Qwinn´s Ultimate DAO Fixpack v3 (no longer beta!)

[Qwinn]

One other thing my next update will do, by the way, is get rid of a lot of unnecessary include files and plot files that the toolset exports automatically. I've purged them all for the next release, which will hopefully cut down greatly on false alerts of compatibility issues that aren't really there.

 

BTW, in the process of doing the purge, I found a stray .ncs file (without the corresponding .nss) left over from a fix I later wound up doing a different way that could affect the Human Noble origin. I note no one has given a progress report on a human noble run yet. Did anyone have an issue (or not have an issue) doing the Human Noble origin? If you did, I know what caused it and it won't happen in the next release, and I can tell you how to stop the problem without having to reinstall the mod. Entirely possible it had no effect though.

Edited June 22, 2017 by Qwinn

[AdenYeshua]

I played the entire intro of the Human Noble Origin for my daughter who likes that character. Only got to about Ostigar I couldn't see any issues. It's relatively short in comparison to the others and does not really have "branching paths" like the Dwarven one does so I'm pretty sure your good there.

 

I've noticed with the toolset those file cleanup usually has to wait for my very last update those pesky files tend to show up after every export/update.

[Totalbalance]

Just finished with the Brecilian Forest and - as usual - got some minor stuff to report.

(Also, I can confirm that the "Elf in the corner"- thing happened in my game. I forgot to mention it earlier.)

• I was able to heal Deygan with magic, but afterwards he referred to my elven mage a human. (Sidenote: Why is there even dialogue for dwarves and dalish elves here, if only mages can heal him? Maybe originally you could have your companions heal him? Or maybe the writers just screwed up).

 

• There’s no sound effect for when casting the healing spell on Deygan.

• If you examine Deygan’s equipment the option to heal him is dissapears. You have to exit conversation and click on him again to get it back.

• There was a scripting comment regarding Deygan that caught my attention: it says that “Deygan dies after the player finished the plot either way”, “the plot” presumably being Nature of the Beast. But instead he just disappears after the plot’s done, if you never found him. I think maybe he’s supposed to be flagged as dead, so you can still return his body to the camp and / or loot his corpse. Thoughts on this?

• There was a tiny problem with Zathrian’s new position: During conversation with the player (when talking about Athras) he might do this little walking animation and can end up briefly walking up on the elf’s sickbed behind him. Is it possible to move him just a eensy bit forward to avoid this?

• Athras does not give his non-dalish elf greeting to elven mages.

• If you break up Cammen and Gheyna by telling Cammen that Gheyna insulted him (“Because you were ugly and she was through playing with you.”) he doesn’t actually run towards Gheyna when he dumps her. They just have their conversation even though they not even close to each other.

• I also noticed that Cammen has dialogue for after Nature of the Beast is completed, different for every outcome of his quest. But since he dissapears after his quest, it goes unused. Maybe he should return to camp after the curse is dealt with?

• If you say “I have come to kill you. The hermit wants you dead.” upon meeting the Grand Oak Tree and then “Not unless you give me a better reason not to.” the option “What’s this about an acorn?” will appear, even though nobody has mentioned the acorn yet. It should probably be replaced with “What's this boon you mentioned?”, like earlier in the conversation.

• Also, both Alistair and Zevran had a problem regarding their gifts: I gave them the dalish gloves and the broken amulet before they mentioned them. Later when I asked them questions that led to them mentioning the gifts, they acted like I never gave them to them. There’s a different line for if you’ve already given them the gifts, but for some reason those didn’t trigger for me.

In other news, you asked for something I liked. I tried doing the Morrigan/Leliana love triangle and got falsely accused of “wading through her swamp”. Heh.

It was a bit weird at first and while some options made it possible to play it as innocent, the second conversation (at adore) made it a bit harder. Sometimes it feels like the writers assumed no one would romance Morrigan without sleeping with her.

But then again it’s not like my character was completely innocent - they did kiss a few times. I think you are absolutely right in that Leliana would assume things went further. During the breakup Morrigan even said “You should have bedded me while you had the chance!”, and I don’t think she ever bragged about sleeping with the Warden during banters either. So it feels pretty much established by now that it was all (mostly) in Leliana’s head. Overall, I think it works very well.

That’s it for now, Haven is next!

[mckatsims]

Didn't notice anything weird with the Noble Origin, either, and I completed all possible quests and talked to everyone who triggered cutscenes. Ditto with Ostagar, and the Tower of Ishal. I was able to run that mod Rescue at Ishal along with yours, so I'm guessing there aren't any conflicting files. Since I like getting Zevran early, I installed the ZevranASAP mod. For some reason, the only time I got that to trigger correctly was using the modder's script file option. That files doesn't conflict with anything in your mod, so I'm not sure why the .dazip file didn't work for me. (Could be user error, though lol).

[Qwinn]

(Also, I can confirm that the "Elf in the corner"- thing happened in my game. I forgot to mention it earlier.)

I knew I was forgetting something. Thanks for the reminder.

