LE Curses, Gifts, and going a bit too far down the rabbit hole

[Andoriol]

Ever since I had the idea to be both a vampire and a werewolf at the same time, I was extremely excited, it seemed like a cool idea and fun to not only play, but roleplay.

 

And then one cured the other and I -> :wallbash:

 

However, that got me to thinking about things to do to make it not only fun to put them together, but worth the effort, and roleplaying as well. (Additionally, it got me wondering why the heck there isn't a "Mage Oriented" 'disease', but more on that later).

 

As such, here are the ideas I had, and that I feel would make an interesting and fun mod (if admittedly in depth and large):

 

 

Changes to both Vampire and Werewolf:

Able to hold down the interact button while sprinting (or have a special key on keyboards) that makes the character sprint as fast as a horse, costing no extra stamina.

 

Perk/Skill tree's. Specifically, a Bestial skill (and corresponding perk tree) for Werewolves, and a Blood skill (and corresponding perk tree) for Vampires.

The primary issue with this is how it would be handled when you cure the disease, what happens to the perks in it? And if it (As I think it should) adds to your leveling, what happens to your levels if it disappears? This is the major issue I have with the idea, as much as I love it, I can't seem to figure out what to do when you cure the disease.

 

 

Changes to Werewolves:

In human form, werewolves get a flat % bonus to Damage, Defense, and Health Regen. But the werewolf form's strength and defense scale to character level (So less UBER OVERPOWERED at low levels and sucky suck suck at high ones).

 

A toggle-able power in human form (similar to the Vampires night-vision) that is a short range Life-Detect effect.

 

The character would gain experience for the Bestial skill every time they kill or feed as a Werewolf, and a smaller amount every time they transform.

The perk tree of the Werewolves would be slightly larger than some of the other skill trees, and shorter than the Vampire's, but with numerous repurchase-able perks. Continuing the theme of brute, unsubtle power.

 

Perks would include:

• Increasing health/stamina regen, in both human and werewolf forms
  
• Increasing Claw Damage
  
• Keeping some of your equipment (Rings and amulets primarily)
  
• More Transformations per day
  
• Access to specific parts of the character menu again (With a 'You can't do that as a werewolf' note if you aren't allowed to use something)
  
• Increasing defense
  
• Improving senses power(s)
  
• No longer attacked by animals
  
• Sneaking in werewolf form
  
• Extending the duration of the transformation
  

 

 

Changes to Vampires:

Every time the Vampire feeds, they get a small amount of XP for their "Blood" skill. They intentionally level their Blood skill slower than a Werewolf would their Bestial skill.

 

The vampire perk tree would be relatively large with a lot of "optional" perks and directions to take the power. Perks include:

• Bloodthirst - Once-a-day power that increases your effective vampire stage by one (Even to "Stage 5" when you are already Stage 4). Melee Sneak Attacks in this mode would be a "Feeding" sneak attack, does extra damage (As a Dagger, so x15 with the right perk), and/but it resets your vampire stage after the Bloodthirst mode ends.
  
• Increase damage based on stage (5, 10, 15, 20 [25])
  
• Increase Defense (%) based on stage (5, 10, 15, 20, [25])
  
• Overfeeding - Killing a character through feeding can increase the character's effective Stage without the disadvantages (Only allows up to Stage 2 at first, repurchases would allow for Stage 3 and Stage 4), goes away over time.
  
• Reducing the stat drain in the sunlight (Never eliminating it)
  
• Toggle-able short range Life-Detect
  
• Electricity Resistance (20, 30, 40, 50, [60])
  
• Magic Resistance (10, 15, 20, 25, [30])
  
• Direct improvements on their usual bonuses (Extra Sneak/Illusion bonuses)
  
• All melee fatalities in Bloodthirst mode would be "feeding" fatalities
  
• Feeding increases health/stamina/magika temporarily
  
• Increase Speed
  
• Increase jump height
  
• Add a Stamina Drain effect to the vampire-drain spell
  
• Increase the power of the Vampire drain spell
  
• Stage 4 causes a huge Speech and barter penalty (Possibly making it impossible to sell or talk to some character's), increasing your bounty as well *INSTEAD* of everyone attacking on sight
  

 

 

Hybrid Concepts:

When a character first catches both curses/diseases, they lose access to the perk tree's (accompanying bonuses) and powers (Both transforming for Werewolves, their Predator's Senses, and their damage/defense/health regen bonuses, but also Vampire powers and their Sneak/Illusion bonuses).

