Reinstalled Windows 10. Game broke. Any recent popular problems?

[EPDGaffney]

Me truncating things as a favour to normal people:

I reïnstalled Windows 10 and now my game doesn't work. It had loads of massive problems that seem fixed now that I've done more Windows updates and driver updates and 4GB-patched the launcher again. However, it still crashes very, very often (every few minutes) and one of my AI packages (that I made) no longer works. My game is heavily modded and the load order is a terrifying hellmouth, but it worked yesterday so it should work to-day. I am not using NVSR. I am using NVAC and all the mods I had yesterday. I'm mostly curious about how common is this sort of thing and is there a general fix or pool of possible fixes. I can do some experimenting and investigating on my own time otherwise.

 

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Me speaking as I normally do:

Really just curious about anything I may have missed with drivers and mods and Windows 10 stuff as I've been behind the times with that stuff for a bit. Largely on purpose, as every time Windows or Nvidia update something they break my stuff.

 

So, I upgraded from Windows 7 and never did a clean install of Windows 10. Then I dropped my processor on the carpet because I don't like myself terribly much and needed a punishment, so I more or less built a new PC using the same hard drive and thus the same Windows installation. That honestly worked pretty good, but it did some weird stuff and I thought maybe it was finally time to stop being lazy and do a clean install. Well, a lot of stuff is nicer now. But New Vegas is just a nightmare. It's literally the only thing so far that doesn't work right.

 

All my mods are back in, and they worked before so I want them to work now. I may have to try without them to narrow down the problem, but I want to start broader in hopes I've missed something, like maybe everyone knows Nvidia's new drivers are spies sent to ruin my day and I just didn't realise that.

 

It seems that much of the problem was to do with Windows not having finished updating. You know, in the 36 hours and many many restarts since it started doing that in the background and preventing other drivers from installing but not actually telling me about it. It was initially behaving as if archive invalidation weren't working, taking ten minutes to load simple things, loading a blue screen (with my HUD) most of the time if I tried to load a game from the main menu (but working fine from the pause menu available once that blue screen had loaded), stuttering or freezing or crashing within minutes of starting, stuff like that.

 

The weird thing is that it worked fine the first time I started it and played for a bit, and then this all started happening. Now that I've updated my Nvidia drivers and Windows is maybe possibly done with whatever it thinks it's doing to destroy my life, most of it's fixed, it seems. Repatched it as well (but the old patched executable wasn't working, either). Grass is now green, the floor is visible, black people are black again, all my event handlers are printing their confirmation messages, so, seems pretty good. It's mainly the crashing at really random times that's getting me, but also, there's an AI package in my mod that worked great before the reïnstall and now it doesn't.

 

I made some custom radroaches and they run away when they see the player, into their little roach hole. But now, they run at the speed of light in place on the ground facing their destination but never getting there. It looks like a navmesh problem but I went and renavmeshed the cell and got nothing. Then they walked around just fine when they thought they were evading an explosive, and the moment my package loads for them, they start running in place. This worked perfectly yesterday and I think I saw it work fine in the morning.

 

Not sure I have the time to get all the nice information together like specs and load order and whatever else, but maybe I can do it after.

[dubiousintent]

The following entries in the wiki 'Fallout NV Mod Conflict Troubleshooting' guide specifically address known Win10 problems:
* 'Issue: NVSE - fails to load after update KB4058043 to Win10 FCU (v1709)'
* 'Issue: Vanilla game Hangs on startup'; specifically "Cause-1" regarding DirectX9 drivers.
* 'Issue: "Full screen mode" exhibits CTDs and stutters or micro-stutters'
* 'Issue: Recent (post-Win10 FCU) CTDs after 10-20 minutes of play'
* 'Issue: Lag or "micro stutters" even with "New Vegas Stutter Remover" installed (or not)'. (Regardless of whether or not NVSR is actually installed.) In particular "Cause-4" regarding video card settings. The latest video drivers may not be the best suited to an older game like FNV. All vendors drop testing of old games at some point. Backwards compatibility is never guaranteed, much less "optimization".
Also, "Cause-7" regarding "Superfetch" and "File search indexing". Windows updates will often reset these back on.
* 'Issue: Win10 Screen tearing in "Borderless Windowed Mode"'
* 'Issue: ENB Support for Windows versions later than Win7'
* 'Issue: Problems using ENB/SweetFx on Windows 10'

Edit: Did you remember to set your "compatibility mode" on the GECK to "Win7" or Vista SP2"?

 

-Dubious-

Edited February 11, 2018 by dubiousintent

[EPDGaffney]

Thanks, Dubious. That's the kind of stuff I needed. I can deal with sorting out the actual problem on my own. DirectX9 drivers sound like a good thing to look at especially, and Superfetch. I thought I'd read Superfetch was only bad for SSDs but now I'm seeing other opinions.

