Evil characters need more love...

[Aeryn333]

Now, if the PLAYER knows about vampirism and that it should be cured in three days or that he should avoid healing if he wants his character to be one, then it doesn't mean that his character knows the same and always realises the situation.

 

You know I have to agree with you on that one, one time, as i think back, I don't know when or how, it happned really, was not notified as it says most times you have been infected, this time I did not know, I had been infected had not been paying attention to my stats, until I went to sleep, went on fighting in dudgeons for days, until I decided to sleep and had the vampire dream, I woke up I was shocked actually.

I hurriedly looked at me character and sure enough my eyes were pale and my skin ashen..It only happened that once..Of course I hurried to the chapel, but my infamy was to high and was not cured...to make it worse I scorched myself in the sun..

 

Fortunatey I had the evil lair, and went there, took a bath in the healing vamp pool..whcih only works if you have indeed become a vampire..In that case I did not know..so there are times, I guess when you can contract,Porphyric Hemophilia , not be notified, if you not paying attention to your stats..Can go about for three days without sleep, cave digging, then go to sleep, and wham there you are a vampire..

But I say that was an exception rather than the rule...

 

 

Cheers

[Sarya]

LoginToDownload, heh, yes, odd game logic ;D

 

Aeryn, emmm, that's not exactly what I meant, but okay.

[Leenysaurus]

What kind of lame ranger takes more than three days to find/buy some mandrake? IIRC, it costs two gold at most Mages Guildhalls or Alchemy shops. And even then, if they were good-aligned, they could just head to a chapel. /nitpick.

You know, it takes several game hours in in-game Cyrodiil to travel between neighbour cities and you can always have a little trip to any nearby cathedral and make it not in three days, but in an hour-two. But... if we're talking about roleplaying (and what the hell is point in "evil" without roleplaying?), those trips should be pretended to last for weeks. Beside, what if a ranger is badly hurt? In Oblivion you can contact Porphyric Haemophilia through a sturdy metal shield when being hit by a dagger. But if we add roleplaying-intended realism... then most likely you're beaten, bitten and bleed bad. Even if you're conscious and can get to somewhere in time, then you are just in no condition to think of deeper diseases besides preventing sepsis. Rangers, huh? And what about those poor five on Azura quest? They weren't really evil, but... no running to chapels or chasing mandrake, just... locking themselves in a mine?! What kind of masochism is that if the cure is so easy as you say?

 

Thank you ... I was about to make those points.

 

Next time, I'll be sure to say "generic character" instead of specific, but I was trying to shoot for "lives off land and doesn't have much to do with civilization" ... and I was assuming the ranger wasn't an alchemist because that's how I play my rangers. Figured it made most sense to give an example of someone who might be stuck in a forced vampirism situation, I didn't intend to start a dispute.

 

:wallbash:

 

I hope everything is good now.

[LoginToDownload]

No worries. You don't need to be an alchemist at all in that case, though, as Cure Disease is the first effect Mandrake Root has. Can we also upgrade it to "Lives off land, doesn't have much to do with civilization, and raids vampire lairs"? I would imagine it'd be pretty common knowledge that caves are always full of dangerous, highly aggressive beings.

[Leenysaurus]

No worries. You don't need to be an alchemist at all in that case, though, as Cure Disease is the first effect Mandrake Root has. Can we also upgrade it to "Lives off land, doesn't have much to do with civilization, and raids vampire lairs"? I would imagine it'd be pretty common knowledge that caves are always full of dangerous, highly aggressive beings.

 

True, true.

 

I'll upgrade that additionally to said character "lives off land, doesn't hand much to do with civilization, raids vampire lairs, and has a an intelligence score of 10 or so."

 

*sigh*

 

No, between everyone, the point of vampirism has been well made, but I still see potential loopholes to unwillingness.

 

Say the vampires kidnap whatever curious adventurer stumbles across their lair and holds them hostage, forcing them to turn.

 

Workable? (Assume said character is a wholly good-aligned adventurer/ess).

[tungol]

<snip>

I'll upgrade that additionally to said character "lives off land, doesn't hand much to do with civilization, raids vampire lairs, and has a an intelligence score of 10 or so."

<snip>

 

Or what if he hasn't got a mortar & pestle?

 

And you are all ignoring my amazingly insightful observation that in ES vampires do not have to be played as what is conventionally considered EVIL.

It's just a disease, a handicap.

And as Sarya said, you can't have evil without roleplaying. So that opens up lots of other possibilities.

 

Oh, as for the trip taking weeks: a cell is 192ft across. Bruma to Leyawiin is 70 cells = 2.54 miles. If it takes roughly 12 hours of travel to get there (we assume at a natural pace of 3mph), the real distance would be 36 miles. So the scale is roughly 1/14. But that's holding time constant, which I think you have to do since you've got a calendar.

OTOH, iif you're roleplaying, then maybe you're severely wounded after going into that vampire den unprepared. So you're crawling along, passing out every 5 minutes. Hours seem like days.

[LoginToDownload]

Or what if he hasn't got a mortar & pestle?

You don't need a mortar and pestle. Just eat the stuff plain. It's the first effect.

 

And you are all ignoring my amazingly insightful observation that in ES vampires do not have to be played as what is conventionally considered EVIL.

It's just a disease, a handicap.

Admittedly, I am getting sort of sidetracked... :sweat:

All the same, unwillingly becoming a vampire is a legitimate facet of the "vampirism isn't evil" argument in general. The disease has more ramifications if willingly accepted.

 

And as Sarya said, you can't have evil without roleplaying. So that opens up lots of other possibilities.

We're still somewhat lacking a proper definition of evil, but I'd say between general boredom (Two varyingly evil questlines ripe for the trying, and random rampages) and (at earlier levels) the loot available in display cases, evil is easier without roleplaying.

 

OTOH, iif you're roleplaying, then maybe you're severely wounded after going into that vampire den unprepared. So you're crawling along, passing out every 5 minutes. Hours seem like days.

As mentioned before, that poses a problem if the dungeon isn't cleared out while totally unprepared, (the vampires would just come out and finish you off. It's unclear if you could get away before nightfall in that state) requires a complete absence of healing items and spells, and a roleplaying that states the player doesn't heal when resting. (Or at least nowhere close to the game's rate)

[Leenysaurus]

You know, personally, I'd deem evil as defined by the laws of a society one is raised under, because in this world, different places in the world see certain things in very different ways from other places. I don't have much of an example, but you get what I mean? I'm sort of saying evil is defined by the values one is raised to have, sort of, but I know there are many gray areas in that theory. That's how I see it, though.

[LoginToDownload]

I see what you mean, but I'm not sure it runs as deep as that. Selfishness/selflessness and their effects on others seem significantly more objective than "cultural" wrondoings treading into the territory of honor and such. Perhaps you could say morality is more objective, (though it still means you need to determine an act's perceived/predictable consequences) while ethics is more dependent on culture.