Retain all the drawbacks. Heavily reduced health/stamina/magika and their regen in daylight from Vampire Blood. Lack of resting bonuses from Werewolf blood.

Additionally, the character gains a weakness to Silver Weapons in all forms.

 

All this suck sticks with the character until they cure one of the curses normally... *or* they go on another quest (line) to combine the diseases/curses, which would *definitely* require the favor or Hircine and Molag Bal, the sources of both curses.

The quest (line) would have options for those who are part of the Mages College, Thieves Guild, or Brotherhood should be able to draw on their resources to make it easier...

 

Once the quest line is complete, the character regains all their powers, however, the character retains the weakness to Silver weapons in all forms. Gains a summon wolves power in human form.

The character's jump height increases in all forms, and all bonuses from vamp stuff carry on into Beast-form, but not weaknesses.

 

With perk/skill tree's, Werepyre/Hybrid/Vampwolves/whatevers would have their own perk tree, and if someone more creative than me can figure out how to combine most of the functionalities of the Werewolf and Vampire Skill Tree's into a single one with some extra stuff, then I'd have to say anyone would only have one "Curse" tree at a time, otherwise, a Hybrid would have access to both the Werewolf and Vampire Skill Tree's in addition to their own "Hybrid" tree.

 

The Hybrid tree would have such perks as these:

• Bloodthirst in Werewolf form
  
• Feeding as Werewolf = Vampire Feeding (Optional, not a prerequisite for anything so that people that like to be a high-stage Vampire can avoid it)
  
• Get the werewolf power attack in human form, must be unarmed to take advantage of it.
  
• Extra uses of Bloodthirst per day, something Vampires don't get
  
• Werewolf totem powers get a vampiric boost
  Roar gets a AoE stamina drain effect
  The summoned wolves basic attacks gain an Absorb Health enchantment, which heals their own health
  Werewolf vision power totem gets a "Detect Undead/Automaton effect"
  

 

 

Mage-Oriented "Curse" - Auger of the Dov:

When I noticed that Werewolves seemed all WOLFY SMASH and Vampires were so heavily stealth oriented, I wondered why there wasn't something more Mage oriented. Then I realized that there wasn't really anything in the lore that I knew of that could qualify.

 

... until I remembered the Auger you meet in the Mages College.

 

This "curse" is different than the other two in that you have to go out of your way to get it, it's a choice, and it's not a disease. It's a ritual, an improved version of the one the old apprentice did to become the Auger you meet, and you must go on an epic quest to first learn the ritual, then how to improve it so that you don't become pure magic, just connect deeply to Aetherius (Probably mispelled that) in search of more magical power.

 

The quest to get it would only be available after first meeting the Auger.

 

Becoming an Auger is an always-on state, that has it's advantages and disadvantages. A pure mage should *love* this, but anyone other than a PURE mage should be iffy.

 

Once a character has completed the quest to remake the Ritual, better than before, and actually enact it to become the/an Auger of Dov, they'd gain the following benefits:

 

• Bonus to Magika of (Character Level x2).
  
• Bonus to Magika Regen of (Character Level x2).
  
• Decrease physical damage, both damage taken and damage done with anything but spells, by 5%. This is due to being partially intangible.
  
• Health Regen is reduced by the same amount as the character's Magika Regen is increased.
  
• Health and stamina are reduced by (Character Level).
  
• Characters get a power (Or spell if it's easier to code) of "Convert Stamina into magika as long as you use it"
  
• Can consume enchanted items and soul gems, increasing the character's Magika by an amount based on the soul in the gem, total charge of the item, or the soul-gem that would've been required to make the item.
  
• Special soul-tap power that absorbs the targets soul when they die into the character rather than a soul gem, restoring Magika based on the soul.
  

