Exiting my modded Breezehome causes the game to crash

[Ayameep]

I am very new at modding and this is in fact my first attempt at playing with the Creation Kit or modding in general. I wanted to improve Breezehome so I could have a player house in my favourite location, decorated and improved exactly the way I wanted it.

 

I haven't had any major problems so far in creating my mod apart from this one major issue:

 

Even though I believe I have done everything the tutorials and guides tell me to do when linking my created cell (improved Breezehome) to the world (the exact original place of the house in Whiterun), the game still crashes every time I use the door to exit Breezehome. It however does not crash when I enter the house, and I have tried looking what might be causing the problem but I have no idea whatsoever even where to start fixing this.

 

I'd appreciate if I could get some help with fixing the problem or some pointers to where I could find info on what I've probably broken and is causing the crashes.

 

Edit: Just for the sake of testing attempted entering and exiting the house without any companion, game still crashes.

 

Also for clarification, the Breezehome mod I made has a basement built in that is not linked with a hatch on the floor or anything, it's directly connected to the house. I have heard that doing any larger modifications to existing buildings can cause problems, so could my adding a new floor to the house have broken something?

Edited March 9, 2012 by Ayameep

[Hosidax]

I have just had the exact same experience. Very frustrating.

 

What you wrote was precisely what I was just getting ready to write. our situations are identical, I am sad to say. I have some questions for you:

 

Did you delete any of the pre existing elements of the breezehome house? I did, and found that they came up through the floor in in spite of the fact that they did not exist in my mod. For instance if you delete the fire in the floor and re enter the house with a save the fire will still be in the floor. So the lesson there is not delete any elements but simply to move them out of the house or replace them with new objects that you're going to use in the mod.

 

Did you move the house wholesale to any other place in the cell? I did. In order to get away from the fire in the floor.

 

Did you modify any other parts of the house besides cutting out a spot int the floor and adding a basement? I did. About the only thing that is the same as the original breezehome in my mod is the walls are mostly the same.

 

Did you keep, replaced, reconnect the enable activation feature for any items in the house? (They connect to the red x's) I tried to keep all of those connections at their default and match my additions to what was appropriate for the original. But I did change many of them.

 

Did you redo the navmesh? I did. I wanted my follower and the house carl to follow me down stairs. I understand there are problems with a navmesh mods.

 

I'm going to experiment with backing out of my changes a little at a time and see if any of them fix the situation. It's a very disappointing to be able to go into the house and poke around but then have the game crash when I try to leave. If I learn of anything I will post it back here. I sure would like to know what the heck is going on so that I can avoid it and use the cool house I made.

[Tamb0]

NVM, just read the second post.

Is the mod online? if so, please link.

Edited March 14, 2012 by Tamb0

[Hosidax]

NVM, just read the second post. Is the mod online? if so, please link.

 

No, It's the first major work I've done, and it has a few other flaws (like wacky weapons plaques).

Here is a screen shot of the main floor from the kitchen area next the Alchemy room. I shortened it and took the stupid fireplace out of the floor. The basement stairs can be seen as well.

I had hoped to eventually upload it as a mod on the Nexus. If I put it up somewhere, is there a chance someone could troubleshoot the problem for me?

[Ayameep]

Hey there.

 

I eventually got fed up with trying to figure out what was wrong and restarted the whole job (deleted the old mod and started a completely fresh one), everything worked fine for a while and then all the problems started again, so got pissed off and deleted the second one too, so I don't unfortunately have either of my Breezehome mods anymore :confused:

 

As to your questions..

 

Did you delete any of the pre existing elements of the breezehome house? I did, and found that they came up through the floor in in spite of the fact that they did not exist in my mod. For instance if you delete the fire in the floor and re enter the house with a save the fire will still be in the floor. So the lesson there is not delete any elements but simply to move them out of the house or replace them with new objects that you're going to use in the mod.

 

Yes, pretty much everything except the actual house, and I removed the fire pit on the floor and added a proper fireplace. None of the deleted items appeared in the house and the fire and fire pit were gone when I checked in game. When I was testing the second attempt of the mod I used a save where I had not yet bought the house so I went and bought it + all the additional things you can buy before I entered it, so the house was 100% unused and had not had any other mods when I entered it the first time.

 

Did you move the house wholesale to any other place in the cell? I did. In order to get away from the fire in the floor.

 

The first time I did, second time I made sure not to move anything at all around the doorway and the doors teleport marker, just in case I had messed up something there.

 

Did you modify any other parts of the house besides cutting out a spot int the floor and adding a basement? I did. About the only thing that is the same as the original breezehome in my mod is the walls are mostly the same.

 

I extended the bedroom slightly to the space that was left blank in the original house over the living room. In the first attempt the basement was in the same cell as the rest of the house, second attempt it was in a different cell (connected with a teleport door which worked just fine every time). For the basement I added steps down to a small area (one floorsquare) and a door. As mentioned earlier, I removed the fire pit in the living room and added a proper fireplace near the kitchen.

 

Did you keep, replaced, reconnect the enable activation feature for any items in the house? (They connect to the red x's) I tried to keep all of those connections at their default and match my additions to what was appropriate for the original. But I did change many of them.

 

First time I didn't do anything with the enable activation because I was still learning what things in the CK did and didn't dare to fiddle about with stuff too much. Second time I had learnt about the enable activation feature and did modify furniture with that it, but did nothing to any actual parts of the house (walls, doors and such).

