Qwinn Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) Okay, but be aware, my fixpack will require starting a new game. I implement way too many new flags during the course of a game. Adding the fixpack halfway through, which will make the value of all these flags "FALSE" even if you previously performed the action that was supposed to set it to "TRUE", could break the game in uncountable ways. Anyway, I'm heading out for a few hours (I do have a life! I know, baffling but true). I'll repost this since it probably got lost in that last conversation: Ok, so I think I've got a cool idea for how to add these Oghren approval boosts in. The inspiration is actually the first dialogue you have with Oghren when you enter Caridin's Cross. Remember I said how "Great. Lead on and shut up." drops approval and nothing else improves it? Well, that "Lead on and shut up" option only appears after his first line, meaning, you're not interested in asking him any questions. You only get "Great. Let's go." to end the conversation after that, but you get it after every question you can ask. Now, I was about to just add a big boost to his final "I've been waiting for somebody to say that for two sodding years" line.... but I read Oghren like this: he's spent two years frustrated by no one caring what he has to say about anything. Instead of one big boost at the end, I'm going to give a small increment for each and every question you ask him during these interljections he makes on the way to Branka. So the amount of approval you get will vary widely - If you ask him every possible question during these, you'll get a nice big boost, and if you just skip through it as fast as you can, you'll get barely any at all. Oghren approves more than anything that you give a crap what he has to say, because no one else has for two sodding years. Sound good? Edited March 18, 2017 by Qwinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thandal Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 Sounds great! I find Oghren's story far more interesting than Alistair's, and he doesn't whinge as much. So perfectly willing to engage with him repeatedly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwinn Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) Okay, so here's what I've come to (EDIT: Updated due to revisions below). When first entering the Deep Roads at Caridin's Cross, maximum possible approval: +14When first entering Ortan Thaig, maximum possible approval: +14When discovering Branka's Journal: +12Talking to Oghren in the Deep Trenches after talking to Kardol (conversation restored by this Fixpack), maximum possible approval: +5During conversation with Branka, asking "How do you know I'm not just helping Oghren?": +4During conversation with Felsi for Oghren's personal quest, maximum possible approval: +23 (can also get -18 approval for sabotaging the conversation) That's if you do everything perfectly, ask all the right questions, don't ask any wrong questions. You'll get almost none of those boosts if you don't bother asking Oghren any questions when he speaks - the only one that is automatic is the boost for finding Branka's journal. Not EVERY question gets you a boost though - some can even lower it. That's 49 possible points you can earn by the time you find Branka. The number seems high, but I think the totals line up fairly well with how much approval you can get with other followers, especially given you can lose a fair chunk (-10) just by siding with Caridin. Do all that right, do his personal quest, plus a couple of gifts and you can still suffer some of Oghren's various approval drops around the world and friendly approval levels are still attainable. The other followers have sufficient approval boosts out there to get friendly levels without metagaming and just a couple of gifts and talking to them without being a total ass to them - Oghren now also falls under that category. EDIT: Lowered maximum possible from initial conversation from +20 to +14. Added possible +4 during conversation with Branka for saying "How do you know I'm not just helping Oghren?" The maximum approval added by the Fixpack by the end of convo with Branka is now 49. EDIT: The readme descriptions of these fixes are now as follows: 6. (v3.0) It is virtually impossible to raise Oghren's approval to Friendly levels (+76) unless you use Feastday gifts, infinite approval exploits (which I remove) or massive metagaming (and I'm not even sure the latter is sufficient to do it). The options for increasing his approval are extremely limited. For example, between recruiting Oghren and finding Branka, it is only possible to lose approval, not to gain it, even when eliciting lines from Oghren like "I've been waiting for someone to say that for two sodding years" and "My thoughts exactly.". Now, during the quest to find Branka, you will have opportunities to raise Oghren's approval considerably. 7. (v3.0) "Oghren's Old Flame": There is also no approval boost at all for actually completing Oghren's personal quest successfully, or any negative approval for making him look like a cowardly idiot in front of Felsi either. Oghren's approval can now rise or fall considerably depending on the options you pick during his conversation with Felsi. Edited March 18, 2017 by Qwinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwinn Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) 11. (v3.0) "Oghren's Old Flame": Completing Oghren's personal quest successfully yields the following journal entry: "After learning about what happened with Branka back in Orzammar, Felsi seems willing to forgive Oghren." Except there is no discussion of "what happened with Branka back in Orzammar" whatsoever in the dialogue with Felsi, in fact, it's revealed that that's not why she was upset in the first place. Removed the nonsensical reference to Branka from the closing journal entry. 12. (v3.0) Reordered some of Oghren's Friendly conversations... you should be a lot less likely to hear "I guess we're pretty good friends now, right?" after you hear "You're like family to me. Closest thing I've had in years." 13. (v3.0) Removed infinite Oghren approval exploit in Dwyn's dialogue - you can only call Dwyn a coward once now. Edited March 18, 2017 by Qwinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwinn Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) Looks like I *should* be able to make a positive fix for Oghren approval in Awakening. Apparently (and comically) the only thing about Oghren that *does* transfer to Awakening is the number of gifts he received during Origins - meaning, any gifts in Awakening will suffer diminishing returns for however many gifts were given in Origins. I should be able to set the number of gifts given to Oghren to 0 right before the end of Origins, which should stop that from happening. 