 

If using "Curses get a skill/perk-tree associated with them", then the Auger of Dov would gain a small amount of XP from consuming souls, either through enchanted items, soul gems, or directly with their power. Additionally, the "Aetherious" skill would be increased by one for every place or item of magical power such as the various glowing pools about the Mages College, the Eye of Mundus, the Staff of Magnus, the Elder Scroll, Sovengaurd, the Evergleam, every Daedric Shrine, the Time Wound, so on and so forth (I'd love more suggestions actually). Yes, this means you could miss chances for skill points.

 

Perks would include:

• An Absorb Magika Spell
  
• Upgrades to the Absorb Magika in power and AoE
  
• Wards block more damage/increase armor noticably more + Blocking is less effective.
  
• Restoration spells are more powerful, major reduction in Health Regen.
  
• Illusion spells are significantly more powerful at the cost of Speech/Bartering power
  
• Discount on all spells, but all Stamina costs increase by twice the amount
  
• Further increasing damage reduction, both taking and dishing it out
  
• Additional Spell Resistance, at the cost of reduced physical defense
  
• Spell Absorption at the cost of physical damage
  

 

Auger's of the Dov *can* be reversed, but it should *not* be easy (You sought out the power, no take-backsies), and no toggling that is pseudo-possible with Vampirism.

 

---

 

So questions to *you* (Outside of who wants to give this a go?!) are pretty easy, what do you like most out of this? What are your suggestions? Criticisms? Alternative ideas? :-)

[IxionInc]

Alternatively, you could go with Liches as the "mage curse", or "Dragon Priests" as they're set up in Skyrim, which is more common and more of a go-to thing than an Auger. Although it's primarily a necromancer thing, it still makes sense.

http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Lich

 

I kind of outlined how I'd do it in this thread: http://www.thenexusf..._1#entry3899896

Edited December 18, 2011 by IxionInc

[Andoriol]

Alternatively, you could go with Liches as the "mage curse", or "Dragon Priests" as they're set up in Skyrim, which is more common and more of a go-to thing than an Auger. Although it's primarily a necromancer thing, it still makes sense.

http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Lich

 

I kind of outlined how I'd do it in this thread: http://www.thenexusf..._1#entry3899896

The problem with Liches (Or Dragon Priests) is that there doesn't appear to be any real benefit to becoming one outside of being immortal/Respawn in 5.

 

I like your concepts, but it's pretty similar to my concept for the Auger, only without any drawbacks at all. There should be drawbacks in my opinion :) (I also disagree that the Vampires suck, I actually really enjoyed being one), besides, I wanted something that anyone could be, not just "Necromancers" for roleplay reasons as well. Any mage, no matter what their feelings on necromancy (And even people who aren't mages) can connect more deeply with the magical realm, but if your character concept isn't compatible with being a Lich? What are you going to do for a mage? :-)

Edited December 18, 2011 by Andoriol

[IxionInc]

Alternatively, you could go with Liches as the "mage curse", or "Dragon Priests" as they're set up in Skyrim, which is more common and more of a go-to thing than an Auger. Although it's primarily a necromancer thing, it still makes sense.

http://elderscrolls....a.com/wiki/Lich

 

I kind of outlined how I'd do it in this thread: http://www.thenexusf..._1#entry3899896

The problem with Liches (Or Dragon Priests) is that there doesn't appear to be any real benefit to becoming one outside of being immortal/Respawn in 5.

 

I like your concepts, but it's pretty similar to my concept for the Auger, only without any drawbacks at all. There should be drawbacks in my opinion :) (I also disagree that the Vampires suck, I actually really enjoyed being one), besides, I wanted something that anyone could be, not just "Necromancers" for roleplay reasons as well. Any mage, no matter what their feelings on necromancy (And even people who aren't mages) can connect more deeply with the magical realm, but if your character concept isn't compatible with being a Lich? What are you going to do for a mage? :-)

 

Okay, first of all, did you like completely skip over the first portion of the post or what? 100% magic regen outside of your transformation seems like a pretty awesome thing to me, as well as water-walking and a minion power, and not to mention, a transformation power.

 

There are drawbacks. On scale with vanilla werewolves, they have a 50% weakness to fire, weakness to turning weapons/spells, and no divine blessings.

