Just need the right direction lads.

[FrogTheFirst]

Hello everyone,

 

I came here to ask a specific question, well I guess this kind of question is recurrent here ,but I need a specific answer for a specific thing I want to do.

So I would like to start modding, knowing that I've never modded anything so far (made maps on some games but that's all, and the modding tool was in game).

As you may guess I like Fallout 4 and started playing it a few weeks ago, I already modded it quite a lot with the files on the nexus but there's this one thing I can't find. Melee weapons that fit my likings. I'm a melee lover, I mostly play melee games, and melee weapons in this game are rubbish. Melee mods are too few or don't suit me. Some partially did, like a Lightsaber mod (which is great, you can modify the hilt, the blade, etc) or the wade's wilson mod (I liked the look of it, but the damages were too low).

 

So my point is : I'd like to make my own "standalone" melee weapon(s) and model/shape those the way I want, choose their damages and reach, etc.

Thus, I'd like you guys to point me in the right direction. I already spent some time researching but there are lots of programs (blender, CK, FO4Edit, etc..) and I have no clue which one to use to make this particular kind of mod. If someone could tell me which softwares I should download to do it, I would be grateful. I will then find tutorials myself on how to use those.

 

Hope I've been clear enough.

Cheers lads.

 

[ehtyeci]

Your asset workflow depends on what you have access to in terms of modeling and texturing software. If you are a student, I personally recommend going the 3ds max / Substance Painter route. 3ds max has best support for importing/exporting nifs, and SP just has a generally decent texturing workflow where you paint directly onto a mesh. Autodesk and Allegorithmic both allow for free student licensing. SP also has a 30 day evaluation trial.

Otherwise you can go Blender for modeling. I started with Blender myself, and it's great for getting the mesh and UV unwrapping done. For texturing, Blender leaves a lot to be desired, and if you want good results you'll need to learn compositing and texture baking in Blender. Nif support for Blender stopped years ago and you are forced to use an older version when turning your mesh into a nif. You can use other softwares like Maya for modeling and texturing, too. It should also have nif support through a plugin, but I have not used it myself so I cannot attest for how well it works.

Exporting to a nif is one thing, but when you want to make your nif readable by FO4, it needs to follow a specific convention, and that'ss done through NifSkope. The usual procedure is (oversimplified) to open an existing asset, copy over your meshes and save it as a new nif. You'll also need Material Editor by ousnius that edits BGEM/BGSM files your new asset.

You then start integrating the asset into a mod through the CK. Similar to the procedure in NifSkope, you essentially duplicate entries of an existing weapon, rename it to yours, point it to your own nif, and give it whatever properties you feel is right.

So to recap for software (note, this is just my personal preference)

Modeling: Either Blender, 3ds max or Maya. Or anything that can export to OBJ.

Recommended: Latest Blender or 3ds max.

Texturing: Blender, 3ds max, Maya, Substance Painter, Photoshop

Recommended: Substance Painter for texturing, Photoshop

DDS conversion: Photoshop with DDS plugin, GIMP, Paint.NET, Compressonator

Recommended: Either works fine. I use Photoshop.

Turn into nif: 3ds max with nif plugin, Blender 2.49b with nif plugin, Outfit Studio

Recommended: 3ds max, or Outfit Studio if you can't get 3ds max.

Nif editing: Nifskope 2.0

BGSM/BGEM editing: Material Editor by ousnius

Getting the nif into game: Creation Kit

That's about it.

You can do without ever touching FO4Edit. In fact, I only use FO4Edit when I suspect I've made dirty edits. In which case I'll run my esp through FO4Edit to clean it.

[FrogTheFirst]

Thanks a lot for that very instructive answer. Didn't know it took that much softwares to mod tho. Yes I'm a student but nothing near computer studies, will it be a problem btw ? I mean besides AutoCAD and Revit (studying civil engineering), I've never studied any other softwares or have any advanced skills you may acquire at uni. Do you think I still can get 3Ds max ?

Is it possible to do everything only with FO4Edit (read that earlier on a forum).

 

Cheers.

 

Oh and ..... what is a mesh exactly ? (yeah I'm that much of a newbie)

Edited December 1, 2017 by FrogTheFirst

[ehtyeci]

I'm not sure what you're able to get there. The best way to find out is to just log into Autodesk and see. There should be some way to affiliate your Autodesk account with your uni through Autodesk. You then go to Free Software section and get the Autodesk product you want. Myself, I got access to all the major titles when I was majoring linguistics, so it doesn't appear to depend on you studying CG at all.

You should in theory be able to most things in FO4Edit, and I bet some would even say it's easier than CK. In my case, though, it's more about CK being the first place I made my own weapon, so I'm just more familiar with it.

