A Requiem for the Capital Wasteland - Areas of Foucs and Merger Wanted

[Deleted2547005User]

I know this thread has been really on fire lately, and I've been keeping upon it, but I'll have to wait a bit before responding until I get the next update for the Prototype ready. However, I just had this though that I put up on the testers whiteboard five minutes ago.

 

"Gnubee, mkureth & Ugsquish

 

I have come up with a solution to the difficulty issue for high level players arriving to the D.C. or Mojave. It involves the most important record in the game, the Default Object Manager. This solution will only work for NPCs and creatures, but it can be expanded for locks and etc. given enough time.

 

The DOM contains all the information for game to use as defaults. In the Prototype, it has been updated and fixed. This has added some new abilities to the player, which isn’t very noticeable – by design – but can be seen from time to time.

 

Only one of the 25+ Default Objects is unassigned, which is the most important one – Every Actor Ability. I.e. perk. If I were to add a perk to this field, every single NPC and creature will have this perk. With some rather complex scripting and possibly NVSE, I can create a perk system that will increase the challenge the player will face depending on his/her level. The best thing about this is that everyone will get this boost, which means that no one becomes more powerful than any one else, everything stays the way it should be, just at higher levels. So level 40+ players can start at Goodsprings and face stronger creatures and NPCs than they normally would. This perk script can be coded to omit the player so as they may have the perk, but it does nothing for them."

[athense]

Hey i write the Fan series for the Mothership Zeta Mod for fallout 3. I use requiem as a bridge to advance the origin story of the commander by having him go to new vegas. I had my own idea of him traveling to the west, but i could use yours but how close are you going to keep it. Also i always saw that if the best choices were made the super mutant threat was down and enclave were practically gone that a goverment would eventually for like a pre-NCR like coalition. I was going to have the LW eventually return after making about halfway through the NV story and see how things have developed. will you incorperate some sort of goverment faction maybe centered on Rivet city as the main hold out. Also if you have not heard of it the MZC mod might make a great secondary integration for a way to get to NV.

here is the list of the fan series. I am still at the begining of the orgiin story so i can still change my concepts.

here it is.

http://fallout3.nexusmods.com/users/2418326

its under pictures

Also a suggestion maybe if the quest does not work why not a movie sequence to move things along. to the point of NV.

also what is the Bad company's biff with the brotherhood especially lyons.

as for the transfer, just have the courier office tell you to keep a low profile(ie light armor), you can save the stuff you want to keep in a box which you can retrieve when you reach primm. as for items. just have doc mitchell give it back to you when he gives you the stating items.

Edited April 17, 2012 by athense

[vindr20]

Hey i write the Fan series for the Mothership Zeta Mod for fallout 3. I use requiem as a bridge to advance the origin story of the commander by having him go to new vegas. I had my own idea of him traveling to the west, but i could use yours but how close are you going to keep it. Also i always saw that if the best choices were made the super mutant threat was down and enclave were practically gone that a goverment would eventually for like a pre-NCR like coalition. I was going to have the LW eventually return after making about halfway through the NV story and see how things have developed. will you incorperate some sort of goverment faction maybe centered on Rivet city as the main hold out. Also if you have not heard of it the MZC mod might make a great secondary integration for a way to get to NV.

here is the list of the fan series. I am still at the begining of the orgiin story so i can still change my concepts.

here it is.

http://fallout3.nexusmods.com/users/2418326

its under pictures

Also a suggestion maybe if the quest does not work why not a movie sequence to move things along. to the point of NV.

 

As difficult as that movie sequence may sound, it's not really all that bad of an idea. If you just take some NPCs, dress them as you will, and take a screen shot of them, a faceless courier, and the scenery, you might be able to string those along to make a HQ backstory that doesn't bore people too easily.

I'd personally enjoy playing it more, but this would make a good backup, or even an optional replacement.

[ulera]

As someone who plans on installing the mod but hasn't yet I would like to see you take a leaf out of Morroblivion's book and allow the player to choose their own start.(Capital Wasteland or Nevada)

 

Also, considering that they are half a country away... maybe change the world transporter from a sewer tunnel to a vertibird or a teleporter of some kind. Heck, it might be sort of fun if the teleporter was a crashed alien ship like the one in mother ship zeta.

 

 

Other than that this looks promising... keep up the good work.

[Dysthe]

I would not allow the player to choose their start. New Vegas takes place four years after the conclusion of Broken Steel. It is possible that the Lone Wanderer became the Courier, but it not possible that the Courier was the Lone Wanderer.

