Tempted to play on master difficulty as a mage but...

[afx777]

After completing the main quest yesterday and the majority of others in game on adept difficulty with my sneaky ranger/thief character, I thought about starting a mage on master difficulty but have a few questions.

 

1) Should I stick with a designated caster type robe or use light or heavy armour for a mage type character?

2) Does wearing light or heavy armour impede a caster character in some way?

3) What are the advisable skills and perks to level/use if playing on master difficulty?

4) Is there a FAQ or a guide for playing on master difficulty?

5) I am jumping too far ahead by playing with a caster/mage character on master difficulty?

 

Cheers, afx.

Edited December 10, 2011 by afx777

[xorchan]

Just going to spoil it for you, “Master” difficulty isn't really harder than “Adept”. In fact, there's hardly a difference between “Novice” and “Master”. Don't set your expectations too high, or you'll end up doing a lot of planning only to realize the game is easy as pie.

 

That being said,

 

1. Doesn't matter, there's no spell effectiveness. The only difference is the enchantment. Robes often have useful enchants like +75% Magicka Regeneration, so it makes sense to use them until your Enchanting is high enough to make decent armor enchantments.

 

2. No. The only difference is perks like the one in Alteration which gives you extra armor rating if you're wearing all cloth, but other than that there's no real difference.

 

3. Doesn't matter, just pump Destruction and Restoration. I advise getting Alchemy and Enchanting also, and Smithing is a must-have if you're wearing armor. Fortunately, smithing is easy as pie to level.

 

4. None that I know of, but it basically sums up to “kill, don't get killed”.

 

5. No

[Vallen87]

Just going to spoil it for you, “Master” difficulty isn't really harder than “Adept”. In fact, there's hardly a difference between “Novice” and “Master”. Don't set your expectations too high, or you'll end up doing a lot of planning only to realize the game is easy as pie.

 

Not sure what game your playing but the one I am playing called Skyrim there is a massive difference lol. I assume like me, you are a veteran at the elder scrolls games and can easily roll through the game but to someone not that experienced, be fair, there is a massive difference. Once you hit level 5-6 on Master difficulty any enemy with a 2 handed weapon will almost 1 hit kill you with a power attack. Sure if you play as an assassin type with a bow and 100 sneak you could roll your face on the keyboard and win but not as a first time pure mage.

 

The guy above is just a sneak abusing archer who prob used enchanting hacks to get a 5000 damage weapon :D I would disregard his post. If this is your first time on master difficulty or playing as a pure mage you will strugle for sure, don't worry about that. It will be quite exciting :D Also far more rewarding

 

 

Will try to answer as best I can from ES experience :D

 

1. You could do either, but in my opinion if you will be playing with a robe I would take heavy armour for boots and gauntlets to get as much as armour as possible from only 2 pieces.

 

2. Nope not at all, the only way it could- at the start would be it will be very difficult to get a good + magicka regen% piece of armour. Most of the starter robes will have +50% regen which will help and the hoods have +30/40/50 magicka. The only way armour will impede you will be that you cant benefit from these enchantments until you get end game items or high level enchanting.

 

3. Illusion is great for dealing with multiple enemies, hit one with fury and he will attack the others then you just go in and finish off the survivors. My advice would be to max out Illusion (IMO best caster spells in game for higher dificulties) I would mainly spec into Illusion and Conjuration with some points into Destruction.

 

4. http://www.rpgcodex.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=66665 Is a decent thread, its not so much a guide as players feedback on Master difficulties. They give some tips and tricks from their own experiences.

 

5. I wouldn't think so, so long as you go into it with the right attitude (which you are) this will be considerably harder than your last run. Sneaky ranger types are already the easiest types to play so you have a double whammy of a harder class and harder difficulty. Take it slowly and use all the spells available to you, don't just try to dual cast flames and be surprised when the enemies are smashing you around.

 

The mistake that most people make with mages is all the see is Destruction, Destruction, Destruction.. BURN THEM WITH FIRE!!! That's fine at the very start or super endgame when your spells are really powerful, at the start as I said before, Illusion is the go to for a successful mage.

