it would probably be a good idea to decide on whether we should include any DLC's. Dead money doesn't have anything we can't re-create. And I don't think there's anything we really, really need from lonesome road. But honest hearts has some useful landscape features (from Zion park) that might look good.

Old world blues has a few nice sci-fi assets like the think tanks, holo assets, robo scorpions, a new cyberdog skeleton, scientists gloves and other equipement, a new utility tile set & hazmat suit (the one that gives the ghosts their appearnce in dead money). I can re-create the holo assets pretty easy if we don't include the attached script (it randomly determines when holo's flicker in and out). I think the new scientist gear is just the same models. And honestly I suspect the robo scorpions are just re-textures of normal scorps (or maybe they have some minor changes to the mesh), so I think we can re-create htem pretty easy. The utility tileset is mostly a re-texture, so it's doable. So I guess it would just be the think tanks we'd loose from OWB, but we can use robobrains.

 

I'm sure I'v forgotten some stuff, but chime in and let me know what you guys think. I want to start creating resources and I don't want to have any dependent DLC's unless we really need htem. I'm of the mind that if it's only a little extra work we forgo the DLC's so everyone can enjoy the mod (some peeps just don't have the addons.)

[kibblesticks]

Also can we have some heat resistant armour alloys from the Asteroid mining by Rob Co.? (hey there's lots of Irridium in those Nickle Iron rocks)

 

I'm with Devin on this one, the asteroid mining seems a bit too far removed from the plot.

 

Dude thats gold, and heres a suggestion. You know how the REPCONN Ghouls talk about that paradise place? And they use a ROCKET to get there? Gee, I wonder where it could possibly be! Since its most likely in space, I always thought it was the moon, irradiated from a stray nuke. But Mars is just as cool. I would love to see a colony of Ghouls in retro space-gear.

 

Nice idea, but we ruled out Bright and Co earlier in the thread, since the story would depend on them having left Earth already and we want this mod to be independent of NV quests.

 

As far as a overall location, I wouldn't mind TrooperScooper's suggestion of a volcano. The crater/basin shape fits, and dead lava tunnels would provide an underground element. In fact I was wondering whether it would be more sensible to build the monorail below ground. This would avoid all the topside dangers and add a "basement/station" level to every dome. I'm not too hot on the idea of active lava though. Terrible I know... seriously though, I think a lot of people will be like "lava? On Mars? Wuuu?". Plus there's not really a lava dynamic in the CK that we can use.

As for the Aliens, whilst I love the idea of grubs and broodmothers (I really do, it'd be awesome), I think for this mod we'll have to stick with an offshoot of the Zeta aliens as they're the ones the enclave got their tech off. Grubs could still be on the menu though! Dogtown1 came up with a great larvae creature, which is basically the modified backside of an ant queen and it looks awesome. You can see it here:

skip to 6:30 for the grub. I think a few critters would develop tunneling abilities to escape Mar's harsh surface conditions.

 

Edit: You're right Devin, I don't think the DLCs have anything we really need. Are the scientist suits in OWB in the vanilla game though? Because they're the one thing that fits perfectly for 50s space scrubs.

[devinpatterson]

As far as a overall location, I wouldn't mind TrooperScooper's suggestion of a volcano. The crater/basin shape fits, and dead lava tunnels would provide an underground element.

 

I think it's do-able if we go with the general scientific consensus that geologically Mars is dead or very quite in re: to volcanism, at least for the last 2 or 3 thousand years (although preferably a few million would be better). Just so we don't have to worry about explaining why the aliens were stupid enough to build on a active volcano. Apparently a big part of the reason for that belief in a dead world is the lack of a magnetic field indicating Mars' core solidified long ago, but as those two links I posted a while back show, it's not definitely determined. But with that scenario we have our lava tunnels and no volcanic worries.

 

In fact I was wondering whether it would be more sensible to build the monorail below ground. This would avoid all the topside dangers and add a "basement/station" level to every dome.

 

If they also used the lava tunnels that would lead credence to the plan (won't cost a lot more to construct since youv already had the digging done for you). Also on the monorail idea I'v been digging around (just for a bit, havn't had time to really get into it) about that metro cut scene. One thread I ran across said it was a type of armor equipped to the player, which is......interesting. But I suspect doing something like that would be easier underground. Then we could have a segment where you get to run over monstrosities....always a lot of fun.