 

If you were to create a transition between the games, I would follow the canon stringently. The Courier has never heard of Chicago, but has heard of Illinois. The Courier has been to Montana, Utah, California and Colorado. Thus the journey would consist go from the Capital Wasteland (Virginia) to Kentucky to the Tip of Illinois to to Missouri to Kansas to Colorado to Utah, with some DRASTIC EXCURSION into Wyoming and Montana, and then back to Utah through the top of Nevada over to California. The Lone Wanderer went back and forth between Nevada and California until the beginning of the New Vegas storyline.

 

There are specific locations named: New Reno, Lake Mead, Circle Junction, Vault City, Zion Park, Fort Abandon, Big Circle...

 

I would assume at the end of Broken Steel that the Lone Wanderer had to leave the city that reminded him/her of his/her father, and had decided to journey West. The Wanderer clearly followed the railroads into Colorado (because he/she met the iron liners and went to the central junction). Along the way, I would assume the Lone Wanderer found out whether President Eden was telling the truth about Kentucky, briefly encountered the Brotherhood of Steel in Illinois, dealt with Super mutants and Brotherhood in Missouri and Kansas, first met the Legion in Colorado and went through Legion territory to the Denver junction, had a disastrous encounter with Legion, Tribals or Raiders (possibly he/she was taken in as a prisoner or slave) and was brought out of his/her way to Wyoming, where the Wanderer encountered the Great Khans. During this excursion, the Wanderer briefly went into Montana, where he had a dalliance with a lady-friend as mentioned in the dialog, before returning down to Utah. The Wanderer traveled through Zion Park for the first time through Utah. Then the Wanderer went through the top of Nevada over to California, explored California for a while on his/her own terms or through the Mojave express, and then went back into Nevada for the events of the Divide. I would assume that the Lone Wanderer was tired and/or broke at the end of the journey from DC, thus requiring his/her service to the Mojave express (and possibly the caravans -- Vault City, Reno, and Big Circle are a part of the caravan loop). Or the delivery was an errand, like so many of the other quests the Wanderer had completed for people, that he or she had thought nothing of it. On a later trip, the Wanderer found him/herself on the end of a delivery gone wrong, thus beginning the events of New Vegas.

 

This is the story I would make. It is the simplest and truest to canon that I can think of, bearing into account all the information we know of the Courier. It was a little difficult to mitigate the 17 year part for the male Lady Killer courier's interaction with the Lonesome drifter, but I think it's feasible the Courier got his timeline wrong after the bump in the head.

 

To reconcile the DC companions that come with the Wanderer, I would create a small quest after the wakeup in Goodsprings, asking the Courier to meet them. I would assume that they would have gone to different locations around the Mojave after the Wanderer's death. (Butch: Freeside, Fawkes: Jacobstown, Paladin Cross: Brotherhood, etc) If you provided dialogue for this new encounter, obviously some of the companions would be confused at the Courier's apparent loss of identity. (How does Cross work for a Courier that doesn't even remember their father?) I think there would be very different reactions.

 

If I were to create this transition, I would also keep in mind the end. It isn't just enough we think of the transition over there, but also the effect on the game as a whole. Bearing this in mind, I would either create a game past the end game (ala Broken Steel) or create an endgame scenario. It is crucial that the Courier discovers who she/he was. I would have someone from the Courier's DC past travel to the Mojave to find the Courier. It could be a friend or a former adversary. I suggest Sarah Lyons, (because she expressed the most affection for the Wanderer and knows the route to California) but in the event of an Enclave or Lyons-dead character, someone else would have to come. I think it's vital that the Courier chooses who he/she really is, in the end. The journey to New Vegas was a move away from the Wanderer's past, but the journey in New Vegas was to find his/her past. What was the sense behind it all? What resolution has the Courier and Wanderer come to? Will they improve DC? Will they stay with New Vegas? Have they gotten over their father? What will they do with all cards in their hand?

 

What impact can a single man have?

Edited April 17, 2012 by Dysthe

[Deleted2547005User]

In the official release of the Prototype, there will be no option where to start, because the coding behind it is too faulty and constantly glitches. But I won't take that away from the player. To start on one end of the country or the other, you will have to change a variable in the Fallout.ini file. It's incredibly easy to do and the most stable way to start the game, all of the rest is handled by the integrated travel mod so you won't become stuck when you approach Doc Mitchel and Vault 101 will be locked.