 

Mage has just gotta play smarter than a thief character, pick your battles :) Draugr can be difficult as they resist fury so try to fight 1 at a time. For your destruction spells I would stick to fire. Frost and shock damage fatigue and magicka but enemies seem to have unlimited of both so that's a waste. Too many enemies are resistant to frost since its up in Skyrim so I would avoid frost damage like the plague. Shock is ok but Fire IMO is the best.

Edited December 10, 2011 by Vallen87

[xorchan]

@Vallen87: I've now played a sneaky thief, a squishy pure mage, a one handed warrior and a Khajit unarmed monk all on Master and I wouldn't call any of them particularly challenging. I'm also not a veteran to the series - I never played Morrowind, and played Oblivion at a low difficulty.

 

Melee chars are basically a joke since you can nearly always dodge. (The hardest to dodge are those dual wielding Redguards, it takes about 5 minutes to kite Kematu around while slowly killing his bodyguards)

 

Oh, and be careful around dual wielding enemies. Fortunately, their animation is very slow so you can generally avoid all of their power attacks.

 

Casters are only a problem at first but very soon you can start stacking resists, if you're playing a Nord and stack 33% fire/lightning resist enchantments you're basically immune to stuff like dragon breath. One advice I have is to go around collecting all the Snowberries you can find, they have Resist Fire, Resist Frost, Resist Lightning *and* Fortify Enchanting on them - after a good stroll around the snowy northern regions you should have a few dozen of them and along with others like purple mountain flower you can make dozens of resist potions. Ice wraith essence is also pretty common if you know where to farm them. Add the Lord stone (25% magic resist) on top of that and you're a walking sponge.

 

Archers are a joke since arrows are so slow you can easily dodge them.

 

Oh and yes, fire damage is good since it's the most mana efficient generally - especially at the beginning of the game you can just cast Flames for a split second to ignite the enemy and recast it whenever he stops burning, the DoT ticks a lot of damage so you can kill an enemy without even losing mana in the best scenarios.

Edited December 10, 2011 by xorchan

[XunAmarox]

After level 25, mage damage no longer increases whatsoever. Spell damage does not scale. The damage scale is like this:

 

0  20 40 60 80 character level
|  |  |  |  |
   _________
 /
/
/

 

Master spells are weak and slow, easily interruptable and generally worthless for the most part.

 

As such, mage isn't very good after level 25 or so. If you're on PC there's workarounds for this, but you're out of luck on consoles. Try typing this in console on PC:

 

playerenchantobject 877ca 3eb26

(you can do two enchants... it's item baseid, enchant, enchant)

 

3ebxx...

26 = desro spells (enchant level% stronger)

25 = conjuration last longer

27 = illusion stronger

28 restoration stronger

24 alteration longer

23 haggle is % easier

22 harder tod etect

21 lockpicking

19 1 handed

18 potions % stronger

 

Here's a nice page for reference/ease of use: http://skyrim.mmo-game.eu/enchanting-items-console/

 

Here's an example just to prove it works:

http://i.minus.com/izAOXLaewxgAL.jpg

 

Here's a more extreme example (player.modav enchanting 485 first - from base 15, that is):

http://i.minus.com/iQHf8Y5WYQVeh.jpg

 

Obviously you'd want to use this sparingly and try to keep it balanced in your game most likely, but once you get that high you will probably want it.

 

On a side note, investing is magicka is completely useless and you should not do it. Instead, invest in cast reduction gear. You can get your casts down to near zero, or zero, so magicka will not be a needed attribute. The base cost scales with the reduction so if something that would have taken 1800 magicka to cast was reduced by 90%, it'd only take 160 or so to cast. But just by doing the full 100 tree, and with a robe with a destruction cost reduction you'll likely have even higher reduction and maybe even 100% reduction so 0 cast cost. So, invest in health. You're likely wearing really weak armor, so the extra health will help when you do get hit.

