Cloned limbs on postmortem dismemberment.

[EPDGaffney]

You were interpreting me correctly, yes. Different .ini files had the same settings showing different things. I don't really remember for sure which files had the discrepancies but I kind of think any one of them was the odd one out depending on the setting. And yes, I mean they had the entry but it was set to a different value, not that some just didn't have the entry. For that matter, why do we even have three files that we edit? Is it possible just to edit one and copy and rename that file any time we make edits? As in, instead of editing three files, make the files all 100% identical by editing only one, and then copying that file and overwriting the other two. There's probably a good reason and you're probably going to tell me, but that'd pretty nice anyway.

 

I understand that there would be different .ini requirements for different systems. What I don't understand is why otherwise great guides (and especially really poor guides) will be so assertive and so sweeping, making claims that can't all be true as many of the claims from these great guides contradict the claims from the other great guides. Fear and Loathing in New Vegas is fantastic. Roy obviously knows what he's doing. And yet, I'm after giving you an example of things that could not possibly both be true. I'm more inclined to trust Roy, but where did Ess Arr Bee get that information from? How can I trust the rest of the recommended edits? Roy doesn't cover every .ini setting anywhere that I've seen, so if Ess Arr Bee does cover something, my thought would be to abide by it, but stuff like this makes me feel that there really is no way to know. In an ideal world, rather than saying X does Y, I'd have the guides say things like, 'We've tested and from what we can tell, this setting should be high if you have a lot of processing power and it will improve smoothness, but should be low otherwise,' or, 'This setting's effectiveness appears to be determined by processor speed, not cores, although some users have reported lag despite high-speed CPUs; most of them had Nvidia GPUs and we suspect the setting may not be as useful for Nvidia; try for yourself'. I mean, for example.

 

Anyway, I've a new load order. I'm testing and trying to make sure I like it before I start merging, but the game is incredibly laggy and is after freezing. I never used to have problems like this. My load order is now smaller and includes YUP. You're going to see one of the most famously unstable mods in here but I'm hoping I can use it henceforth, which is Freeside Open. Mind you, I was just past Goodsprings when my game froze, so it should have nothing to do with that. Another interesting thing is that since making this new load order I couldn't get the dismemberment bug to happen in interior cells, though I didn't have much opportunity to test. I haven't gone through my .ini files again however, so maybe some of that stuff would help (cloning is still set to 0, and some other stuff I set to 1 was probably a bad idea). Oh, I've just remembered that my Nvidia FPS overlay is on...maybe I should turn that off. Could you imagine that fixed all my lag? Here's the new load order:

