Anyone for a trip to mars?

[TrooperScooperMKII]

Sociopathy means the lack of emotions IIRC, so as you said, they don't enjoy suffering (or anything else) so much as maybe have a mild amusement over sucg things or a rush with getting away with stuff and an obsession with instant gratification etc. Also no fear of punishment necessarily, only a cold self-preservation (if that) so a particularly strong/perceptive player could, presumably, try to keep her in line somehow as long as it's very direct and inescapable... at least in the "I'll shoot you if you don't do as I say" & having a shock/kill collar linked up so if you die, she dies too.

It would be an interesting exercise in morality, eg. is going to such extremes to "tame" a ruthless killer justified, if it works?

 

Also, I'm suggesting that she wouldn't be a full-on sociopath, eg. she'd have emotions and some sense of morality, however shallow/warped and loose that might be. More of a broken bird or rabid dog (albeit very, very subtle) than a ruthless killing machine.

The clones, on the other hand...

[devinpatterson]

I definitely am beginning to lean more towards the idea of just clones, it just feels better in my head.

 

In a vault environment, I think we have a *lot* more potential quest lines and they can be more subtle......allowing a greater focus on the story.

 

And we can easily fold our original idea into the vault smoothly. I figure the (or one of the) endgame quest(s) for the Sherrys is the cloning chamber and mainframe.

 

The idea of a Vault full of them stratified by the traits purposely brought out by the mainframe (and the variation within those specialties due to cloning error) is awesome, and also allows for some definite humor and tension opportunities.

 

In that case let's take it a little further and let the computer actually manipulate the traits to a greater degree, organize/pacify the society and culture, etc. Holding a much more centralized authority in the Sherrys little world. We could also throw in a little bit of the paranoia RPG's black humor (they have a lot in common with some aspects of fallout, like their fear of the "Reds") and constant issues of sedition.

 

And the computer could very well be right. Maybe there is a small group of Sherry "Rebels", working under the radar (they are after all very intelligent). The player could have the choice of "weeding" out the rebels or defeating the mainframe and the overseer, depending on the players whim and characters karma.

 

The mainframe could acquire a god like/oracle status (and overseer high priestess) since it's the source of all of the Sherrys lives/race and would appear to be omniscient with it's vast store of knowledge. This could tie in with the following ideas.

 

We know the Sherrys are here for two reasons. 1.A genetic rarity, some 1 in a million combination of RNA enzymes re-agents, chromosomal structure (insert your own techno-babble here) etc that allows a viable cloning procedure. 2. She's highly capable. Both of these would be gold for the Enclave. Their whole strategy is to essentially bring everyone down, then emerge with superior tech/resources to rule the world (or if uninhabitable, another world).

 

If your a trek fan this can be a fusion of two stories. One was the for I have touched the sky, where a colony ship (hollow asteroid) was controlled by a mainframe. The 2nd (which I can't remember the title for) was a mainframe with a human imprint AI that kept order and accord (except for a rare festival where everyone went crazy), in a old west tech level planet.

 

I think both apply Trek stories apply, the first because the clones are so perfect for a enclave colony ship scenario. The plan B for the enclave (if earth was uninhabitable) was to gather vault dwellers (now sanctioned as gov prop) and go off world. Unfortunately for the enclave, the apocalypse came before they were ready. But the plan could go like this; Frozen clone embryos could sustain high g's (probably 3 or 4 maybe 5 or 6) resulting in a ship that could be sent ahead to a habitable planet where they could setup everything for the slower Enclave ship. The Sherry embryos awake 18 or 20 years (less if they use growth hormones) ship time (relativistic time comes into play here) before planet fall, or after reaching the planet and while in orbit. They'd be trained and ready to go when they touched alien soil.

 

The clones would setup and construct everything the enclave would need in their alien world. Since they would be able to travel at much higher G's (depending on the distance of the planet) the clones could have decades or even centuries before the enclave would arrive. Who knows just how much they could accomplish in that time, maybe a whole city or cities.

