Zero dammage bow and arrow setup.

[bamfigms]

I think this would be a pretty interesting option for fights. If you can hit someone with any of a range of negative status effects, you can really open your options.

 

I got this idea after looking through the console for different arrow types. The practice arrow got me thinking about how I could use that to paralyze someone I didn't want to kill, and just run away.

 

To try and make this useful I think keeping the zero damage (which would require a zero damage bow, as the practice arrows are already in game) and making the effects on the arrows last longer than a typical poison. Say, 30-60 second paralyze or so.

 

In short, this is an idea for a mid evil tranquilizer (and other status effects) gun.

 

I'm going to try to figure out how to make this mod myself, though I know nothing about modding. If anyone can help me out, or point me in the right direction I would very much appreciate it. Also, if anyone likes this idea, they are more than welcome to take it and run with it. I make no claims to the idea.

[Sunnie]

The only problem is that arrows (ammo) don't have any effects in Skyrim, all of the effects are on the bow. The different arrow types are just increasingly higher damage modifiers as you progress from iron to daedric.

It may be possible to script some effect onto ammo, but that won't be evident until after the toolset is out and we have had a chance to see what it is capable of.

[jet4571]

Well its possible to give arrows enchantments and remove any damage they cause so the idea is more than possible. but you would also need a bow that does no damage because the bow and arrows both have a damage modifier that is combined when fired. What you need to do is learn to use Skyedit now or wait until the CK comes out then learn to create a new enchanted version of an existing weapon.

 

If you follow this guide: http://www.skyrimnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=6677 but ignore all the stuff about new meshes and textures and you will have a start. I am just learning this stuff myself but I can see how this tutorial can give you the beginning steps. Like find an enchanted bow in there, copy it and change the enchantment to paralyze and zero the damage. then a copy of the practice arrows and do the same enchantment. You might also want to consider making a new version of the enchantment and make the timer longer.

 

*edit

@Sunnie, If he creates a new version of an existing weapon he can change the damage modifier to 0, and practice arrows have no damage already. And all that can be done now without the CK. Also In the Tytanis mod there are enchanted arrows, so i know adding an enchantment to them is possible.

 

 

*edit

Actually creating it wont be hard at all. There's already bows with Paralyze. I just made a copy of one then changed the damage to 0. Made a copy of its enchantment and changed the duration to 60 instead of 6. made a copy of an unenchanted bow forge recipe and changed it to the new enchanted bow. recipe for the arrows. done. done done... I just have no idea where "dunArcherPracticeArrowProjectile" is so I can add the enchantment to it.

 

Anyway I did all that from what i learned in that tutorial mainly, the rest was snooping about. Now for the OP to do it as its his idea....

Edited January 25, 2012 by jet4571

[huntsman2310]

I always wondered why the bows themselves have a damage rating...really all they should do is increase effectiveness, distance and velocity of the arrow, while the arrow itself is the one that has the damage.

[bamfigms]

Thanks jet, I'll be checking that out very soon.

 

Right now I am getting by with poisons put on the long bow using practice arrows. It would literally take hundreds of shots to kill someone at the level I am now. So functionally its almost like I want it. Though It would be nice to not have to have such an plain bow shooting such plain arrows.

 

Sometimes I get to into the game (hey, what can I say, I enjoy it more that way) and I think... these people are in the way, but do I have to kill them? Why not a combination of sneaky and nonlethal moves? (this isn't how i play all the time, just sometimes I don't want to kill some npc's, I don't feel like they deserve it)

 

I guess I should probably just wait for the CK to come out. I heard its due out sometime tomorrow.

 

TLDR point

 

I would like to make a whole set of mods like this. Sneaky/ninja type things. Some I know will be hard, some... probably impossible. I have plenty more ideas, such as a glider for all those mountains, possible rock climbing mod (would be easy to do for 1st person just have an ice axe type deal, 3rd person view would be a nightmare i'm sure) And possibly some type of zelda style hookshot.

[jet4571]

proof of concept, craftable ebony bow with 60 second paralyze in ebony crafting section, and practice arrows in the misc crafting section. I couldnt get any enchantments on the arrows. seems skyedit has an issue with editing those files. I noticed you could make it where you wont piss someone off using it on them. but I didnt change that lol. anyway tested and 60 seconds is quite a while to wait for that guard to get up.....