FalloutNV.esm=1
HonestHearts.esm=1
DeadMoney.esm=1
OldWorldBlues.esm=1
LonesomeRoad.esm=1
GunRunnersArsenal.esm=1
MercenaryPack.esm=1
TribalPack.esm=1
ClassicPack.esm=1
CaravanPack.esm=1
YUP - Base Game + All DLC.esm=1
New Vegas Redesigned 3.esm=1
Casa Madrid Redesigned.esp=1
Gomorrah Redesigned v2.esp=1
MikotoBeauty.esm=1
ELECTRO-CITY - CompletedWorkorders.esm=1
ELECTRO-CITY - Highways and Byways.esm=1
Interior Lighting Overhaul - Core.esm=1
Interior Lighting Overhaul - L38PS.esm=1
Afterschool Special.esm=1
SomeguySeries.esm=1
DWCNV.esm=1
NVInteriors_Core.esm=1
NVInteriors_ComboEdition.esm=1
FreesideOpen.esm=1
Uncut Road to Legate's Camp.esm=1
YUP - NPC Fixes (Base Game + All DLC).esp=1
Convenient Fast Travel Markers.esp=1
ShaddapYaBleedinMutie.esp=1
CaesarsHead.esp=1
ShaddapYaBleedinTribal.esp=1
MusicRecovery.esp=1
Rat beats Squirrel.esp=1
MysteriousStrangerFix.esp=1
New Vegas Redesigned 3.esp=1
MikotoBeauty.esp=1
majormodder's Junk Food to Barbeque Crisps.esp=1
Improved Sound FX.esp=1
Improved Sound FX - Weapon Sharing Fix.esp=1
Improved Sound FX - Merged Major DLCs.esp=1
Improved Sound FX - GRA.esp=1
ADAM - NCR Patrol Armour.esp=1
NCRTrooperOverhaul.esp=1
TrooperOverhaul-Dragbody.esp=1
The Mod Configuration Menu.esp=1
boa ncrpahelmet.esp=1
Boacombat2glove.esp=1
dD - Enhanced Blood Main NV.esp=1
Cut Sewers Restored.esp=1
Casino Exchange All.esp=1
Strip Wall Billboards.esp=1
IMPACT.esp=1
ELECTRO-CITY - Darker Nights.esp=1
MiscItemIconsNV.esp=1
Fiendsfriend.esp=1
Extra-Characters---Fiends-Quest-ENABLED.esp=1
FastSleepNV.esp=1
NewVegasBounties.esp=1
TheInheritance.esp=1
KingOfTheRing.esp=1
NewVegasBountiesII.esp=1
Badmothaf*#@a.esp=1
NewVegasKiller.esp=1
Russell.esp=1
TheBetterAngels.esp=1
NewVegasBountiesIII.esp=1
Radio New Vegas Always Enabled.esp=1
TheBetterAngelsAmbientNoise.esp=1
RussellAmbientNoise.esp=1
NVBIIAmbientNoise.esp=1
NVBIIIAmbientNoise.esp=1
CheckpointGary.esp=1
CheckpointGaryAmbientNoise.esp=1
Uncut Bison Steve Trees.esp=1
Uncut Greenhouses.esp=1
BM Dish Explosion tab.esp=1
Lore Fix - Asian Daniel.esp=1
Less Assertive Raul Speech Check.esp=1
Grim Reaper's Sprint With Ranks.esp=1
ExtendedNVRadio.esp=1
kochandbohr.esp=1
athornysituation.esp=1
awilderwasteland.esp=1
lexx_brahmin-betsy.esp=1
outsidebets.esp=1
ProjectRealityMkIv5HDR.esp=1
CustomLighting.esp=1
CustomLighting II.esp=1
Radio Nuclear Winter Wonderland.esp=1
EVE FNV - ALL DLC.esp=1
BetterLoadingTextRedone.esp=1
Lanius Unleashed Hardcore.esp=1
Stealth Suit Configuration Menu.esp=1
Kobu's New Game Quick Start and Better Rebuild.esp=1
IntegratedFullDLC.esp=1
Passive Startup Messages.esp=1
FreesideOpenPatch.esp=1
Uncut Wasteland FSO OB.esp=1
Uncut Extra Collection FSO.esp=1
Interior Lighting Overhaul - Ultimate Edition.esp=1
The True Revival of Luxury - An Ultra-Luxe Overhaul.esp=1
Gloomy Sunday Best.esp=1

I do intend to merge a lot of this. I was just hoping that I could merge the majority of it into a couple of plug-ins, which I'd want to do only after I know it's good. Let me know if you think that's not such a good idea.

 

I know what you mean about adding/removing mods. That's why I wanted to finish that character's file before I did any of this. I've moved all my old saves to a different folder designating what mods they'd need if I ever wanted to go back to them (which I probably won't).

 

Thanks again.

 

Edit: It seems EssArrBee got his information from the author of NVAC, who consulted NVSE authors as well. This seems like a reliable source, and yet Roy very firmly states that anyone that says the AI threading tweaks are placebo is simply wrong. I wish there were a clear consensus in the modding community, at least amongst some of its most respected contributors.

Edited August 16, 2017 by EPDGaffney

[dubiousintent]

Yes, disable any overlays. They interfere with the game. I also recommend playing in "offline mode" and disabling "antivirus". Background processes of the operating system should be as minimal as you can get away with.