 

RE009: Redcliffe Tavern: The conditions for being able to ask Lloyd and Bella about "that elf in the corner" will now be consistent and logical (for example, you can no longer ask about him if he's no longer there). Thanks to sialiivi of the Nexus forums for making me aware of this one.

 

I was able to heal Deygan with magic, but afterwards he referred to my elven mage a human.

Fixed, thanks.

(Sidenote: Why is there even dialogue for dwarves and dalish elves here, if only mages can heal him? Maybe originally you could have your companions heal him? Or maybe the writers just screwed up).

This is an excellent point, actually, that I didn't take notice of before. It is actually a clear indication of the intent that Morrigan or Wynne should be able to heal him too. I'll see what it will take to make that happen.

 

There’s no sound effect for when casting the healing spell on Deygan.

I think this is intended - especially if you're right about the last one, and it could be anyone casting the heal spell. The actual casting happens off screen, and the dialogue starts with Deygan standing up with some glowy effects still on him, but the casting is already clearly complete by that point. And it needs to stay that way if I'm going to make the companions capable of casting it too.

 

There was a scripting comment regarding Deygan that caught my attention: it says that “Deygan dies after the player finished the plot either way”, “the plot” presumably being Nature of the Beast. But instead he just disappears after the plot’s done, if you never found him. I think maybe he’s supposed to be flagged as dead, so you can still return his body to the camp and / or loot his corpse. Thoughts on this?

I think "the plot" is referring to the Deygan quest itself, not NTB, and is an obsolete comment. And if you find Deygan but don't do anything with him, the next time you exit the area, he does die and you can recover his body as you suggest. His removal once the NTB quest is done appears quite deliberate in the area script. I presume once the plot is done, either the elves who are now free to enter the forest (maybe Panowen?) find his body and take it home, or the werewolves find and eat him. Both are plausible enough that I can't call it a bug, nor do I see any real restoration here.

 

There was a tiny problem with Zathrian’s new position: During conversation with the player (when talking about Athras) he might do this little walking animation and can end up briefly walking up on the elf’s sickbed behind him. Is it possible to move him just a eensy bit forward to avoid this?

Should be, as long as it doesn't conflict with the staging of the dialogues too badly. Will give it a try. I actually just used an already existing waypoint for Zathrian at that spot that does line up well with the dialogue, but I can try to move it. If I can't, I'll see if I can find a friendlier animation. Thanks for the report.

 

Athras does not give his non-dalish elf greeting to elven mages.

BF011: Dalish Camp: Athras would not recognize an elven mage as an elf. Thanks to Totalbalance of the Nexus forums for making me aware of this one.

 

 

Will address the rest later.

Edited June 23, 2017 by Qwinn

[Qwinn]

Changed fix from this:

 

BF025: "Wounded in the Forest": Mage Wardens only: If you can cast Heal yourself (party members don't count), you were supposed to have the option of healing Deygan yourself, but the wrong script was being checked to determine if you had the spell. After fixing that script and a couple of other minor bugs, you can now heal Deygan yourself, which restores quite a bit of previously unseen dialogue.

 

To this:

 

BF025: "Wounded in the Forest": Restored the ability of your party to heal Deygan. If you are a mage that can cast Heal yourself, or Morrigan or Wynne can do so and are in the party, you were supposed to have the option of healing Deygan on the spot, but the wrong script was being checked to determine if you had the spell. After fixing that script and a couple of other minor bugs, you can now heal Deygan yourself, which restores quite a bit of previously unseen dialogue.

 

Not tested yet, but can't see why it shouldn't work.

[Qwinn]

There was a tiny problem with Zathrian’s new position: During conversation with the player (when talking about Athras) he might do this little walking animation and can end up briefly walking up on the elf’s sickbed behind him. Is it possible to move him just a eensy bit forward to avoid this?

Taken care of. He will wander left instead of backwards during this line. Thanks for the report.

 

If you break up Cammen and Gheyna by telling Cammen that Gheyna insulted him (“Because you were ugly and she was through playing with you.”) he doesn’t actually run towards Gheyna when he dumps her. They just have their conversation even though they not even close to each other.

Sigh. I know. I always knew. Can I tell you how much I've come to utterly despise Cammen and Gheyna? I've already spent so much time on just them, and more than I expected with the recent Gheyna graphic screwup when you sleep with her thing. To fix what you're talking about properly... hate to say it, but I just can't bring myself to do it right now. I know it seems simple but it's really not, and during a beta isn't a good time for as much mucking about as this would take. For now, they'll just have to yell at each other across the camp, like they always have, and they wouldn't be the first arguing young people to do so. Maybe in a later version when I can bring myself to spend any more time on them, which was definitely one of the two buggiest quests in the game ("A Mother's Hope" being the other one.)

 

I also noticed that Cammen has dialogue for after Nature of the Beast is completed, different for every outcome of his quest. But since he disappears after his quest, it goes unused. Maybe he should return to camp after the curse is dealt with?

Possibly for a later version. I agree his dialogue covers all bases, the problem is that Gheyna's post plot dialogue is really limited (though maybe sufficient), and in certain outcomes of their quest, he really shouldn't be there without her. I think this would be a restoration rather than a bug fix either way.