Edited December 10, 2011 by XunAmarox

[TresBlah]

@ xorchan

 

i'm not sure what game you played either, and i don't think you played as a mage on master difficulty, and i'm sure if you actually did ply it at master, you didn't get past let's say lvl 25ish

 

It's not hard per se, defense ain't that much of a problem (yaaaaay stagger -.-) except in some situations, but the whole game gets to be just terribly boring, because your damage spells will just plainly suck, and you'll need a crapton of casts to mow down a mob. Atronachs damage is pitiful, dremora lord hits hard but so painfully slow i want to tear my hair away.

 

Basically the game as a mage at master difficulty sums up into an endless dual cast + stagger destruction spells while your conjured creatures tickle them, chugging down potions like there's no tomorrow (or exploiting enchanting and getting free cast) because even with archmage+morokei you'll just need so many frigging fireballs/chain lightning/incinerate/whatever to kill any non-absolute-scrub enemy you'll fall asleep at the keyboard.

 

 

If you want a fun play at master, go warrior, and keep your crafting skills no higher than 2/3 of your main fighting skill, that makes the game more interesting ;)

Edited December 10, 2011 by TresBlah

[afx777]

Thanks for the interesting posts guys, though conflicting obviously! lol :biggrin: - I'll start a new mage on master difficulty later today and see how I cope.

 

I'm not really a pro in Elder Scrolls games, so despite some people saying "master difficulty is not much of a challenge", it might be to me initially plus no doubt there's a learning curve.

 

Edit - Plus I'm not much of a fan of exploits and speed levelling skills.

 

@Xunamarox - So health is the main attribute I should level, should I put anything into magicka and stamina at all?

 

@Vallen87 - Great post, thanks and kudos! :thumbsup:

Edited December 10, 2011 by afx777

[sarnz]

Are there any kill-shot animations for mage spells? That's my favorite part about my two handed warrior is that they cue all the time, and they are sweet. Nothing better than jumping onto a dragon and smashing his face in with a hammer

[crudius]

funnily enough i started my first master char today...though not a mage

 

Going predominantly two handed with good armour and block and a sprinkle of destro/restro....following the stormcloak storyline.

Been playing two other chars on expert for a while, and have to say i agree with the guy who says its not really a bit jump in difficulty....held my own suprisingly well.

 

Just to spice up this run, im also not FT and taking advantage of the carts that travel between cities and a lot of walking. just for emmersion.

Holding back on high smith/enchats till later down the storyline and going with perk trees for alteration and illusion and heavy alchemy, mainly because i have'nt leaned on those skills too heavy in the past (ob).

 

Good luck mage, and may your travels be eventful.

[Matth85]

1) Should I stick with a designated caster type robe or use light or heavy armour for a mage type character?

 

Depends if you are going to exploit or now. If you do not, it is best to use robes for the enchants and use Alteration to get your defense up in battles.

If you plan to exploit, just get any armor and get 100% less destruction mana cost. Which makes the game faceroll, by the way.

 

2) Does wearing light or heavy armour impede a caster character in some way?

Directly? No.

However, robes got the enchants you want and you get the full beenfir of the Alteration perk to improve the defense spells.

 

3) What are the advisable skills and perks to level/use if playing on master difficulty?

Easy: Get almost everything in destruction, choosing 1 spell you focus on ( fire, hopefully). Choose the left side of the conjuration tree. Then get the mana perk inside Restoration. Rest goes into whatever you want. Exploiters uses Alchemy/Enchanting/SMithing, other uses Speech and whatnot.

Harder: Get about everything in Alteration, which is your armor. Now go hard in destruction, choosing the fire line. Second get the mana perk, and of course the less % perks, inside Restoration. Lastly Alchemy. Enchanting/smithing if you wish to exploit some. Rest is up to you.

 

4) Is there a FAQ or a guide for playing on master difficulty?

You don't really need any. It's very straight forward as a mage:

- Don't run into a bunch of Bandit Marauders head first. You are not a warrior, so you are not able to tank - before alteration is maxed. You will need to plan out. Cast your defense spell, cast your summon, ready your dual cast spell, hit the more dangerous target.

- Try to think before you spend a perk. The stagger-perk inside the destruction tree is worth more than anything inside the restoration tree, for instance. Save up perks, but never have more than 4 on you. Then it's fine to spend it on whatevs'.

