Modding normal attacks to consume stamina disables power attacks :(

[topeira]

hi everyone.

i would love some help.

i am a SUPER beginnger modder (and dont plan on getting much more advanced :-P ) and i need some help.... preferably in simple words :smile:

using the CK and SSEedit (yes, im modding for the SE, but i didnt get answers on the SE forums) i flagged normal attacks (within the RACE entry) as BASH types, and gave them a stamina cost and stagger. now i can get enemies hit by normal attacks to stagger and have a stamina drain (for the PC) with each swing and even prevent normal swings from executing until i have a bit of stamina, which helps balance the staggers.

however if i do that than my power attacks are buggy - 99% of the time i cant perform a power attack.

If i flag these attacks in the CK as POWER ATTACKS (as apposed to bashes) than i can do power attacks and my normal attacks cost stamina, but then i cant execute attacks fast enough. there is a huge delay between the swings.

so that's not good either.

the best i could do is not flag the normal attacks as anything besides LEFT types (like they are by default) and then i get the stagger, but no stamina drain or dependency, and that creates a problem fighting slower enemies like draugers or falmer that do NOT use shields (since i can stagger lock them. those with shields can bash me).

Is there a way i could fix this and enjoy both worlds - both a stamina draining normal attacks AND a stagger? (or maybe a way to make fighting draugers and skeletons and falmer harder inspite of the staggers? like make them faster or something. i will gladly hear ideas)

Edited November 2, 2016 by topeira

[topeira]

anyone??

i gotta bump this. i dont know where else to ask :(

If anyone can suggest another forum that is more active than here, please do. that would also be considered as help ;)

[panurgy]

You could try the new or the original Bethesda forums. They've been less useful since the split. There might be a slightly better chance of getting a response.

 

I'm curious about what you're doing, but I suspect it won't work. The reason I say this is because every combat mod out there uses a cloak script to do what you're doing. That is, there's a cloak magic effect on the PC with a custom script that pings nearby actors and attaches stamina/injury/whatever effects to them. Cloak scripts can be laggy (papyrus is slow for this compared to earlier games script engines), and badly done cloak scripts can cause save bloat. One of the popular tutorials was done poorly, and was widely copied.

 

Several of the most popular combat mods are considered dangerous because of this, which is part of the reason why Wildcat and Vigor have become popular. They were written after the problems were understood, by authors careful to avoid them. This also means that they are deliberately more limited in scope than the bigger, old combat mods.

 

You can take a look at how Wildcat & Vigor work. Also, SkyTweak has a stamina script, and it may be simpler than the other two.

[topeira]

VIGOR also does stamina consumption by normal attacks but i wanted a more "dark souls" kinda balance of fast regenerating stamina and a normal attacks take about 25 stamina so you cant stagger an enemy too long. not at the start at least.

but i agree that is was a long shot. obviously if it was possible to do without scripting than others would have done it already.

 

i just thought "what are the odds that things in SE work differently?!"

And since im trying to mod the special edition, skytweak isnt relevant to me. i dont know how to scripts and i cant reverse engeneer skytweak, nor use it on the SE.

i used it A LOT on skyrim, though :) where i have "action combat" mod which had the best staggers mechanics i've seen. thanks to skse, i believe.

[wbunkey2244]

Hi, I'm the currently the modder thats in charge of action combat, I was wondering if you all ever got an answer to this question as I believe I can shed some light on this problem. Setting attacks to bash in the race edits is most likely preventing power attacks from occuring because in order to execute a power bash there is a perk requirement. I think all that perk does is flag an boolean animation variable to true as opposed to false by default. So any attacker would not be able to execute a power attack unless that boolean variable were set to true. As for flagging attacks as power attacks there is a cooldown setting under the creation kit game setting you could change but I dont recommend that. Honestly I recommend using a lightweight script to handle the whole thing for maximum compatability if you intend to upload the mod. Anything that edits the vanilla races is going to largely be incompatible with a lot of mods and wont affect custom races. If you need help with scripting feel free to ask.

 

-Wbunkey2244

Edited August 23, 2017 by wbunkey2244

[fore]

Don't trust anything animation related fields that you see in the CK. Good chance that it is at least obsolete.

 

There is another window (Ganleplay -> Animations) that has unused parameters: Sequence, Blocking, No Attacking, Looping. They were there for Oblivion (and even there at least some were unused).

 

In Skyrim animations are controlled by the Havok Behavior system, and you cannot modify anything in there by CK parameters. And in particular you cannot modify behaviors (character) race specific.

 

In the CK Race -> Attack Data window there are some parameters which are definitely not changeable anywhere else but in the behaviors: power attack, left, bash, rotating. And it's not necessary. With FNIS and FNIS PCEA2 you can add custom attack animations. And it has never been necessary to changre anything in CK to make those animations work.