 

As for the addon travel mod, I'm not concerned overmuch by canon and lore. I won't break it, but why should I limit myself to what is set in stone? Along the whole path of the Lone Wanderers journey, I constantly remind the player of Fallout lore. You met the Midwestern Brotherhood, the iconic Denver, the Enclave in Chicago, and the Courier's Mile. I see nothing wrong with adding new groups and new, original locations for the Fallout world. Having the player run around all over the west to follow every little reference to their past, a past the player can choose to have or not, takes away from the journey and New Vegas. In New Vegas, the Courier's past is deliberately left blank, and there are many occasions in the game for the player to choose the events in there own past. Lonesome Road is the only place were solid history is made for the player, all while they were a courier, never about their origins. The transition won't take four years, and the story will skip forward during the Lone Wanderers time in the NCR as a courier, so it's logical to assume in that time the courier traveled to those locations when the correct dialog is chosen.

 

When the player returns to the Capital Wasteland, they are immediately bombarded with the consequences of their actions. Is Elder Lyons still alive, has the Purifier been tainted, and did the player do any of the extra quests and how did their actions affect the Capital? Even with all of that on the player's plate, they also now face new antagonists and protagonists and their actions will depend on what the player has done to the Capital Wasteland. One of the little extras to the addon travel mod is to show what else, and who else is out there in world, adding a little more to the world of Fallout. Some of it may seem weird, or even farfetched when I've (well me, Vurumai and the community) got the entire thing lined out before the team starts official work on it, but it all tries to fit within the confines of possibility and reason.

[pwinkle]

I was thinking about the ideas mentioned for Tenpenny Tower as few pages back and personally love the idea of there being a workers settlement based outside the walls of the main compound.

Outside = A town of trodden down, hard but friendly individuals who're ready to treat anybody right who does the same to them.

Inside = A society of the snobbish 'elite', have no actual contact with the outside world, all their needs are catered to them by the workers.

 

I'd personally love to see the idea of revolution being expanded to include the settlement based outside the wall as well, still keep Roy Phillips as the leader, but he's more of a Che Guevera type person now, looking to right a wrong and overthrow a corrupt government to make things better for his people (even if it is secretly to get the life the previous rulers had).

Say you have to do a few speech checks to 'Inspire' a few key members of the worker faction, in order to get their support during the revolution. (Just general, repurposed dialogue, nothing fancy or new needed).

Cause I'll be honest it felt kind of like you were swapping one bad for another in the original quest, if you stormed the tower there was never any humans to be found in it afterwards and they all started to walk around in fancy clothes, living the exact same lives the previous occupant had. I'd always imagined it becoming a big hardworking settlement, designed around the ideas of equality and hard work.

They would all still keep their old jobs, but it would be for their own collective benefit now, not for the the 'overlords'.

 

I kinda alwas liked the idea of making it more like the Mexican revolutions you saw in the old cowboy movies, the best example I can actually think of that most people could instantly understand would be in red dead redemption though... Like so:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdcLF_-3S2w

 

I honestly think this would make the whole experience so much better for players on both sides of the fence.

If the play is going for the evil/bigoted/merciless character they'd like the idea of lording it up over the workers and seeing the revolution crushed... Comfy living at any cost to others

If the player is going for the Good/'Socialist'/revolutionist they'd like the idea of seeing a new, equal, hardworking society being formed in front of their eyes.

 

I honestly think though, to reinforce the point that change has been made, that you see much of the glitz and glamour done away with, or at least reduced a bit, makign way for functional machines and fruit/vegs gardens. As I said you want to get the impression that a strong settlement, ready to adapt for any situation is being forged after the revolution, not just swapping who gets to play blackjack.

Basically, the new tenants wont wont be wearing the fancy clothes and spending all day sititng around drinking (like the old ones) they'd be in their working gear, making sure the plumbing is working, making sure they can gow and store enough food to last through winter, repairing and coming up with alternatives where they can.

 

Doing this would also make Tenpenny himself seem like more of the ruthless, locked away landbaron that we're supposed to feel he is. Not just some old fart who lucked upon the tower before anyone else did. All the citizens just sort've feel like they landed there, theres no feeling of these people actually having any power, they're just lucky to have had the 100 caps to get in the gate.

 

I do hope you'd consider this, as this quest almost has the potential to be interpreted as a sort of precursor to the events at Hoover Dam, if the player were to go for an independant Vegas.