Ah, mesh is the actual 3D model with the vertices and polygons. I disambiguate mesh from nif, because a nif is a container that can hold different types of data, including the mesh.

[FrogTheFirst]

Apparently I can get a free copy for 3ds max. Do you advice downloading the latest (2018) version or an older one (for some reason, like compatibility maybe ?) ?

[FrogTheFirst]

Also, I can't find tutorials on how to create an object for fallout 4 with 3Ds max. What would you advice to do/not do? Read things about triangles to make meshes for fo4 or something, can I still use every geometric shape in the software ?

[ehtyeci]

Apparently I can get a free copy for 3ds max. Do you advice downloading the latest (2018) version or an older one (for some reason, like compatibility maybe ?) ?

 

If you're gonna animate and/or add collision* to your meshes, 2015 is the highest you can go for the extra plugins support. Otherwise 2018 is fine. There's a nif plugin compiled for later 3ds max versions available here https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/84041/

*Collision is a frame on top of the mesh that is used to calculate in-game physics, like when the object is dropped or shot at. You don't need to make new collision for weapons (just copy from vanilla weapons when editing in NifSkope), unless it's something that is very oddly shaped.

I personally keep copies of 2015 and 2018 simultaneously. 2018 for animating and 2015 for exporting the animation. If you're just gonna make weapons to start out, 2018 is fine. It feels smoother, too.

 

Also, I can't find tutorials on how to create an object for fallout 4 with 3Ds max. What would you advice to do/not do? Read things about triangles to make meshes for fo4 or something, can I still use every geometric shape in the software ?

 

You don't necessarily set out to make the object specifically for FO4 in the modeling stage. You're making a game asset, so you'll be following pretty generic guidelines for game asset creation. Any tutorial that revolves around game assets will be relevant to you.

You can make any kinds of geometry, as long as the object is triangulated before making it into a nif. Most game engines need to render triangles for fastest possible rendering. It's an automated process and easy to do towards the end.

[FrogTheFirst]

 

Apparently I can get a free copy for 3ds max. Do you advice downloading the latest (2018) version or an older one (for some reason, like compatibility maybe ?) ?

 

If you're gonna animate and/or add collision* to your meshes, 2015 is the highest you can go for the extra plugins support. Otherwise 2018 is fine. There's a nif plugin compiled for later 3ds max versions available here https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/84041/

*Collision is a frame on top of the mesh that is used to calculate in-game physics, like when the object is dropped or shot at. You don't need to make new collision for weapons (just copy from vanilla weapons when editing in NifSkope), unless it's something that is very oddly shaped.

I personally keep copies of 2015 and 2018 simultaneously. 2018 for animating and 2015 for exporting the animation. If you're just gonna make weapons to start out, 2018 is fine. It feels smoother, too.

 

Also, I can't find tutorials on how to create an object for fallout 4 with 3Ds max. What would you advice to do/not do? Read things about triangles to make meshes for fo4 or something, can I still use every geometric shape in the software ?

 

You don't necessarily set out to make the object specifically for FO4 in the modeling stage. You're making a game asset, so you'll be following pretty generic guidelines for game asset creation. Any tutorial that revolves around game assets will be relevant to you.

You can make any kinds of geometry, as long as the object is triangulated before making it into a nif. Most game engines need to render triangles for fastest possible rendering. It's an automated process and easy to do towards the end.

 

I already started downloading 2018 after all, I'll do just fine with it and/or adapt later :smile: .

I found a tutorial after all of a guy making a new weapon out of 3ds max for FO4. But he took an existing file/mesh (shovel) from the game data and edited it so it's not completly the same ? Idk if I should do it his way or model a brand new mesh. Like you said editing the existing allows me to keep collisions.

 

Anyways, thanks a lot for all the help you offered.

I may keep coming back on that thread later on while doing my .. thing ^^.

Edited December 2, 2017 by FrogTheFirst

[FrogTheFirst]

If I want to train by importing a fallout mesh into 3ds max (remodelling the sledge hammer for example) like he does https://youtu.be/aBoKC4LLXGQ?t=98, what do I need to install/use ?

 

EDIT : I guess it's the link for the nif importer you already gave, but where should I install it ? In a 3ds folder or fo4's ?

Edited December 2, 2017 by FrogTheFirst

[ehtyeci]

The nif link is to an installer where you just tick the 3ds max version version you have and it'll install to the plugin folder of 3ds max.

You can use something like Bethesda Archive Extractor https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/78/? to open the file "Fallout4 - Meshes.ba2" in your Fallout 4/Data folder. The sledgehammer should be in Meshes/Weapons/Sledgehammer inside the archive.