 

*file attached. forgot you could attach some files...

Edited January 25, 2012 by jet4571

[Jakisthe]

I feel, to offer my inane input, that bows effect draw speed (as a lb pull count), arrow speed (as a function of draw), both of which then factor into damage. The arrow itself does most of the damage, and it's weird that we get enchanted bows instead of arrows...but I guess that if you were to bring that into the equation, the game would start wondering as to how many arrows to apply the enchant to, and what to do when it runs out...

I've seen a few crafting mods which allow for fire arrows in stacks of, say, 20, so I suspect that is one way around it.

 

Personally, I came up with a few ideas for a much more interesting archery system, but seeing as I have too many topics anyway, I'll just put them out of the way here:

 

 

First, arrows which actually have inherent effects besides "use the most powerful one, obviously"

-Iron: Fires 2 at once, has an automatic 100% chance of recovery.

-Steel: A +40% chance of causing a critical hit.

-Glass: Arrows can pierce multiple enemies, are drawn in 75% of the time as most other arrows.

-Dwarven: Shorter range, but has an inherent 30% chance to stagger.

-Elvish: Arrows travel much faster and straighter.

-Ebony: Enemies hit with these arrows take 15% more damage from other ebony weapons.

-Deadric: Arrows all gain a “banish/fear up to players level/half players level” effect.

-Dragon: Highest damage.

-Nordic: Arrows all have a 50 dmg health+stamina lost over 10 seconds frost effect.

-Falmer: Arrows are drawn twice as fast and the player automatically moves at normal speed with the bow drawn.

-Forsworn: Can press “E” when near a flame source light all arrows used till bow is sheathed again on fire.

-Orcish: All arrows now have a frenzy effect. There are orcish arrows, right?

-Rusty: Causes a random poison/disease effect on the enemy.

 

Which then you apply enchants to, like:

-Hollow Arrows: Poisons last 10x as long.

-Water Arrows: Deals double damage to fire enemies, puts out flames for better sneaking.

-Moss Arrows: When hitting an enemy, deals no damage but entraps them for 5 seconds. When hitting a surface, creates moss for silent movement.

-Oil Arrows: Half as much range as normal, but launches a clay ball on the end of the arrows, which breaks and covers enemies/ground with oil.

-Lightning Arrows: Deals double damage to automatons, and if used in rainy weather causes a lightning strike on target.

-Ice Arrows: 1.5x damage to fire enemies, and can be shot at still bodies of water to create an ice platform for 20 seconds. Doesn’t work with Nordic arrows

-Soul Arrow: By combing the arrow with a certain size of soul gem, any enemy hit will have their soul captured when they die. If soul gem isn’t the exact right size, gem remains on enemies corpse.

-Cluster Arrow: A very heavy arrow which takes twice as long to draw, but when fired at an angle of 70 degrees of more, breaks into 7 arrows which rain down on an area.

-Heartstrike: Arrows have a very slight tracking capacity.

 

And, for fun, some potential extra perks for archery:

-Truesight: Shows an ethereal beam tracing out the arrows trajectory.

-Windtouched: Hold down block button after firing to go to the view of the arrow, able to slightly change it’s direction as it flies.

-Enlightenment: Can now have magic in the left hand while holding a bow.

-Roll: Can roll while holding a drawn bow, but costs 1.5x as much stamina as normal

-Overdraw: If enemy is within 2 feet of a wall, a max drawn arrow has a 30% chance of sticking them to the wall for 5 seconds.

-Nimble Fingers [2 ranks]: Press E with a drawn arrow to load 1/2 more.

 

 

 

 

...Yeah that's way down the line. I'll shut up now.

Edited January 28, 2012 by Jakisthe

[bamfigms]

proof of concept, craftable ebony bow with 60 second paralyze in ebony crafting section, and practice arrows in the misc crafting section. I couldnt get any enchantments on the arrows. seems skyedit has an issue with editing those files. I noticed you could make it where you wont piss someone off using it on them. but I didnt change that lol. anyway tested and 60 seconds is quite a while to wait for that guard to get up.....

 

*file attached. forgot you could attach some files...

 

 

Wow, I really like that.

 

That is a major step in the right direction.