 

Did you redo the navmesh? I did. I wanted my follower and the house carl to follow me down stairs. I understand there are problems with a navmesh mods.

 

I redid navmesh as well, and actually ran the tool that lets you find any possible problems with navmesh, and it never alerted of any problems, however when I had Lydia following me around the house she sometimes did not move properly, or follow me at all.

[Tamb0]

[..., is there a chance someone could troubleshoot the problem for me?

No prob, just upload it somewhere and post a link. I'll take a look at it. (probably others as well)

[Hosidax]

Thanks for your reply, Ayameep. I'm betting there is something going on with modding pre-existing player home cells, like once they reach a certain level of complexity they just crap out. I saved progressive versions of my esp over the week or so while I worked on it, so I was able to go back and look at the differences between the copies that are crash-on-exit, and the earlier versions that are still good. Here's what I have found so far:

 

The wacky containers (duplicated weapons plaques and unresponsive copied bookshelves) exist in both the "non-exitable" and the "exitable" versions - so that ain't it.

The unaltered navemesh version crashes just liked the re-meshed version (btw unresponsive housecarls in re-meshed houses seems to be a known bug that dates back to Fallout) - so that ain't it.

The version from before I moved the house (about 500 "clicks" -- <select all, and drag>) crashes just like the moved version - so that ain't it.

 

It's all inconclusive, but i don't have a command of most of the capabilities of the CK, let alone a deep understanding of what going on inside the esp.

 

I think MAYBE (...?) The one big difference between the esp file that crashes on exit and the one that does not, is the amount of complexity and detail I've added. My non-crashing version has deleted stuff, and a full open basement, but not a lot of stuff in the basement yet (5 mannequins and chests), and the file size is about 108meg. The crash-on-exit version has 5 Noble book-cases with 11-13 "activated" books spaces on each shelf (almost 300 book spaces, I think) a lot more clutter, another fireplace, and full lighting -- the filesize for that version is 166megabytes.

 

I've attached a zip file with the crashing and non-crashing versions. I invite anyone who might have more experience than me to look at the files and tell me what's gone wrong...

 

CK is cool and everything, but I really feel like I've wasted my time and I don't feel much like even going back to the game right now...

[Hosidax]

[..., is there a chance someone could troubleshoot the problem for me?

No prob, just upload it somewhere and post a link. I'll take a look at it. (probably others as well)

 

Thanks TambO,

When I posted earlier for some reason I didn't see your post. I've attached a zip file my previous post above this.. i'll keep an eye on this spot, so if you are able to give any advice it is much appreciated. Cheers.

[Hosidax]

Well I don't know how to solve the problem, but I think I know what is causing the CTD on exiting my modded Breezehome. Plus I found some other weirdness.

 

Somehow it's related to the bookshelves, When I delete the bookshelf containers I built from the house mod, I no longer get the crash when I exit. Here is another thread that mentions the same problem (there a few, do a forum search for "Breezehome" to find more). Need help with Door Problem

 

That thread mentions that people have reported problems with Breezehome when you add more bookshelf activators or ambient light sources. I found another separate thread that mentioned that any Breezehome house mod esp that was larger than 125k would CTD when you try to exit. I found that to be exactly true in my case. I deleted a bunch of clutter additions from my mod, and deleted all but one of my bookshelf containers - the mod file was 120k or so and I could exit. If I added a couple of bookshelf activator/container groups and the esp file size went above 125k, then I got the crash again. Even with the smaller version however, if I filled the shelf container left with any books then I would still get the CTD when leaving the house.

 

I also tried creating a separate esp that stacked with my house and only had containers in it -- each esp smaller than 125k, but the results were no different once I loaded a few books into a container.

 

This made me think that the problem has to do with AutoSave on exiting (files size changes seeming to be a common variable for the crash/no-crash on exit), so I turned off "Autosave on Travel" in the game settings menu. Now when I exit the house there is no CTD, but I am dumped into a grey void that looks like an empty cell. All Whiterun sound is still present - it was raining and and I could get hear myself running - and I could get the console to come up, but it was all in a grey void, I had no 3rd person view either. Then just for kicks I consoled "COC Whiterun", and was immediately popped outside in Skyrim as if nothing had happened. I fast traveled back to the gate, but then CTD'd when I attempted to re-enter Breezehome. I have repeated this a couple of times, so it is consistent. I've also tried older saves from lower levels, waiting ten days, running to distant cells, and fast traveling away and back again. The results are the same.

 

Anyway I just wanted to relay my experience here to help anyone else that might contemplate wasting their time trying to figure this out.

I'm just going to dump all my books in a pile on the floor (maybe on that stupid f*ing fire pit) and go back to playing the game.

 

I'm done with modding for now. I hope Beth or someone can fix this. This has been not at all rewarding.

[Tamb0]

..., is there a chance someone could troubleshoot the problem for me?

Ok, I had a look, WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED ???? It looked like a bomb had gone off. No wonder the game CTD.

 

Didn't really find anything wrong, apart from several things missing. It's generally not a good idea to go messing with the in-game sets. Add a few thing, sure, but don't start taking the house apart. That's just asking for trouble.

 

If you want to expand, Its better to add another cell expansion, rather than adding to the existing cell. Even removing a piece of flooring and expand downstair.

 

Oh,...and get that mess cleaned up. :D