 

As for the Aliens, whilst I love the idea of grubs and broodmothers (I really do, it'd be awesome),

 

I missed that post

 

Are the scientist suits in OWB in the vanilla game though? Because they're the one thing that fits perfectly for 50s space scrubs.

 

I really gave them very little notice (think I just kept the corrosive glove) when I played. I did a quick look on the vault wiki and the vanilla lab coats are the typical 1950's scientist outfit. They look like this;

 

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090604124318/fallout/images/3/3b/Scientist_Outfit.png

 

The OWB scrubs don't seem to have a vanilla conterpart, they look like this;

 

http://images.wikia.com/fallout/images/8/8a/Scientist_scrubs.png

 

 

OK guys I am out of here, catch you tomorrow.

[kibblesticks]

I just thought it'd fit well with simple, geometric designs like the staple 50s sci-fi uniform. Like this. Can easily find a replacement though,

[VaultPi]

femember that the gravity is different and the space bar will be quite different in effect...

[kibblesticks]

femember that the gravity is different and the space bar will be quite different in effect...

 

Think the best option is to say that the space suits are specifically designed to counteract the change in gravity or something. Level design is going to have some real knotty problems if the player can go bouncing all over the shop :tongue:

[greenknightfury]

I like the idea of all the lava tubes and such, adds the underground elements which allow for things like the Morlocks and the GECK cavern test/mutant GECK accident we talked about earlier in the thread. Also adds a good way for the GECK and FEV creatures to be getting into the domes if we do put the monorail underground, they simple come from connected passages that lead to different parts of the surface/the underground GECK site. Also allows for easy connection of areas cut off by devastation of the Chinese attack.

 

I'd vote either way with the use of DLC content honestly, there are some really great things in the DLC's but if you want to make it available to all by recreating the stuff instead of using the DLC files I'm cool with it.

 

Btw: I'm actually replaying FO3 atm and doing Zeta *chuckles* turns out I was confusing two different notes one on the supermutants and one on the Abominations (there is even a voice recording where you hear one abductee talking to her husband who was transformed into an Abomination by the aliens). Also had an interesting idea....what if deep in the alien ruins is a small group of abductees? As shown by the little girl in Zeta the aliens seem to be able to make humans immortal by stopping their aging so it is possible that some of the subjects were still alive deep within in a sealed portion of the ruins.

[greenknightfury]

BTW what is your opinion of additional locations outside the crater/main base? I feel like we are limiting ourselves somewhat by not including them.

 

I for one would vote for the Chinese crater/base definitely, and had and idea that you guys might enjoy with a separate area that was discovered so they set up a small research dome to investigate: A separate set of alien ruins that obviously wasn't Zeta alien in origin! Thinking a very villa or temple-like design up above but leading down into a city built underground, either Vault like or a city built in a cave. They sealed the underground portion with an airlock to allow easier exploration of the city, planning on doming the entire surface structure later.

 

My vision of the place is very simple, pretty much a cliff dweller city of simple buildings and scattered regular living items, maybe some primitive clothing/weapons and lots of mysterious wall paintings and writing. Along with whatever tech the science team brought down to study it.

 

If we want to avoid the "there was life on Mars" thing though we go with a very different from Zeta aliens techy structure, I'm thinking more along the lines of classic scifi writers that created a world that eerily parallels our own: Computers you could recognize as such, but with subtle differences (like say the screen and writing are different colors from the normal consoles if possible, the casing is a different color or it's set directly into the wall), vending machines that produce things like the DM ones that came from Big Mt (why there were none of them at Big Mt always confused me) clothing and gear that would all work for a human, but images on the walls and holograms of something just not quite human (four eyes, scaly/furry skin, weird headgrowths, really anything for a very humanoid alien that obviously wasn't human).

 

Either way notes at the site (journal entries, console messages) talk about weird things, haunting like effects and hallucinations, which the player soon encounters. Whether it is a haunting or is some weird alien telepathy device I leave up to you guys to decide. *chuckles evilly*

[TrooperScooperMKII]

OWB is the only one that I see as worthwhile, IMO. As you mentioned Devin, the laser tripwire trap and script, plus all of the sci-fi elements would all work well with the concept. There are also growth crystals, IIRC.

There are plenty of smaller volcanoes in the Tharsis plateau, it's like a quarter of the planet, so craters, gashes etc. are there aplenty.

The lava tube subway sounds like the way to go. Maybe the "elevated" train tracks from OWB can be lain across the tunnel interiors?