 

If you are suddenly getting lag with the same (or fewer) mods you were using before, most likely the issue is some INI tweak you missed. The "Checklist", "Performance", and "CTD" sections of the "Troubleshooting" guide have all of those I have been able to dig out of the web.

 

I also firmly believe nothing is better for resolving conflicts than installing and testing one mod at a time, after first prioritizing them. If you are freezing after leaving Goodsprings, then you need to toggle on "god mode" and race around to the various potential troublespots for each test. It's a long slow process, but then you are sure they will play together correctly, and which won't. Only then is it worthwhile to merge plugins.

 

As for the community advice: even Microsoft doesn't have the resources to test their software against every possible combination of hardware and software. (Which is why the big vendors conduct beta tests.) Why would you expect a community of volunteers to be able to do so? It would be nice, but frankly I'm happy we can just get some to post the results of their tests and experiences. There is a lot of information out there, but it is scattered to hell-and-gone. Which is why I started the "Troubleshooting" guide when I first got into FNV. Almost two years on and I'm still adding to it. New (to me) problems surface all the time.

 

-Dubious-

[EPDGaffney]

Just tested again with more conservative settings (I had risen the uGridsToLoad to 7 before, and all the corresponding settings; all are back to default). I have my audio cache up really high and sounds don't seem to get delayed as much (and then all happen simultaneously and explode in my ear). Could be unrelated obviously. So, I'm coming to think it may be time-based. Every time I play, my game eventually freezes after probably an hour or so. However, I can leave it on pause for a couple of hours, with the radio playing, and it won't cause any problems until I actually play it for a while after that. The AppHang log just points to FalloutNV.exe again.

 

Both of my recent freezes were in Freeside with Freeside Open installed, and I kind of expect trouble with that mod but I'd like to use it anyway and minimise the trouble. My problem is that I feel as if when it freezes, it's not under any more significant load than it had been before that. Leaving Goodsprings still drops frames a lot but not as bad as it did. It doesn't get unplayable for the moment or two that the FPS count is down.

 

Finally removed my FPS counter after that crash and haven't tested yet. Nvidia GeForce Experience requires a log-in now and I didn't want to give them that, and I was reminded that I was in the middle of that when I last gave up on turning off the counter. So, after chatting with one of their reps I was told that I literally couldn't turn it off without uninstalling it (or giving them personal information they can 'share with [their] business partners'). So I've done that. I tried the game for a moment and it already seems much smoother. Could be from some cached stuff, though. I'll have to do a more intensive test later.

 

Been using god mode for a couple of weeks now, testing all this stuff (my mod, the dismemberment, and now my freezing/crashing game). I never had this problem with freezing before I uninstalled the PCB mod. Now, I've never heard anything good about those, so I believe it's good that I've uninstalled mine, but I'd like to ask do you think my increased stability problems are in any way a result of uninstalling that or is it more likely just a coïncidence?

 

Funny you should mention offline mode and antivirus and all that, cos I honestly have always done none of that and had very little trouble. Kept my browser open with like 85 tabs, kept all background processes open, all that. My thinking was that the game could never use more than 4GB of RAM anyway, and I'm under the impression it won't even use all my CPU cores, so I suppose that never occurred to me. I'll try to reduce the overall load on my PC before my next test. Would you have any advice for Windows 10 with this game? Is there a compatibility setting that actually works? I really wish I'd just kept Windows 7...

 

On your last paragraph, I hope you don't think I meant any disrespect. On the contrary, if I respected Roy and the others as little as I respect Microsoft, being in this situation wouldn't surprise me. I don't even blame them, for the most part. I do wish some of the statements were slightly less overarching, but what I really meant is that I'm just surprised that the information hasn't surfaced in one way or another, even if it were from someone that had worked on the game or someone from Bethesda or something. It's not as if they've never come out and helped with other technical stuff. I was speaking out of surprise, not anger or disrespect. I have immense respect for people like Roy and Ess Arr Bee and Queue and yourself, and I'm grateful that we have the kind of community we have where we (more or less) help each other just to be helpful.