 

For the occupants (captains of industry, shadow gov etc) of the enclave ship the trip would only take years, due to relativistic time dilation. But when they exited the ship the trappings for a whole city/civilization (in good old retro 50's style fallout )would be waiting for them on the alien planet.

 

Project Orion is completely do-able with fallout tech (heck it might even be manageable our tech level, give the resources and motivation). I'd guess at the cost of 5-10 vaults.

http://i1066.photobucket.com/albums/u404/devinlpatterson/b2899a6c.jpg

 

But if your life depends on the thralls you send ahead, you have to be sure you can control and depend on them, as well as being sure they are capable. The catch 22 is that highly intelligent and capable people aren't aren't exactly sheepple. This is where our Sherry vault could come into play. People are composed of a practically infinite number of variables. But if you work with clones those variables suddenly shrink by orders of magnitude. Our vault could be an experiment to control the Sherrys through societal pressures, C.O.D.E, possibly drugs in the food/water/air etc. All a dry run to test the clones before they are put into service. It was never intended to run this long, but will just be kept going until the program is terminated.

 

This is also where the 2nd Trek scenario I mentioned comes in, The Return of the Archons. The culture of the planet (former survivors of an early federation shipwreck), is "quiescent, with no creative tendencies. The entire culture is controlled by a group of 'lawgivers'... in turn, controlled by the omniscient Landru". Landru would be the part played by our mainframe or alternately the overseer. They also rely heavily on the idea of "the body" as a collective good for the society. They have rebels as well and a "festival". The festival is one day(?) where all bets are off (violence, theft, sexual impropriety etc, anything goes)...I guess as a sort of pressure valve. The story kind of reminds me of a sci-fi Morman scenario (since they dont' have any vices). This gives us a little more detail on how to set up the vault life and a fun little mini-quest when the festival arrives.

 

But I think all of this could fit together really well both as far as a back story and a multi-threaded quest/adventure.

 

Especially with a "bad clone" scenario where the figuring out of "who done it" would develop as narrowing down to tiny diferrences, or entire cases of frame jobs done by just using something you weren't autotrained for to preform the crime "She was beaten to death with a wrench..must be one of the maintenance crew!"

 

Couldn't agree more, and we get to challenge the player in a way that is all too uncommon in the game.

 

When I read this all I could think was "Sounds like any action hero....James Bond especially."

 

I think the primary difference is motivation. A sociopath does what he/she does for personal gain/gratification. Typically a hero (even a dark hero), does what he or she does to safeguard/avenge others (ie Bond for queen and country).

 

Love the idea of Karma based companions.

 

It could definitely be fun, especially if we can differentiate the dialog to really give the impression of separate characters based on their morals.....but still retain the "Sherry" culture/mindset.

 

Also if everyone's ok with this, I thought a reduced/cut down version (smaller vault, Sherrys can't re recruited yet etc) of the Sherrys vault should be in the demo mod. I think it is really capturing the kind of story I want the Mars project mod to tell. It won't be the only part of the demo, I want to include trauma harness power armor battles in the martian wastelands and at least a small segment of the FEV horrors as well (where the player can meet, but not hire Troopers Mk V shared robobrain).

 

This whole weekend I was switching over my panasonic cordless phones and landline, to droids on wifi and VOIP (google voice to tie all the voicemail together, free minutes, sms etc on all the phones.....and heck even the most basic android phone is way ahead of the most advanced cordless phones). Nothing but net baby :thumbsup:

 

If you guys need a cheap phone check out cowboom. I went with the Droid X since they have it for $69. Decent sized screen (4.3"), 1Ghz cpu etc. A little older but a lot of custom roms and other hacks.

 

But anyway, the upshot is, I didn't get jack done. I'll try to work on the half-life HEV Suit (modified combat armor) tonight. Probably mostly just a re-texture, but I may tweak the mesh a little. Also been hankering to do some trauma harness power armors. Exposed mummified skulls, blown off limbs, etc....what's not to love.