 

So, as I had thought made the most sense, the AI package problem was thankfully my fault for not reproducing the exact same conditions while testing, and the engine's fault for being a glitchy mess, but nought to do with this; I was testing whilst hidden before, and now I was being impatient and standing up, and the thing that triggers the package is their detecting the player. It had variables set in a way that should have worked but I think they were flipping too fast or something and the game got confused. I fixed it with a quest script as opposed to an object script.

 

The most puzzling thing to me is the blue screen I mentioned. It's more a dark teal than a blue, to be accurate, but I have a feeling people would report it as either blue or green. The HUD is there, the sounds play, and even my quest reminders pop up (Sunny Smiles is waiting over a month for me to shoot some bottles; hope she brought a snack or something). Now, the first time it happened, I was able to load my game from there. That game would crash relatively quickly but would load. However, this problem returned after hours of the game having only CTD problems, and this time, although I could pause the game and navigate that menu, it would give me the blue circle mouse icon (Windows is working it seems) and take a long time to come up and then it would freeze and never load the game. I tried this maybe ten times.

 

Then I got rid of Game Bar in hopes it was the overlay causing trouble, and did a bunch of the optimisations I had done before when I was having the NVSR problem that this crashing reminds me of. I restarted my PC and tried again. It opened my file and then tried to save for some reason? (auto-save is off in all contexts) and then it crashed immediately. Then I tried again and it worked for about a half-hour and crashed. I slept at some point (shut down the PC as well) and tried again in the morning, and it worked fine for the ten minutes I tried it.

 

So...that's just background stuff in case it helps anyone understand what this is, but I'm mostly just curious about the teal screen and if anyone's ever heard of or experienced that. I have helped countless people troubleshoot this game for years and have never heard of it myself.

[YanL]

* 'Issue: Recent (post-Win10 FCU) CTDs after 10-20 minutes of play'

 

 

-Dubious-

 

I did this, and I do not want to be hopeful, but it worked? I was able to test the game for half an hour, which is much more than the 3 to 5 minutes it usually works, since I reinstalled it a few months ago.

 

one can only dream

 

I have a question, though.

 

 

 

Solution: Those experiencing this problem are recommended to try disabling the bHookCriticalSections (=0) setting, which will also disable the use of the heap related algorithm and size settings in NVSR.

 

Ok. But what about this, same page?

 

Issue: CTD without warning, "Out of Memory error", or stops responding after the Main Menu

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To activate the "Sheson patch", Add the following before the "[Logging]" section of the "nvse_config.ini" file: [Memory] DefaultHeapInitialAllocMB=496

 

 

Is not the same thing? I at the moment completely removed this nvse_config.ini file from the path. Should I use it even if everything is stable?

Edited February 12, 2018 by YanL

[EPDGaffney]

NVSE is the New Vegas Script Extender, and NVSR is the New Vegas Stutter Remover. Definitely keep the Script Extender, and if you have Windows 10, use only the parts of the Stutter Remover that work. For my own part, I have it completely removed at this point as I couldn't get the game to work with it on in any capacity (months ago, not now with my new install of Windows 10).

 

There are currently I believe three methods of heap replacement in New Vegas. I forget if it's three or maybe even more, but it's at least two different algorithms, and according to Roy Batty and a few other people, the one NVSR uses is liable to cause crashes (but it does work for some people, and for those people, it works really well), and the one NVSE uses is stable but not as...aggressive maybe? as the NVSR one.

 

Thanks for stopping by, YanL. I really wish NVSR were my problem, cos then I could just turn it off, but unfortunately, it's already off. I have a feeling I'm looking at a long day or two of just reverting to vanilla and reïnstalling every single mod I have.

 

It's a shame because besides this, literally everything on my PC works better now. My GECK has no more column bugs even! I know Dubious is familiar with this, but anyone that isn't, I mean the one where it squishes all your topics and conditions to the left side to the point where they look invisible. I'm not even using compatibility mode on my GECK and it runs smoother than it did on Windows 7. No idea what to make of it.

 

Edit: I should clarify, all the methods of heap replacement do affect completely different things; I didn't mean they were different ways of doing the same thing. So, if the NVSR one happens to work for someone, that person should use both the NVSE and NVSR heap replacers. But generally, the NVSR one will cause problems sooner or later in most cases (again, according to Roy; this information may become outdated at some point but that's what he's always told me).

Edited February 12, 2018 by EPDGaffney

[dubiousintent]

EPDGaffney is correct: got to watch those initials in acronyms (NVSE vs NVSR).

 

It's fairly common experience that an "upgrade" over an existing OS can be more "iffy" than a clean install. Personally I use a "multi-boot" system (part of a partition manager) and install a new OS to a separate partition so I can boot between old and new systems until I decide everything ready to go before switching exclusively to the new one. As it is I leave the old partition in place in case of emergency problems with the new system. (Something to keep in mind: an upgrade usually requires seeing the "qualifying" OS version on boot up before you get to install the new version. These days MS at least will then give you the option of a clean install to a new partition, but if you have to re-install over it will still want to see the "qualifying" version. It can pay to keep the old partition if you have the disk space.)