 

I understand that skyedit is being retarded about arrows, so don't think I'm putting down what you did. But I would like to eventually have this to where the arrows are the enchanted thing. That way you can take your zero damage bow or "Stun Bow" as you put it (i can see that name sticking) and put multiple ammos through it. So you can have one bow doing many effects with different arrows. That way you don't have to lug around 100 lb's of bows, just a few different types of arrows.

 

Also, I think it would be amazing if we could get the arrows to look different. If its doing zero damage.... it shouldn't have a big nasty looking arrowhead. I'm thinking something with a blunted look.

 

One last thing. I personally would like to have the bow not piss people off. The whole concept in my mind was a completely stealth based way of putting an effect on an npc with them never the wiser.

 

Anyhow, thanks for the work on that, its a great proof of concept.

[bamfigms]

I'm going to make one more blathering post, then shut up and get back to trying to figure this out... Though I'd probably have more luck waiting for the CK.

 

If anyone else wants to work on this, or just completely hijack the idea, that's more than fine with me.

 

What I am looking at doing for the version of the mod I want to eventually make is this

 

THE BOW :

 

Appearance

 

I want to make the bow a different look than any of the other bows in game. I'm thinking a bare and plain looking black bow. I say this because I don't want the bow to be immediately identifiable as an ebony, elven, or any other type. I want it to have its own look.

 

If it is at all possible I would like to make the bow smaller or lighter looking than all the other bows. The reason behind this being that is not shooting heavy weight arrows designed to do damage, its just delivering whatever "effect" the arrows have put on them

 

 

Mechanics

 

I think the bow should draw and fire slower than other bows. The bow itself should have 0 damage, and have no effects or enchantments on it. The idea here is that it is just platform for the arrows.

 

I think it would be nice to include the option to either have the target ignore the attack from the bow, or to not ignore. I think an ideal situation would be they ignore the attack if the effect of the arrow is successful. If they resist the paralyze/frenzy/ect effect then they should attack, or come looking for you.

 

 

THE ARROWS :

 

Appearance

 

The arrows should, like the bow, look different from the other in game arrows. Something this unique should have its own look. They should have blunted tips possibly even a tip the broadens out slightly before rounding off. Similar to this http://www.archery-centre.co.uk/Catalogue/ArrowHeads/RubberBlunt.gif

With a little needle like point just barely visible on the end. The big blunted part holds the poison, and the little needle tip of for injection.

 

 

Mechanics

 

This is really the main part to this mod in my mind. The arrows themselves are what should cause the different status effects on the target. That way I can have the one special bow, and many different effect arrows. Again these arrows should cause 0 damage.

 

So far the only "effects" I have though about are: poison, paralyze, frenzy, encumbrance, magicka drain, fatigue drain, and fear/flee (can't remember what its called, but I mean the one that makes em run away)

 

 

Anyhow. Feel free to give, advice, suggestions on the mod, steal my idea, or help me figure out how to make it.

[jet4571]

I like the variety of having different effects for the standard arrows idea. Having them just based on damage is rather weak when basic arrow quality doesn't make much difference but a cheap bow compared to quality makes a huge difference. The arrow differences really are how far they will fly, how straight they will fly without veering, and if the heads are sharp for better penetration. Might want to consider downsides too like lower damage from glass because it makes a clean wound from being the sharpest or elvish because they are light and cannot penetrate as deep from the faster loss of velocity on impact. a downside to go with the upside makes each arrow type more useful in certain situations but not in others. "Why would I use the other arrows when this one works good enough in any situation?" to "Crap heavy armor, better swap my Elvish arrows for Ebony"

 

I think I would change the list some though.

 

1. iron have a greater chance of staggering and the shortest distance for flight. heavier and not as sharp so they produce more impact on hit and that impact increases stagger chances. and the weight decreases the flight distance.

2. Dwarven should fire 2 at 1 time because them dwarves can make an arrow that splits in two when fired. downside is less accuracy.

3. Rusty can use the possible stagger affect just half of the iron arrows alongside the poison/disease. least accurate arrow.

4. Ebony deals more damage to heavy armor as well.

 

*edit,

You could do a blackened reskin of one of the lower end bows like the hunting and scale it in NifSkope to be smaller to ease making a whole new one. As for the arrows it would be easy enough to put a safety tip on them in 3ds max but I doubt you would need to add the needle detail. And draw/fire rate is in the editor where the damage is.

Edited January 25, 2012 by jet4571