Understanding How HDT Works

[Tooneyman]

Alright I'm going to be asking a few questions. Whether the community engages me and helps me learn will be a different story. I've recently started to use blender. If anyone knows of my channel on youtube. You'll see kind of where I'm at right now. I'm very interested in learning idle and body animations.. However, I'm particularly interested in HDT animations and how they work on the technical spectrum. Now this may get very complicated, but I want you to help me break it down like I'm a four year old, because I'm a bit technically savy, but still a baby dipping his toe down a very large rabbit whole. If you're willing to engage me. Something amazing may come out of this discussion. If you choose to ignore me. It may take longer instead of quicker to achieve what I'm thinking I might be able to do. However, it will take some tech people in this community to help me understand the steps and limitations. However, first things first... I want to know the gears before first because I can start to connect pieces.

 

Right now I've just figured out how to port Skyrim nifs into Blender 2.78c and am able to get it working. I've gotten Groovtama's SSE skeleton aligned with the body and am hoping soon I can get all the bones connected to the mesh and start to play with them. Once I'm able to start figuring out how to create animations and then port them to SSE. I'm going to look at creating some bouncy type animations without stupid idles and annoying walk cycles. Yes!.. Annoying walking cycles. I hate them... I hate them with a passion. I'm going to see about creating normal walking cycles with a bit of bounce. However...Before I start. I've got to learn the gears first before I can build the machine.

 

Alright time for some questions. When a mesh is created for HDT... Are animations attached or are scripts attached to the mesh which allow it to bounce or give it movement?

 

I know you need a script to make it run.. But to get the bounce... Are the animations attached to the mesh?

 

Second is it possible to create animations separate from the mesh you can use to create movement from the character? I've noticed you can get bounce with Dragonfly TBBP... Oh, that annoying idle and walk... (No I will not stop complaining about it.)

 

I'm asking these specific questions because I've noticed with a body and a model I've converted. I've been able to get movement and bouncing in Skyrim SE. However,... These animations are separate from HDT which I think are built into the mesh. If the animations are built into the mesh.. I'm wondering if there is a way create a trigger like animated clutter to allow for bounce...

 

or could it be possible to create a bounce animations the same way rustic potions mod was created.. Where their mesh is animated, but didn't need a trigger.

 

These will be scrambled questions and may sound confusing, but slowly I'll start to make sense. My brain is trying to figure out a correct method about how I'm going to see about implementing my bounce animations to the players body. There are a few factors which may work. Not just one scenario.

 

Where I'm going with this-

Now the animations I've converted was CHSBHC body to Skyrim SE and the breasts bounce quite well. However... the breasts only bounce while the rest of the body didn't. The breasts only bounce without the clothes.

 

Here is a example of the conversion I did to get CHSBHC to work in the SSE game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Z3BGuSEnmc

 

I'm thinking there maybe a method where hand man animations like this could be utilized and later have something like bodyslide replicate the animations for any body. It would require an outside script to change the animations from body to body. But if successful. We'd be able to get breast physics like CHSBHC into Skyrim SE and maybe possibly other animations. I really want to see hair physics animations again and I think CHSBHC and an outside script program might be able to make it possible. All we could do is maybe run a script through SSEEdit and it would attach the animations to a new hair or body in bodyslide and give it the bounce it would need to create the physics.

 

Anyway, if anyone would like to engage me in this conversation. It would much appreciate it. The good news is you might not even needs FNIS to get this to work.

[fore]

HDT has NOTHING to do with animations. HDT is a functionality of Havok Physics which is added through SKSE functions, skeleton and mesh modifications.

 

Noone has been able to bring HDT to SSE, because of missing SKSE64. Obviously. I'm not very familiar with HDT, but due to the missing availability of the 64bit Havok Physics I even have some doubts whether it will be possible to have full HDT available even when SKSE64 exists.

 

And CHSBHC has NOTHING to do with physics. I know the author has self proclaimed it that way, but that's plain wrong. It's nothing but adding some bones (breast, butt) to be used by augmented animations.

 

And there is NO way to attach separate animations to a mesh. The only way to add bouncing is to modify EXISTING animations. The same way Dragonfly has done with his animations. And to do this somewhat realistic is very difficulty. Due to the technical limitation one has when adding bounce. I know from own experience. And therefore I'm getting annoyed when people who have no merits at all and need information on 4 year old level (as you said yourself) bash at modders who have DONE something. "Oh, that annoying idle and walk... (No I will not stop complaining about it.)" Prove that you can do it better.

[Tooneyman]

Fore thank you very much for the break down. This helps me immensely. Please understand I will never bash a fellow animator. Even a simple hand gesture could take weeks to get right and it will never be perfect. I give much respect to them for creating what we have and am grateful to you and every modder in the community for the tools we have. Thank you for breaking this down for me to understand. This gives me a good idea and someone of a start path to maybe create

 

Alright so HDT is a hook for havok 32bit which I know the tools were taken away from the community apparently since havok was bought by microsoft.

 

Now what dragonfly does is alter existing animations and allows the movement for the breasts and butt in the game... Are there only a number of animations you can add to the existing ones or could you create a new one in the CK add. I know you can add animations through the bottom layer. That would need something like an Open CK in order to get animations plugged in if I'm correct...

 

Cherry's are basically bones, but from what the word is they interfere with the advanced skeleton and can cause issues with clothes physics?

 

And I have one more question if you wouldn't mind giving an answer.. I'd appreciate your advice or anyone who could help me with this..

 

Is this groovtama's XP32 skeleton and what it looks like in nifskope or has the skeleton become corrupted?

 

Edited August 28, 2017 by Tooneyman

[RyuSaiDragoon]

Hey, everyone that does modding has my respect no matter what game it is. I haven't made my own mod but when I was looking at some info on how to create mods being curious about it, and it looked so complicated that I wouldn't know heads from tails. :wallbash: :psyduck: Just hearing about how long some people take to make a mod has my respect because I know that it takes time, effort, and dedication to make even a simple mod. So now matter what you guys/gals hear. All of you take pride in your work because without any of you we'd be stuck with generic games and get bored with them. When you make mods it brings back enjoyment to those who have played it before and it rekindles that flame to play it again. It's been years since I have played skyrim and with all these different mods made me want to play it again. Sorry for the long post but I have noticed that a lot of people don't stop and thank the modding community for all their hard work, so again thank all of you modders out there for making gaming fun, enjoyable, and different. :laugh: :wink: :thumbsup: :cool: