LE Magical Combat

[fdflowright]

Magical combat in Skyrim is quite bland, even with mods adding spells and rebalancing the system. In the end, in just comes down to spamming a spell at an enemy and occasionally using paralyzing/staggering effects.

 

To change this, I've two main ideas. The end goal is quite simple though, create an alternate magic system similar to MMORPGs so usage of spells becomes a lengthy, but meaningful process.

 

First is the pace of magical combat. The click, hold, and release mechanism is great for immersion and dual wielding spells, but is frankly quite horrible for fast paced combat. The holding till release period is just clunky in my opinion. One thing Dragon Age 2 vastly improved on was the speed of skill usage, just by speeding up animations and reducing the delay from pressing the button to initiating the skill, the pace of combat was improved. Things happened when you pushed the button. The good thing is, Skyrim already has a power system that works this way, so no difficulty in implementing this.

 

However, this alone won't stop the feeling of spamming spells. For each spell to be powerful, yet not just another spell you spam, just add two things: cast time and cooldown. Different spells have different cast time, instant cast spells would be like your shouts, no big deal there. The more important part however is the spells with long cast times, where you really feel you're building up a big spell to crush your enemy. Similar to the existing firestorm and blizzard, but since you initiate it with just one button push, its far less irritating.

 

Second is the tactical aspect of magical combat. The traditional mage archetype is the glass cannon - great destructive power, but highly threatened by melee and ranged combat without adequate protection. You don't see this in skyrim though, sure you have cloth armor and have to use alteration spells to bolster your defense, but there is no real point in using runes or your illusion spells most of the time. However, by implementing long cast times without being able to move, this forces you to actually think about stopping your enemy from getting close to you. So you make preparations and plan for combat, the ice wall mode is a great example of something similar. t, The other part about long cast times is that you need to maximise your damage output, which brings us to the "mobbing" aspect of MMOPRGs.

 

Currently there are 2 main ways of doing damage to multiple enemies using magic: chain lightning and fireball/ice storm. Firestorm and blizzard are more situational, with mods. Anyway, the idea is you point at something, shoot at it, and blow up things in the general area of where u're pointing. It works ok for dungeons and the like.

 

In my opinion though, the true idea of AOE spells is aiming at the terrain, not the target, especially when you have a cast time. You expect your target to be in the area you are going to blast. To do that, you need to know just how big the area is you're gonna hit. In Warcraft 3, this was accomplished in a nice way: a magic circle on the ground showing the AOE. So, why not something similar for skyrim? My idea for implementing this is something among the lines of 1)shoot a rune at the ground 2)initiate the casting animation 3)magic effects on the area covered by the rune.

 

just some ideas i thought up after playing some other games. No idea about how difficult it will be to implement, might try doing it myself during summer. Any thoughts?

[eschaeon]

Unfortunately implementing spells with no hold-release system isn't as easy as it sounds. The Power system only lets you equip one at a time, and greater powers are only usable once a day. Using the eitherhand for normal spells automatically puts in the "charge hold" (Even if the cast time is 0, you can still hold it until ready). Doing things such as Ice walls and such sounds cool though but probably difficult to implement (I know someone has a beta "earth prison" spell on skyrim workshop). It's also tricky to do cooldowns.. We would really need an improved UI on top of it.

 

The Mod I plan on making here soon will implement a "Wizard" archetype. The idea of it is to never have to equip a weapon (except a Staff), heavy armor or shield and be able to solely rely on magic (The mod will actually limit, and penalize the use of certain weapons/armors after the requisite perk is picked up). Some of the ideas you posted are ones I have, such as channeling AOE spells and spells with no cast time for quick firing as well as one spell with a huge cast time (Maybe temporary buffs will shorten cast time of spells). The idea is to focus more on synergy with spells, such as combos (Think Mass Effect). This will encourage using different spells to activate a Combo, instead of just spamming a concentrated flames or fireballs. It will also generalize magic somewhat, as trying to level 5 schools of magic evenly is quite ridiculous (This mod won't use restoration at all).

 

I'll also add a decent number of new spells to supplement damage protection, healing and restoring magicka, etc without the use of Restoration/alchemy/enchanting. To help balancing these, I think most spells require a tradeoff. Such as a fire and forget shield spell that absorbs damage, also negates your magicka regen. Or tapping into stamina/health as a resource. Another idea is a conjurable ammo type, that will be consumed when a spell is cast to produce an additional effect (This benefits preparing in advance, as doing it in combat will be costly).

 

Lastly I'll be including a summonable Familiar (1 of 3), that will provide various beneficial effects and also use attack spells/heal spells or whatnot. Think Neverwinter Nights.

 

An example of what an end goal would be:

Being attacked by 1 semi-strong thing > cast delayed attack > quick damage spell > delayed attack activates > battle over

Being attacked by 1 semi-strong thing > set up attack with DOT debuff for combo > activate to produce CC > quick shield >piercing spell to reduce defense> finish off with a strong finisher.

 

Pack of enemies > slow time > long cast "Hellball" > battle over/mop up whats left

Pack of enemies > quick AOE CC combo > shield > Aoe channel with slow effect (applies debuff trigger)> movement ability > Aoe explosion combo > use cool down to regain Magicka or Health > Finish off with whats left

Pack of enemies > activate consumable bonus or cooldown ability > machine gun combo explosions > battle over

 

Just an early example of what would be nice to do. I'm not sure if this Mod will satisfy your desire or not though. I'm open to ideas!

[muukzor]

SAME TIME!

 

Edit: I posted the same time as Eschaeon! Epic timing!

 

No I haven't read your post and won't do it. Don't complain! I did a 30 second bump just for you! Also makes your post look more attractive because it got more posts!

Edited April 24, 2012 by muukzor