14. (v3.0) Since Oghren's approval in Origins does not transfer to Awakening, the gifts given to Oghren in Origins will no longer cause diminishing returns in the approval granted by gifts given in Awakening. (Actually, can someone verify that this bug does actually happen in the PC version? I'm going off the Wiki on this that it actually happens. Not that the fix I'm implementing can do any harm even if it's not true, I'd just like to be sure a bug actually exists before I lay claim to fixing it.) Also, if you guys can think of other Awakening bugs that are explicitly caused by information that is imported from Origins, I may be able to do similar things to this fix, by tweaking the data right before the game ends. I will play through Awakening when I'm done and keep an eye out for those kinds of bugs. Bugs that are completely self contained within the Awakening DLC, I can't do anything about yet - or at least, if I can, I'm not sure how to yet. Edited March 18, 2017 by Qwinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwinn Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) 15. (v3.0) When sharing a drink with Oghren in the party camp, Leliana's legs will no longer block the camera. Found another stat check by the way! You need 30 constitution to not pass out from Oghren's booze. Edited March 18, 2017 by Qwinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squareinc Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 Hey, so this may be an irritating question, but any timeframe on release? Also, would you include the source scripts with the release? I've done some changes to some script files (such as the Hermit quest so that when you kill the Grand Oak you're given a special plot item werewolf pelt so you can't accidentally destroy it). I'd like to combine your fixes to the scripts i also changed so that it would be compatible :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwinn Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) If I can keep up the rate I've been going so far (which has been pretty relentless), I estimate it'll be about 10 weeks. Maybe sooner - the only companion left I really need to work on now is Zevran, and they take a lot of work to find all the bugs, as you just saw - but I also know I *still* have a lot of sound work to do fixing Alistair's dialogue re: Morrigan's ritual and becoming king. Not sure how long that will take, though I'm pretty confident at my ability to work with sounds efficiently and quickly now. And sure, send me a message telling me which files you're changing and I'll send you a detailed description of any changes I made to those files. Note: I have placed as many new flags as I can into a new plot and script called Qwinn.plo and Qwinn.nss. Whatever I send you will probably make reference to that script and plot. Not sure what the best way to handle those would be, you'll definitely have to make a new script and plot to add those flags and scripts to, just not sure if you should name them the same. Edited March 18, 2017 by Qwinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwinn Posted March 18, 2017 Share Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) So took a look at Zevran, fixed some of the easy and well known issues. Reprinting my one fix from previous fixpack versions since I just redid it... 1. (v2.0) If the PC is getting married, Zevran will now only talk about it in the party camp. If it took place outside of camp, it would cause game-stopping graphic glitches. 2. (v3.0) During the epilogue, a male warden romancing Zevran will no longer be referred to as "the woman he loved". 3. (v3.0) When Zevran thanks you for freeing him from the Crows, even if you were already in an active romance with him, you'd still get the option to say "I think of you as more than a friend." to which he replies that he had no idea you felt that way. 4. (v3.0) If you initially rejected Zevran's earring, then accepted it later, you wouldn't actually receive the earring in your inventory. 5. (v3.0) At Arl Eamon's estate, Zevran would only offer his non-romance dialogue even if a romance was active. 6. (v3.0) After completing Zevran's personal quest, if the player kisses Zevran, the flag making him eligible for Friendly/Love status was not being set properly. 7. (v3.0) In a number of dialogue paths, most importantly all those when you are forced to dump Zevran for someone else, the flag that was supposed to prevent a romance from restarting wasn't being set properly. 8. (v3.0) When Zevran asks what will happen when all this is over, the reply "I'm already quite fond of you" could incorrectly (re)initiate a romance with Zevran after one had been cut off permanently. That option will no longer appear in that circumstance. Edited March 19, 2017 by Qwinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squareinc Posted March 19, 2017 Share Posted March 19, 2017 If I can keep up the rate I've been going so far (which has been pretty relentless), I estimate it'll be about 10 weeks. Maybe sooner - the only companion left I really need to work on now is Zevran, and they take a lot of work to find all the bugs, as you just saw - but I also know I *still* have a lot of sound work to do fixing Alistair's dialogue re: Morrigan's ritual and becoming king. Not sure how long that will take, though I'm pretty confident at my ability to work with sounds efficiently and quickly now. And sure, send me a message telling me which files you're changing and I'll send you a detailed description of any changes I made to those files. Note: I have placed as many new flags as I can into a new plot and script called Qwinn.plo and Qwinn.nss. Whatever I send you will probably make reference to that script and plot. Not sure what the best way to handle those would be, you'll definitely have to make a new script and plot to add those flags and scripts to, just not sure if you should name them the same. Well usually the stuff I change isn't that far reaching so I often can just copy over the code of your fixes into the file and make my tweaks on top of that. My stuff are usually fixes as well, but never any intense fixes. I just get rid of some annoyances. The files I've so far edited are (this is copy and pasted from my notes so there might be so oddness): The four plt_genpt_sten files The two plt_urnpt files player_core.ncs plt _ntb210pt_hermit.plo ntb210pt_hermit.ncs and ntb220pt_grand_oak.ncs plt_ntb220pt_grand_oak.plo orz400pt_rogek.ncs genpt_sten_main.ncs orz400_rogek.dlb and .dlg files lite_multi_gax.ncs orz420pt_alimar.ncs orz340_vartag.dlg orz330_dulin.dlg orz200_dagna.dlg orz200_janar.dlg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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