TimF Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 I'd give him credit for a nice mantle of his I like to wear as a mage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimalMight1 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I actually support the Stormcloaks for many reasons. 1) The duel between him and the high king WAS legitimate. While the Empire doesn't want to accept that fact or not is not the concern. 2) Skyrim puts many similarities between actual well Asatru and the Nords. We can easily draw a parallel between Galdr and the Voice. <this ties into 3>3) The voice is something that well came from Dragons but well is accepted by Nords. Its something that is ingrained in their culture and to that end acceptable in a duel. In a life or death duel for superiority one uses whatever they can not explicitly stated to be illegal.4) The Thalmor wants the civil war to last as long as possible. They don't want Ulfric to win that is just moronic. Ulfric wins there is a unified Skyrim. If he loses there is a unified Skyrim. That is why Alduin freed Ulfric in the beginning they want the war to last as long as possible.5) The Redguards managed to fight for their own independence and actually win against the Thalmor is a free Skyrim so hard to believe they can't do what the Redguards did. The Empire they bowed down but the Stormcloaks refused to bow down to the aggressors and they stand by religious freedom. I seem to not be able to NOT join the stormcloaks as well how the start of the game goes who would ever not leave with Ralok? Sorry but leaving with the people who intended to cut my head off is not on the top of my priorities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linsolv Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I don't know if you read this thread but everything you said (with the exception of 2) was already thoroughly discussed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sky999 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) When looking at the Alik'r agents during the quest found in Whiterun, I noticed a distinct lack of 'diversity' in their group, they were all Redguards bizarrely, which is amazing I know since they come from Hammerfell, so I wasn't that miffed when I saw that the Stormcloaks were made up of Nords, it made sense seeing as they're in Skyrim... I imagine the Argonian cities in Blackmarch and their armies in Morrowind aren't exactly overrun with men and elves either... I just couldn't help seeing the Empire as having run it's course, I didn't like the fact that the Dark Elves and Argonians were confined to different quarters, but a united front is needed to stop the Thalmor, in my opinion, and it never looked like the Empire was going to provide that front with all their running in circles, so Ulfric and the Stormcloaks could at least keep a simple dogma to their cause. Edited February 4, 2012 by Sky999 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribblesix Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I suspect the developers went out of their way to make the Stormcloaks unappealing (which they clearly did) was to ensure the majority of the player-base sided with the empire thus making the official end to the 'Syrim saga' easier to enforce. As an asside.. the 'racism' (should that be species) present in Skyrim is almost non existent by historical and indeed present day standards. I can think of almost no examples where 'outsiders' have been accorded all the rights of the insiders. If you came from the wrong place, wrong parents, where the wrong religious denomination your chances of owning property, not having your monies seized by the king, receiving any kind of legal protection or even getting married to a 'local' where all very low. Even today such attitudes are pervasive, I recall my Chinese business partners horrified face when he had to shake hands with a black man and the sympathetic look our staff gave him as he immediately scrubbed his hand clean with ethanol gel. Non nords in windhelm can, marry locals, buy property, receive legal protection and are not subject to punitive taxes or pogroms. despite the thalmor being on the top of everyone's hate list an ALtmer merchant was able to infiltrate the local nobility within a few years by dint of charm and persistence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terzho Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I don't think that was what the developers were going for......... Whilst Stormcloak players are still a minority, polls show that more than 33% of players play Stormcloaks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linsolv Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 I suspect the developers went out of their way to make the Stormcloaks unappealing (which they clearly did) was to ensure the majority of the player-base sided with the empire thus making the official end to the 'Syrim saga' easier to enforce. As an asside.. the 'racism' (should that be species) present in Skyrim is almost non existent by historical and indeed present day standards. I can think of almost no examples where 'outsiders' have been accorded all the rights of the insiders. If you came from the wrong place, wrong parents, where the wrong religious denomination your chances of owning property, not having your monies seized by the king, receiving any kind of legal protection or even getting married to a 'local' where all very low. Even today such attitudes are pervasive, I recall my Chinese business partners horrified face when he had to shake hands with a black man and the sympathetic look our staff gave him as he immediately scrubbed his hand clean with ethanol gel. Non nords in windhelm can, marry locals, buy property, receive legal protection and are not subject to punitive taxes or pogroms. despite the thalmor being on the top of everyone's hate list an ALtmer merchant was able to infiltrate the local nobility within a few years by dint of charm and persistence. It's almost a little offensive to me what passes for Racism in Skyrim. Oh no! We have a name for their area of the town! I'm really flabbergasted, to be honest, by the supposition that the dark elves in Windhelm are that bad, or even the Argonians. Khajiit are not allowed in cities. This is closer to real-life historical racism. The only thing they could do to make the situation worse for Khajiit is if they had a few NPCs who killed them for sport. But no, let's all talk about the dunmer problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fraquar Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Skyrim would be the modern day equivalent of aliens (i.e. Elves, Khajiit, Argonians, etc) coming to co-exist with humans - and one of those aliens just outlawed Christianity (or your religion of choice) to boot. Is it any wonder there is mistrust with the Nords? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linsolv Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Also, earlier in this thread someone mentioned that if you talk to the NPCs they say that it wasn't until the Stormcloak rebellion that the empire started to crack down on Talos worshippers. But that's not right. The only one I've found so far, someone said Hadvar, but it was Alvor his uncle. He said that 20 years ago nobody really took it seriously, but once Ulfric started agitating they had to crack down. Then he said that people being dragged off in the night was why the war started, which suggests to me that in fact they WERE taking it seriously before the war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagitel Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Khajiit are not allowed in citiesthere is like that in many cities because of so much thieves and skooma dealers within khajiits. and as i saw in thalmor embassy. i guess the empire is really weak now. besides racism i see nothing bad in ulfric. and even racism is what we see even in today's world. so nothing strange there. ulfric let elisif live. (and many would suggest that he even let her BE jarl. because if you join imperials you see general tulius dictates things to her.) at first when you enter palace of the kings you see him being concerned about and unnecessary battle near whiterun. about the crimes in markarth, forsworns weren't so innocent either! so that doesn't count. and if you talk with thalmor justicioners they act like they own tamriel and i really like to prove them wrong. these are the facts why i see ulfric as a great leader. p.s: ulfric did make a mistake by killing toryg. if you talk to the court mage in solitude you see that toryg adored ulfric and would join him in a fight against thalmor if he asked him to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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