[dmg22]

Hi,

At the rate I'm playing I might be done by christmas.....


A couple of small things....

I think you wrote somewhere that you weren't looking for this sort of thing, but I'm not sure so...

In the Human Noble origin:

The historian Aldous walks away in a cut scene, but is still standing in front of you afterwards.

---

In Ostagar:

Alistar (2nd conv)

-I have a few questions for you?
-the blight duncan mentioned...
-so what is a blight...
-give me the truth
-So what you talked about was the first blight?***

(***This line/answer doesn't really fit here because he hasn't talked about the first blight yet. But it does fit if you ask about the "-chantry's version" of the blight first).

---

Conversation with Flemeth at hut

3. (v3.0) In Ostagar there are a number of dialogue options that are impossible to see because it requires passing a HIGH check against Cunning (30 Cunning required), which only a specialized rogue much later in the game would ever be likely to pass. Changed them to a MED check (requires 15 Cunning) that is possible to pass that early in the game. Dialogues affected: The Elven Messenger, the Tranquil Mage and two conversation options with Flemeth.

-It is possible to pass the high check, with a rogue 15 + 5 + 12 (at lvl 4) = 32 or 14 + 5 + 12 (at lvl 4) = 31 and I consider being able to pass the high check a gameplay benefit/bonus/advantage of focusing on cunning.

Guess who's playing a high cunning rogue?

-But that's not why I'm posting about the conversation.

These are (I think) the 2 lines that are in addition to the vanilla (high check) conversation:

"Believed or not, some things must be accepted."

That works as I would expect.

But the line:

"I believe you have something we need."

Doesn't.

Instead of leading into...

Flemeth philosophy,
Alistar's line about witches,
and Flemeth's dancing under the moonlight line,

...like the other options, it jumps straight to Morrigan's line about the Wardens not wanting to hear about tall tales.

Maybe that's the way it's supposed to be, but it doesn't seem quite right.

Cheers

[Tyndel]

Wow, Quinn, I used your fix pack years ago. I'm surprised to see you return. Just a few months before you came back I pulled various fixes from users (such as magenta emerald) and made sure they wouldn't clash. I went through the readme and you were very thorough. I'm very grateful for this all-in-one package.

 

One mod I had implemented the cut vendor items in Haven like yours did, but it also added "Kaddis of the King's Hounds". Was that mentioned anywhere in the toolset? What is your opinion on other unimplemented gifts such as Diamond Earrings, Remarkable Garnet, etc?

[Qwinn]

Thanks for the report, dgm22!

 

-So what you talked about was the first blight?***

 

Bleah, that's gonna take two new flags. *mutter, mutter*

 

15 + 5 + 12 (at lvl 4) = 32 or 14 + 5 + 12 (at lvl 4) = 31

Level 4 doesn't get you 12 points, it only gets you 9 points (you don't get 3 points at level 1). So you could technically get to it by level 5. A dwarf noble rogue that does everything in their origin doesn't even make it to level 4 when he gets to Ostagar. So even for a dwarf noble rogue, it is impossible, at least for the Ostagar guys and the first meeting with Flemeth. And with classes that do arbitrarily get enough xp to get to level 5 for these conversations, it would also require being content with tier 1 armor and weapons, since you couldn't spare enough for strength to get anything better (and I don't think you could get the talent that let you use cunning for strength anywhere near this early on, but if I'm wrong on that, I'll take another look). I knew it was possible, but as I said, it's something only a specialized rogue later in the game would be ever be *likely* to reach. Hence the fix.

 

and I consider being able to pass the high check a gameplay benefit/bonus/advantage of focusing on cunning.

 

I know you said it wasn't the reason you brought it up, but, do you really think this fix ought to be retracted? It'd be a fair request, and I'd run the numbers again if asked.. The second conversation with Flemeth, I could be talked into retracting it, as it *is* possible (albeit requiring major stat dumping) for dwarf noble rogues to get it by that point. The first one, though, and the guys in Ostagar...

 

"I believe you have something we need."

It does actually seem to be intended. I didn't touch this line, it has no conditions and is behaving as it does in vanilla. While I agree it seems a bit odd, there's also no proper interim Flemeth reply to that answer for me to change it to. The way it does transition *does* lead to a proper reply to your response ("True, they came for their treaties"), so yeah, if you basically say "shut up and gimme da treaties!", you do lose out on a bit of dialogue.

 

Totalbalance:

 

If you examine Deygan’s equipment the option to heal him is dissapears. You have to exit conversation and click on him again to get it back.

Fixed, thanks for the report.

 

Tyndel:

 

Thanks for the kind words. The kaddis guy was deliberately cut, so I don't restore him (his creature file is there, with a short dialogue, but his store is empty, so anything I added to it would be completely arbitrary, unlike the Haven store.) As for those gifts, I didn't restore them because the overall amount of approval you can get from existing gifts seems relatively balanced among the companions and I didn't want to mess up that balance.

Edited June 24, 2017 by Qwinn