 

 

 

I WILL do the voices for this mod, but I don't know about naming them Mary, like Devin says.

 

By the way, I'm Mary.

 

No worries, it's just a tip of the hat for your help. But they can really be named anything that rhymes with Gary (as a homage to our favorite psychotic clones in vault 108).

[devinpatterson]

Sociopathy means the lack of emotions IIRC

 

Actually this is my fault for using in precise terms. When I took psych it (sociopath) was classified under Anti-social behavior. But apparently these days it's somewhat less precise and can mean Antisocial personality disorder and Psychopathy (what your referring to in "lack of affect" shallow emotions etc.

 

I intended to paint her as ASPD with;

Callous unconcern for the feelings of others.

Gross and persistent attitude of irresponsibility and disregard for social norms, rules, and obligations.

Incapacity to maintain enduring relationships, though having no difficulty in establishing them.

Very low tolerance to frustration and a low threshold for discharge of aggression, including violence.

Incapacity to experience guilt or to profit from experience, particularly punishment.

Markedly prone to blame others or to offer plausible rationalizations for the behavior that has brought the person into conflict with society.

 

in addition to those fun little tidbits, there may be persistent irritability as an associated feature.....as a sort of cherry on top of the sociopathic sundae;

 

 

I definitely see her as having very strong emotions (like Roy Batty, the original and his android copy).

 

Also no fear of punishment necessarily, only a cold self-preservation (if that) so a particularly strong/perceptive player could, presumably, try to keep her in line somehow as long as it's very direct and inescapable... at least in the "I'll shoot you if you don't do as I say" & having a shock/kill collar linked up so if you die, she dies too.

 

Definitely, especially if it's in her self-interest and a question of her survival.

 

Plus they have cognitive therapies that help a sociopath integrate into society despite the lack of empathy and other short comings. Plus it's always possible that if Sherry was able to make a genuine human link with some else it could alter her behavior.

 

It would be an interesting exercise in morality, eg. is going to such extremes to "tame" a ruthless killer justified, if it works?

 

Absolutely. Lots of potentially rich character interaction there.

 

Also, I'm suggesting that she wouldn't be a full-on sociopath, eg. she'd have emotions and some sense of morality, however shallow/warped and loose that might be. More of a broken bird or rabid dog (albeit very, very subtle) than a ruthless killing machine.

The clones, on the other hand...

 

Sure we could make her "diagnosis" somewhat murky and influenced by the players dialog/quest choices, karma etc. Bringing out the best or worst in her.

 

I believe the same could be said of the clones, the potential to vary to some degree for better or worst. Kind of like how Batty's copy learned empath at the end of bladerunner. He had to die to do it, but it shows it's possible (and maybe possible for the original Batty as well).

[devinpatterson]

And we should have other clone info as well. Some entries referenceing Gary as well as lots of material on previous failures and inherent psychopatholgies of the existing strain(s). Maybe other "inferior" clones in our storyline. Maybe Carries. The process works due to Carry's unique genome, but she's nothing special (average in most every way) so she becomes the Sherrys underclass. Stuff like that.

[TrooperScooperMKII]

Just want to clarify: are we going with the two settlements (Vault City and Scrap City) holding 98% of the non-hostile people (and 100% of the "people" e.g. humans), and/or the odd 3 man survivalist ghoul/robot/mutant band here or there, but most everything wants to kill you, including the morlock colony (?) underground...

could lead to a twin civilization-wilderness dichotomy: above ground, we have the dome and the jungle; below ground, there's the vault city and the morlock things.

[marioperson]

This mod, WOULD BE EPIC,

 

 

You should add weird armor like alien head where you wear a aliens head, from a body you collected, and it makes you regerate health!