 

The "heap" question is somewhat confusing because there is more than one "heap" and none of the "solutions" makes it clear which they are affecting. There is the "Sheson" patch for NVSE, and NVSR has both a heap size and (5 I believe) "heap algorithms", but only 3 use the "heap size" setting.

 

Haven't heard of the "teal screen" problem before. Let me know if you find a solution.

 

Good to have confirmation that the "squashed text field" bug in GECK is solved in a clean install. I'll add that bit to the guide.

 

-Dubious-

Edited February 12, 2018 by dubiousintent

[EPDGaffney]

It's starting to be a pattern. Every time I make some changes and restart the computer to solidify them, New Vegas works great for a while, and the second time I launch it the problems start. I got the teal screen again after having tested the game's stability and my new scripts for about a half-hour, quitting the game, correcting my scripts, and launching the game again. On that launch, I got that bug, and it is just the weirdest thing, because the HUD is there, the console works, the quest reminder corner messages appear, and the pause menu is 100% functional and even snappy. I can't turn with the mouse or the compass would update, and trying to COC to a cell that has stuff in it crashes the game. Also, I left it on for a while...and...the screen gradually became grey and the HUD still never changed colour.

 

I changed the texture size to small and now the game won't launch (black screen). I'm not googling the .ini setting now, so if you happen to know it yourself and feel like saving me the trouble, thanks.

 

I of course have no idea how long this will last with the GECK like this or that it is a sure fix for everyone, but I can say I'm enjoying it for now at least.

 

I used to dual-boot with Linux but I needed Windows for my music software, so although I preferred Linux overall, I rarely used it because why restart my PC to open a browser when Windows is already loaded as I needed it for music stuff. If there's some way nowadays to switch instantly back and forth, that'd be fantastic. My system should be powerful enough to run a VM, and it's a good long time I'm considering using one.

Edited February 12, 2018 by EPDGaffney

[dubiousintent]

The common denominator seems to be "video".

 

The screen gradually changing color over time suggests either a hardware problem (overheating) or a memory leak.

 

The COC to a cell with stuff in it suggests a memory leak as well. Try shutting down all the background processes you can (e.g. run in offline mode and disable AV).

 

Are you using ENBoost? Might give it a try.

 

Not clear what you mean by "I can't turn with the mouse or the compass would update". Isn't that what you would expect the HUD to show?

 

Changing texture size causing a black screen seems like you have hit upon a variation of the 'Issue: Black Screen on startup' in the Troubleshooting guide. But depends upon just "where" you changed the setting: game INI files or windows display settings, or some mod like DYNAVISION.

 

-Dubious-

[EPDGaffney]

Hardware doesn't seem likely as everything else works great, even stuff that usen't before the clean install, and all my temperatures are grand. And the memory leak seems unlikely as well because New Vegas isn't going past maybe a gig of usage when this happens. With the teal screen it's been under a gig every time, and with the crashes it's well under two gigs. I'd have to guess it's a software thing but can't work out what yet. Or at least, something hardware-related that is governed by software (like drivers or a setting or conflict or something).

 

I tried to get a screenshot of the teal screen but after I got it again about an hour ago, I couldn't get the game to launch and then it would only launch fine. Problem being my Steam overlay was turned off so I couldn't capture the image without restarting the game. With that screen loaded, I can use the console and I'm technically in the right spot for where the game should load me. Very odd.

 

What I meant about the black screen was I changed the texture size in the options menu and it said I had to quit, so I did, and then the game wouldn't launch. But I had backed up my .ini files in imitation of a clever person and restoring those fixed it.

 

I'm trying a vanilla install next I think. Just have to back up my mods and all that, make sure I know what I'm adding back when I get to that.

 

Update: Vanilla game works perfectly, as far as I can tell. And I mean 100% vanilla, without NVAC or NVSE or any sort of borderless windowed mod or .ini tweaks or anything whatsoever. Literally the game as it thinks it should run on my system, with the sole exception that I changed the resolution to 1920x1080 as my first go was some other strange one and it looked highly jagged and stuff was just wrong...no idea why it thought that was my screen size. Funny, without graphics mods it's definitely smoother (though on Windows 7 it was just as smooth with NVSR, which is now unusable on 10), but I still get stutters when the LOD gets switched out for the real models/textures. I'm pretty sure it did that even on my console copy back in the day, so this game probably never worked right.

 

Oh, and Dubious, do you remember that mental glitch where post-mortem-dismembered limbs get cloned every time I return to the cell? That -- is -- still -- happening. New PC, new Windows installation, vanilla game, I just don't get it. Very few people have this bug. The only other person I've ever known to have it was using Windows 7 as well.

Edited February 12, 2018 by EPDGaffney

[YanL]

One question: which mod organizer do you use?