Mundoid Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Thank goodness I thought I was going crazy. I am making a rather large dungeon level, as my first attempt at level design, and I have spent days making and remaking my navmesh and wondering why the NPC's and encounters that I have put in are not patrolling the way I wanted them to, instead standing in one place. So I remake the navmesh again differently to see if that changes anything, no changes. So what is the solution? I'm pretty reluctant to go mucking around with the skyrim.esm because I don't know enough about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dovonob Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 From what I can gather Mundoid there's not a lot you can do other than the ems workaround but by the sound of it it's not really ideal and sounds like a bit of a long winded workaround. I suppose if you're not changing any of the existing worldspace just making a one off dungeon that workaround should work for you but like you I personally wouldn't want to start messing around with that stuff if I wasn't totally sure what I was doing. Are you totally sure your navmeshs are correct though, the first time you go into your dungeon the navmeshs should work ok if they are correct, it's not till you go two cells away and come back when the bug kicks in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korodic Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 hmm... I could force the game to reload the cell, but I don't know what that would accomplish. Ehhhhhhhh.... It sucks. If it is unfixable at the very least the AI should be able to stay seated in furniture or something. But eh. Stuff happens. Apparently the only fix i know of is to make your mod into an esm, which I do not know how to do properly yet, so i cannot explain it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dovonob Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Korodic is it actually possible to force the cell to reload the navmesh? I don't know myself I havn't delved into the toolkit proper yet as this bug and the one where custom large objects don't appear in the game is enough for me to think it's pointless to even start on anything, just sounds like an exercise is extreme frustration. If it's possible give it a try and see what happens and let us know, I'm gonna hedge my bets that there is something wrong with the theory of reloading the navmesh as I'm sure someone would have tried it before but you never know, worth a go doesn't look promising that Bethseda are going to fix it if it's a bug thats' been there since Oblivion unfortunately. :pirate: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korodic Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 well, I am sure you can just make it an esm and avoid an issue. But a work around would not be reasonable. The only alternative I could think of is using a trigger to move the player to another cell and then back to this cell. But I doubt that would work either. Bahhh. this dumb stuff. I am having issues with new worldspaces. >.> So honestly if I finish this mod, and nothing improves, I will be quitting modding for quite some time. Some people will probably tell me I don't really have any content anyways (which is true lmao), but normally I do it all by myself, and I don't need the CK slowing me down >.> But, fi the CK messes up my mod and I tried my best, well it is what it is. Stuff happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brasher Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) I am quite confused reading about this subject. Is this the proper format for building a new dungeon or companion-friendly house: (1) Build .esm containing everything inside the house or dungeon. (2) Build .esp that is mastered to the .esm. This file contains the door to your house or dungeon, the clutter near the door, and the landscape edits in Tamriel, such as making the ground level to put your house or cave door on. Edited February 17, 2012 by David Brasher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunnie Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) All of your non-vanilla assets and non-replacer additions can go in an ESM, anything that actually changes anything (navmesh being the exception) goes in an ESP that has Skyrim.esm and your ESM as masters. So, if you added a new cell, navmeshed it and populated it with objects, that and the Tamriel Building you placed can go into an ESM. Then you load your ESM in the toolset and place your outer doors and make any other superficial changes to the outside world in that. I hope that helps you understand. :biggrin: With a little thought, you can can easily plan out what needs to be done as first steps to ESM the parts that need it, then finish with the modifications to existing stuff (plugin). Edited February 17, 2012 by Sunnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkjoldBjorn Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I knew about this navmesh problem as it got a warning about it on the wiki, saw it the first day when i went through the wiki to see if there was anything new to learn, but i did not know that this bug stretched so far back, this is very serious and very bad. The exterior i modified outside Drelas cottage changes the landscape quite drasticly, now i've checked with companions, they follow..they just take very long routes sometimes. All i've modified so far is vanilla places, the only thing i've done is changing LocationRefs and cellnames to better fit the mod im making, so the interior should then work with an esm. What if one incorporate the navmesh records into an esm only and let the rest be esp? I would like to keep the use of esm's to the minimal. I mean i've already modified the navmesh in the Tamriel worldspace, so i would have to modify skyrim.esm for that..and that won't happen, simple as that. My mod will be companion hostile and so shall it be. Unfortuantly im originally a NwN modder, so i have little experience with navmeshes other than what i learned now, i played fo3 and fnv, but never touched the G.E.C.K, and from what i remember from my oblivion modding i only added small things to excisting interior cells. Like previously mentioned i think a good solution is if we could get a script to refresh the navmesh somehow. Since mannequins also requires a navmesh this can be a real problem for some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mundoid Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 From what I can gather Mundoid there's not a lot you can do other than the ems workaround but by the sound of it it's not really ideal and sounds like a bit of a long winded workaround. I suppose if you're not changing any of the existing worldspace just making a one off dungeon that workaround should work for you but like you I personally wouldn't want to start messing around with that stuff if I wasn't totally sure what I was doing. Are you totally sure your navmeshs are correct though, the first time you go into your dungeon the navmeshs should work ok if they are correct, it's not till you go two cells away and come back when the bug kicks in? Hmm it is quite possible that my mesh is screwy. I am in the process of rebuilding once again. But going by the tutes I have watched and my own logical thinking it should have worked ok to start with. That's how I got here, because after it failed the third time I started to smell a bug, so I got all googly and found reports of this bug. It is astounding to me the complete lack of regard that Bethesda seems to be showing to the modding community, who by and large have repaired the broken game they released. I could have waited another year for a polished Skyrim, but I feel they rushed the release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mundoid Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 So what I have discovered is that if you turn clipping off in the console to go and have a look at the NPC's in action, they don't work properly. Just in case anyone else comes across this. Turned clipping back on and they work beautifully due to my overly refined navmesh. It wasn't a bug, it was MEEEE!!!! I am going to smash my face repeatedly into the desk now. Sooo much time wasted... But hey at least I can make a lean mean navmesh now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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