Werewolves only had a weakness to silver, and didn't get a rested bonus.

What do the vampires get as weaknesses? Sunlight, the need to feed (Which makes them weaker); And for what benefits? A cloak spell, a charm spell, and blood-sight?

And if that's the case, what benefit is there from being a werewolf? "Oh, you just get beast mode."

 

Secondly, Liches weren't just a necromancer thing, as evidenced by the Dragon Priests. As far as I know, the Dragon Priests were simply mages who worshipped dragons, and were given immortality, similar to a Draugr.

 

Again, I understand that my concept isn't really "on par" compared to yours, but I was creating mine based upon the vanilla "curses". I simply brought this up for ideas, as well as a much less obscure creature to use than an Augur.

[Andoriol]

Alternatively, you could go with Liches as the "mage curse", or "Dragon Priests" as they're set up in Skyrim, which is more common and more of a go-to thing than an Auger. Although it's primarily a necromancer thing, it still makes sense.

http://elderscrolls....a.com/wiki/Lich

 

I kind of outlined how I'd do it in this thread: http://www.thenexusf..._1#entry3899896

The problem with Liches (Or Dragon Priests) is that there doesn't appear to be any real benefit to becoming one outside of being immortal/Respawn in 5.

 

I like your concepts, but it's pretty similar to my concept for the Auger, only without any drawbacks at all. There should be drawbacks in my opinion :) (I also disagree that the Vampires suck, I actually really enjoyed being one), besides, I wanted something that anyone could be, not just "Necromancers" for roleplay reasons as well. Any mage, no matter what their feelings on necromancy (And even people who aren't mages) can connect more deeply with the magical realm, but if your character concept isn't compatible with being a Lich? What are you going to do for a mage? :-)

 

Okay, first of all, did you like completely skip over the first portion of the post or what? 100% magic regen outside of your transformation seems like a pretty awesome thing to me, as well as water-walking and a minion power, and not to mention, a transformation power.

 

There are drawbacks. On scale with vanilla werewolves, they have a 50% weakness to fire, weakness to turning weapons/spells, and no divine blessings.

Werewolves only had a weakness to silver, and didn't get a rested bonus.

What do the vampires get as weaknesses? Sunlight, the need to feed (Which makes them weaker); And for what benefits? A cloak spell, a charm spell, and blood-sight?

And if that's the case, what benefit is there from being a werewolf? "Oh, you just get beast mode."

 

Secondly, Liches weren't just a necromancer thing, as evidenced by the Dragon Priests. As far as I know, the Dragon Priests were simply mages who worshipped dragons, and were given immortality, similar to a Draugr.

 

Again, I understand that my concept isn't really "on par" compared to yours, but I was creating mine based upon the vanilla "curses". I simply brought this up for ideas, as well as a much less obscure creature to use than an Augur.

Whoa o-O Sorry, that post came out wrong, those were two disconnected thoughts that were too close together >_<

 

When I said "no perks to being a lich outside of immortality" I meant entirely from a lore standpoint, not your suggestion at all! That was my bad for writing it that way. I was referring to the lore view of Liches is (as far as I know) that they are already ridiculously powerful mages that just attain immorality and a Respawn in 5 power (Their phylactery).

 

And again, I *like* your idea, honestly, I'd like to see it implemented as well, if slightly differently (I feel that it could use a slight downgrade as it appears slightly OP (Weak to turning? Weak to being healed? Not likely for enemies to use. Unless it includes your own healing, then wtf, how's that supposed to work?), but if it had a perk-tree attached, all of its current powers and specializations could be put into that).

 

To try and put my reasons for choosing Auger over Lich differently (and hopefully not coming across as an asshat again >_<), a Lich is a necromantic figure, even the Dragon Priests are very undead-ish, which is part of the reason I chose Auger over it. It's a mage option that isn't an undead/necromantic, yet could make as much sense (or maybe more depending on implementation) as becoming a Lich for non-Arch-Mage characters (For people that focus more on roleplay aspects). MInd you, I hadn't thought of the Dragon Priests as merely immortal, they always seemed more straight out turned-into-undead-to-serve-the-dragons to me.