[devinpatterson]

This mod, WOULD BE EPIC,

 

 

You should add weird armor like alien head where you wear a aliens head, from a body you collected, and it makes you regerate health!

 

I don't think we could really do a alien head, since it'd be hard to swing the lore for that kind of organ transplant. But maybe a mask if you have the cannibal perk (simply because you'd have to be pretty messed up in the head to do this, ie Hannibal Lecter level messed up) and don't mind the mess.

 

But I was playing around with an idea you might like. The aliens will probably only show up in one encounter (if at all), in cryo pods, mostly the mod focuses 99.9% on their tech. But they would have a alien-human hybridization lab. And if the player was to make a error in judgment or wasn't fast enough teh drones or alien auto docs could throw him/her into a hybridization pod. This could kill our player, but I think it might be more interesting if it changed him/her into a hybrid, ala monster costume style. You wouldn't be able to wear any armor (since the alien hybrid costume *is* armor), but you could still use normal weapons, maybe hats too, since I'd rig it to a human skeleton. And of course there would be bonuses to strength, and endurance, but probably penalties to other attributes (especially Charisma, they'r not exactly a handsome species).

 

Then a mini quest would start to restore yourself.

[marioperson]

This mod, WOULD BE EPIC,

 

 

You should add weird armor like alien head where you wear a aliens head, from a body you collected, and it makes you regerate health!

 

I don't think we could really do a alien head, since it'd be hard to swing the lore for that kind of organ transplant. But maybe a mask if you have the cannibal perk (simply because you'd have to be pretty messed up in the head to do this, ie Hannibal Lecter level messed up) and don't mind the mess.

 

But I was playing around with an idea you might like. The aliens will probably only show up in one encounter (if at all), in cryo pods, mostly the mod focuses 99.9% on their tech. But they would have a alien-human hybridization lab. And if the player was to make a error in judgment or wasn't fast enough teh drones or alien auto docs could throw him/her into a hybridization pod. This could kill our player, but I think it might be more interesting if it changed him/her into a hybrid, ala monster costume style. You wouldn't be able to wear any armor (since the alien hybrid costume *is* armor), but you could still use normal weapons, maybe hats too, since I'd rig it to a human skeleton. And of course there would be bonuses to strength, and endurance, but probably penalties to other attributes (especially Charisma, they'r not exactly a handsome species).

 

Then a mini quest would start to restore yourself.

 

LOL, I meant a mask, yes, :P

[devinpatterson]

Just want to clarify: are we going with the two settlements (Vault City and Scrap City) holding 98% of the non-hostile people (and 100% of the "people" e.g. humans), and/or the odd 3 man survivalist ghoul/robot/mutant band here or there, but most everything wants to kill you, including the morlock colony (?) underground...

could lead to a twin civilization-wilderness dichotomy: above ground, we have the dome and the jungle; below ground, there's the vault city and the morlock things.

 

I'd prefer the latter where everything is trying to kill you. I'd like the mars mod to be high level, where you have to be a badas* just to have a slim chance of surviving. I just don't see normal humans making it, it's too harsh an environment. Anything alive/functioning should be only because it's par for the course in toughness and sheer badas*ness. So I'm not partial to the scrap city per se. But the Sherrys/Carrys/Marys were sealed in a vault so they'r not a problem.

 

If I remember right you guys were partial to it (scrap city) and in general more humans having survived thoughout the project.

 

But I suspect what will actually happen, is the question your asking will be answered by the ideas we come up with for encounters. Ie. if you come up with great ideas for a scrap city it will be hard not to include it.

[TrooperScooperMKII]

Your suggestion of a scrap city in the agri-dome really seemed perfect. Yes, I'm definitely pushing for two "cities" in that sense, partly because having a small number of survivors strikes me as a bit unrealistic- eg. what's stopping them from being over-run or wiping each other out- and partly for the change in scenery and generally believing two to be far better than one in most situations.

At the least it allows a contrast and a choice, so to speak.