-Pwinkle

Edited April 17, 2012 by pwinkle

[Nihilisaurus]

As for the addon travel mod, I'm not concerned overmuch by canon and lore. I won't break it, but why should I limit myself to what is set in stone? Along the whole path of the Lone Wanderers journey, I constantly remind the player of Fallout lore. You met the Midwestern Brotherhood, the iconic Denver, the Enclave in Chicago, and the Courier's Mile. I see nothing wrong with adding new groups and new, original locations for the Fallout world. Having the player run around all over the west to follow every little reference to their past, a past the player can choose to have or not, takes away from the journey and New Vegas. In New Vegas, the Courier's past is deliberately left blank, and there are many occasions in the game for the player to choose the events in there own past. Lonesome Road is the only place were solid history is made for the player, all while they were a courier, never about their origins. The transition won't take four years, and the story will skip forward during the Lone Wanderers time in the NCR as a courier, so it's logical to assume in that time the courier traveled to those locations when the correct dialog is chosen.

 

You're free to add new things to the world of Fallout, just try and make sure they fit thematically and such. Adding a new faction powerful enough to challenge the East Coast Brotherhood of Steel, now bolstered by their acquisition of much new technology and resources taken from the defeated enclave is a difficult thing, especially seeing as in many ways they'd just be filling in for the Enclave. However, when you're traveling across the country, adding new factions is perfectly justifiable, a route across the US populated only by people from DC or Nevada/California would be dull, implausible and monotonous. Just be reasonable in what you add, the European union isn't going to have a million man army in Detroit, though there might be Canadians there (Ashur mentions toronto as a regional power in The Pitt). The most common available factions are probably going to be tribes, in colorado and the other states where the Legion was born, Caesar managed to defeat and assimilate 86, with no mention of how many fled or were destroyed totally. If that's any indication of the state of society in the US heartland then much of it is going to be tribal, with pockets of more familiar civilisation.

 

When the player returns to the Capital Wasteland, they are immediately bombarded with the consequences of their actions. Is Elder Lyons still alive, has the Purifier been tainted, and did the player do any of the extra quests and how did their actions affect the Capital? Even with all of that on the player's plate, they also now face new antagonists and protagonists and their actions will depend on what the player has done to the Capital Wasteland. One of the little extras to the addon travel mod is to show what else, and who else is out there in world, adding a little more to the world of Fallout. Some of it may seem weird, or even farfetched when I've (well me, Vurumai and the community) got the entire thing lined out before the team starts official work on it, but it all tries to fit within the confines of possibility and reason.

 

Things being a bit quirky is an established Fallout tradition. From dumb supermutants who think their commanding officer's name is Lou and a ghoul who repeatedly tells you he died when asking about his past before a tree sprouts from his head in the next game, to a group of brilliant scientists who've placed their brains in robots and now can't distinguish between toes and penises, the world of Fallout has always had a generous sprinkling of insanity, making light of what - on reflection - is one of the darkest settings possible for fiction. There's always room for casual madness in Fallout, but rarely is it a main plot point. So yeah, one or two far fetched elements would be good if used correctly but ground them in some more reasonable (in-universe) examples.

 

snip

As it is, the place has no means to survive, it's just a large amount of money locked up behind some scavenged concrete blocks and hired guns. The rich need the poor to perform labour for them, so any place like tenpenny tower needs some surrounding hamlets and such to provide food for it. The place itself should be a haven for the rich, lobby balcony ringed with shops, casino on the ground floor, an expanse of high class penthouse suites for the residents and all protected by strong walls patrolled 24/7 by hired security with automatic weapons.

 

Changing the tenpenny quest like that though, sounds wrong. The message of that place was 'sometimes, nobody's right'. It was one of the few good grey/grey morality choices in the game and changing it into a generic endorsement of socialism would spoil that. Besides, this is Fallout, neither Socialism or Fascism work and we have a nuclear apocalypse to prove it.

Edited April 17, 2012 by Lt Albrecht

[Deleted2547005User]

I've taken a break form the v1.02b update to address the latest comments.

 

Dysthe and Lt. Albrecht

 

Your ideas of expanding the Fallout 3 universe to make it more plausible in terms of realism is a great idea, but goes WAY beyond the scope of RFCW. I do what to take your ideas and use them, not as part of RFCW, but as a new project, Project Realism if you will. All of your idea make sense and are fantastic, but it'll be a monumental task, the same level task as the travel mod and RFCW itself has been. If either one of you wish to help create this mod, PM me and we'll get everything under one roof and finalized. Work on it won't start until after the Prototype's release though for obvious reasons.