[dubiousintent]

Generally, when a game freezes after a fairly regular amount of time, it is an indication it has exhausted memory. This is often the result of a "memory leak", where one or more programs (in either background or foreground) keep requesting more memory until the system runs out, instead of releasing memory as it isn't needed. As mentioned in post #8, the "faulting app" is often the victim rather than the cause. Any number of programs and updates (even from MS) can cause this. Reducing the number of apps running is one way to reduce the risk of this. (Browsers are fairly notorious for memory leaks.)

 

Suggest you search online for "win10 memory leak" and see if any previously reported might be at fault. Among other things, they will give you an idea as to how to track them down.

 

Edit: Set FNV to run in "Vista SP2" compatibility mode on Win 10. It may not solve your problem, but has proven helpful when running the GECK as most like the environment the game was designed for.

 

-Dubious-

Edited August 17, 2017 by dubiousintent

[EPDGaffney]

So, played for almost two hours, testing some of the mods I think I'd like to have as foundational changes to the game. You wouldn't believe the difference since taking off the overlay (or maybe you would). No lag leaving Goodsprings even. I had to quit the game myself rather than waiting for it to crash. It was unbelievable. The weird thing is I put that FPS counter on ages ago and the game used to run fine, but if it works now, no arguing with that I suppose.

 

Freeside Open is highly unstable and I'm considering not using it. Is there any known (to you) way of making mods like this more stable? Can I edit it myself in some way?

 

Still have the cloning limbs, though I noticed New Vegas Redesigned 3 adds some corpses that don't do this. This makes no sense to me because even non-humanoid enemies will clone their limbs if dismembered after dying.

 

Will try that compatibility setting when I do another test. Thanks for all your help so far.

[dubiousintent]

I have no experience with the mod itself, but as the author of "Freeside Open" cautions, it puts a lot of strain on a game engine that is already stressed. I would only attempt "Freeside Open" (or any similar restoration of cut content) if the rest of my game setup was rock solid. If you are having any issues without it, why would you expect them to suddenly get any better? Using only "vanilla" low-res textures and maybe lower screen resolution to free up video memory is about all you can do to lighten the load.

 

The limb cloning issue is very strange. Wish I had something to suggest, but as I haven't found it being reported before yours: "mod isolation" once the game is otherwise stable is all that seems available.

 

-Dubious-

[EPDGaffney]

You ready for something that can only be described as mental? I restored my game to 100% vanilla by renaming all the folders, including Nexus Mod Manager's, and I renamed the .ini files and the load order file, and I rebuilt the game by verifying the cache with Steam. So, default .ini, default graphics, no BSAs unpacked, default everything. Still have cloning limbs.

 

However, it served as a good reminder of what I'm modding. I got a bit of lag coming out of Goodsprings, just as with my heavily modded game, for example. The sky and roads and grass looked surprisingly pretty good. The characters and blood and buildings look mostly awful, however. Doc Mitchell actually looks great. Pretty interesting. I thought it was going to be horrendous-looking, as I haven't had a good look at the vanilla game since 2010. Load screen times weren't actually great, though they were better.

 

As for why I'm getting cloned limbs, is there any possible step you can think of that I may have missed in restoring it to vanilla? I really don't think so, but I almost hope so. If I did indeed restore it right, that rules out mod conflicts and .ini settings. That pretty much leaves us with Windows 10 and Nvidia drivers, unless I'm missing something. Of course, Windows 10 being the lovely beast it is, I can't uninstall an update and test my game's functionality on older versions of Windows 10. However, I'll try that compatibility setting next. Forgot all about that. And my other choice is to try various Nvidia drivers. None of that really sounds like the answer, but I'm willing to try.

 

I should go back on what I said earlier: subsequent tests cloned the limbs of the same corpses added by NVR3. No idea why it didn't that one other time.