- Choose if you wish to exploit. 100 enchanting and you can gain 25% less mana cost in X school per item, and you can choose 4. You can also enchant 2 things per item, so 2 school are now free. This makes the game a breeze, since you can simply spam expert level spells untill everything is dead.

- Fire spells on normal enmies. Frost spells on stuff/bosses that hits you, since you slow them down. Shock/Electric on casters, since a mage can just about 2-shot you at 40, unless you are a breton with the alteration perk.

 

5)

I am jumping too far ahead by playing with a caster/mage character on master difficulty?

My first character was a mage on Master. It's harder than the warrior, and a lot harder than the assassin/thief, but is fun! You got so much variety: Traps, Summons, make enemies attack each other, etc, etc.

There is a few spells missing that would make it even better: Open Lock and Levitate. Hoping that comes when the mods roll in!

 

Generally, there are 4 ways to play a mage:

 

1) Exploiting. Free destruction spells. You will hit like a truck. Using a copanion or summon is up to you.

2) Non-companion-destruction based-mage. You do not use companion, nor summons. Alteration and restoration is your defense, while destruction is your damage. Illusion for good measure!

3) Summoner caster. Easy, double Dremora Lord deals about the same damage as a non-exploted 2 handed warrior, and there are 2 of them. They start to lose power at 50+, but are still great!

4) Destruction based companion mage. You use companions as your tank. There is not really need for alteration. Pumping points into destruction, restoration and alchemy.

 

I've played 'em all!

1 gets boring too fast, since you simply spam out expert level spells untill the enemy is dead. Coupled with the fact you stagger whilst dual casting, it is not fun!

3 is my favourite. It is hard, challenging and you really need to use alchemy here. My preffered playstyle.

3 is fun. You reach 75 conjuration and you feel powerfull. You reach 100 and stuff dies too fast. I got bored way too quickly, since it was a very passive playstyle for me.

4 is, well, the same as 2, just with a tank. Meaning I rarely used Alteration. It is good if you are not feeling like running circles every single fight untill you get a good mana regen.

 

A few tips a long the way:

 

- Alchemy is your best crafting skill, unless you feel like getting less mana cost of a magic school with echanting. Potions to get up magicka, and + damage potions is awesome. Coupled with a bow with a "Takes X% more damage from fire" poison, and you can take down a dragon long before he sees you.

- Alteration is awesome. The shield will save you!

- Remember that fire spells does burn damage after the initiate hit. Use this in the start of the game, where your mana regen and mana pool is very shabby.

- High elf gives a godlike racial ability and got 50 more mana at start. However, will die about instantly against any high level mage. Bretons, on the other hand, gets a % absorb (?) magic racial, which is pure awesome with the alteration perk.

- Staffs are good. When you are out of magicka, a fireball staff can let you keep fighting for a while longer. Do not discard them, since having the abilty to fight and regain mana is invaluable to a mage.

- If a warrior with a 2 hander is running toward you, you hightail out of there.

- If a dragon lands near you, you better run away from melee-range. I have been hit by a finisher from a dragon at 100% health.

- Pump points into magicka, and magicka only. If you get to a point where you never get mana problems, you can get health.

- Learn to run in circles. I am not kidding. Having 0 mana in a fight is not rare, and you then have to run around untill you get more mana. A companion and a staff is nice to have at this point.

- Yes, I said earlier that you should only put points in magicka. You do not put points into health since you do not need it. You aim to have enough firepower to kill off what you have, live a few hits with ALteration sells, and heal up with restoration. You are not a tank, you are a mage.

- To avoid too much stress get a companion and a dog.

- Don't forget shouts! Unrelenting Force can give you the second you need to throw the last fireball, or slowing time can give you the last second you needed to survive that dragon breath.

- Conjurating weapons, preferabbly a bow, is a good way to spend your last mana. Unless you got a staff. Consider it.

- 100 conjuration mages can have some fun: 2 summons that last infinite, a companion and a dog. 4 allies at your side! * Not tested really, just notced that the master spells becomes companions/last infinite.

 

I believe that's it.

 

Cheers,

Matth