 

pwinkle

 

I like your idea, but I agree with Albrecht that it shouldn't be part of the main quest. Though it would make for an excellent quest for when the player returns to the Capital Wasteland. With your permission, I would like to introduce that idea along with Dysthe and Lt. Albrecht's ideas for Tenpenny Towers surroundings.

 

Lt. Albrecht

 

It does seem that B.C. simply takes the place of the Enclave, but that isn't their role, or my intent. To the player, they can be protagonists trying to help the Capital Wasteland thrive, or antagonists causing trouble for the BoS and only interested in furthering their goals in the area. My biggest concern in terms of farfetchedness was can this or that really happen or plausible. Is it possible for an overseas nation to come to the U.S. after two hundred years of silence. One aspect I wanted to introduce is what else is happening in this world. What happen to Europe, Asia, and Africa? What has transpired in those regions after the Great War? If something like the NCR can happen in the U.S. why not overseas. I had forgotten about Toronto, and I will consider a rethink about how and why the E.U. came to the states, although their goal of mass genocide is still is their focus.

 

Vuurmia and I have been fleshing out more of the plot for the Player's return, and after a couple more PMs I will put on here the new content and expanded stories.

[Nihilisaurus]

I've taken a break form the v1.02b update to address the latest comments.

 

Dysthe and Lt. Albrecht

 

Your ideas of expanding the Fallout 3 universe to make it more plausible in terms of realism is a great idea, but goes WAY beyond the scope of RFCW. I do what to take your ideas and use them, not as part of RFCW, but as a new project, Project Realism if you will. All of your idea make sense and are fantastic, but it'll be a monumental task, the same level task as the travel mod and RFCW itself has been. If either one of you wish to help create this mod, PM me and we'll get everything under one roof and finalized. Work on it won't start until after the Prototype's release though for obvious reasons.

It's something I'd love to do, especially seeings how obsidian managed it in New Vegas. Over the summer break from university I'd be happy to be involved and work closely with RFCW to ensure compatability. Spent the afternoon messing with the Rivet city interior pieces. Dear lord they're frustrating, if I could just get the deck layout done filling them in, moving over notable & quest related items/npcs and navmeshing would be a joy and I could be done before I go back to uni on sunday...

 

pwinkle

 

I like your idea, but I agree with Albrecht that it shouldn't be part of the main quest. Though it would make for an excellent quest for when the player returns to the Capital Wasteland. With your permission, I would like to introduce that idea along with Dysthe and Lt. Albrecht's ideas for Tenpenny Towers surroundings.

 

If you did that, you'd have to find an extra dissident to pitch you the option and provide the backup, Phillips is abundantly clear he only wants to get himself and his compatriots into the tower, one of them was even the kind of person who lives in the tower before he became a ghoul. Adding all the extra quest script is beyond my capabilities, and any part of this involving vanilla characters would have uncomfortable silence instead of dialogue, which is to be avoided as it really takes from immersion.

 

It does seem that B.C. simply takes the place of the Enclave, but that isn't their role, or my intent. To the player, they can be protagonists trying to help the Capital Wasteland thrive, or antagonists causing trouble for the BoS and only interested in furthering their goals in the area. My biggest concern in terms of farfetchedness was can this or that really happen or plausible. Is it possible for an overseas nation to come to the U.S. after two hundred years of silence. One aspect I wanted to introduce is what else is happening in this world. What happen to Europe, Asia, and Africa? What has transpired in those regions after the Great War? If something like the NCR can happen in the U.S. why not overseas. I had forgotten about Toronto, and I will consider a rethink about how and why the E.U. came to the states, although their goal of mass genocide is still is their focus.

 

NCR is still mired in their founding stages though, and they had the head start of project safehouse, their beginnings being found in the residents of Vault 15. Is it possible for a nation that in all likelihood had a worse time than the US (the Soviet Union still existed before the war, and europe's war with the middle east resulted in nuclear strikes by both sides). If we presume that what was left of the central European authority (FO1 Intro says that the "European commonwealth dissolve into bickering nation states") hid away some small nucleus of itself, and has managed to claw back enough land and power to survive and interfere in the matters of other areas it will have to act heavily by proxy and with allies, the conquest of south america by Cortés is probably a good model here. The EU will only be able to deploy a small nucleus of troops, their advantages over the locals being their vastly superior equipment and knowledge, allowing them to gain local allies out of fear or ambition to make up for their diminutive numbers.