 

I meant maybe actually editing the Freeside Open mod in the G.E.C.K. or something. Like, in a perfect world, you maybe would have told me that its fluff NPC script is bloated and if I disable just that it would work fine. As for what I actually expected however, no, I didn't really expect anything. I was just hoping. It does feel great to look down these sprawling streets and to see so much activity all over the place, not to mention all the violence that sort of drives home what a lot of the characters claim, which is that you need a bodyguard and that there's a heated conflict.

 

Anyway, I'm really confused about the limbs now. Can't wait to see what you think of that. Thanks a million for sticking with me.

[dubiousintent]

The only thing I can see that you might have missed is the registry. (Though I have no idea why that would affect limb cloning.) The other is that "verify" doesn't really clean up mod files, though renaming the folders should have taken them out of the picture. To really clear out your old game you would need to uninstall the game through Steam, delete any remnant files and folders the uninstall process left behind, re-install to a new path, and start a new character just for testing. Please see the 'Restoring to "Vanilla"' section of the wiki "FNV General Mod Use Advice" article. Be sure to install elsewhere than the default Steam location.

 

After going to all that trouble, take your time rebuilding. Install and test one mod at a time. I waited on all mods not essential to a new character until after I had created one and actually left Doc's place the first time. Test the heck out of that until you are sure that minimal setup is stable. Then proceed slowly. You have something specific to test for, so you know you need to test that situation. But also check for other things that might potentially cause problems down the road.

 

Goodsprings can initially be a bit laggy because lots of scripts don't start until you exit Doc's (interior cell) place. (Things like the WMX "Cheat Chest" if you install it as an example.) Let them get done initializing before saving and then you shouldn't see the lag for subsequent tests. Be sure to get beyond the border of Goodsprings in your tests to see what happens during cell transitions. (Be sure to turn off the default game "auto-save" settings.)

 

Once you are satisfied with your testing, assuming you have the disk space, copy the game "Data" folder to another name to use for testing new additions. Create a new character for play, and try to avoid making any changes to that game. Period. If you do feel you have to make changes, test adding them to your backed up "Data" folder (rename your current game folder something like "Data-current", and rename the backup to "Data"), test like crazy, then rename the folder back and add to your current game.

 

Above all, take your time. Trying to take shortcuts and speed up the process is how people get into trouble.

 

-Dubious-

Edited August 18, 2017 by dubiousintent

[EPDGaffney]

Fully restored to vanilla, glitch still occurs. With Vista SP2 and vanilla, glitch still occurs. I honestly believe it's something to do with one of the recent Windows 10 updates. Other people got crashes after it and had to roll back their GPU drivers. Maybe this happened to me instead? I'll experiment with my own drivers next.

 

Have you heard of this bug? It's at the bottom of the list, the only New Vegas one. I only mention it because that's how the heads look for my glitch. I imagine it's at least tangentially related. Any idea what caused it? I think it was patched out by 2011 or so.

http://www.cracked.com/article_19507_the-8-creepiest-glitches-hidden-in-popular-video-games.html

 

If I don't fix it soon, I think I'm just going to give up. Knowing that it occurs even with the vanilla version of the game means my mods are essentially fine, more or less, so I'm no longer worried I'm destroying my game (at least not without help from my own OS or something), and I don't be decapitating dead people, so it may not even crop up if I don't look for it.

 

Appreciate all the help. I'll post back if i ever fix it.

 

Edit: Updating to newest drivers didn't do anything. Next up is to try very old ones.

 

Edit 2: Used 368.81 and saw no difference. I used to run this game great with those. So weird.

Edited August 18, 2017 by EPDGaffney

[dubiousintent]

Wouldn't be the first time a Windows update screwed over a system. Reverting to prior to the last update is relatively easy. However, you may lose all the hard work you put into rebuilding the game folders.

 

Windows system updates automatically create a "Windows restore checkpoint" after installing. You might want to try reverting to the checkpoint before the last one and see if your problem goes away. That is a reasonable indication that you are having a problem related to a recent update. In which case you might want to wait until the next update to see if they correct the problem.

 

-Dubious-