Need help please, quest and activators in my mod not working for some users

[jimmygitto]

Holy cow, 0000074210, I think you may be right. I did not even think about the scripts aspect.

Nice name, by the way.

 

Now I'm all fired up, because it's possible I just learned another new thing?!

 

I did not even think about how if I was tinkering with the scripts to get them to work, there may now be a script in my Scripts folder that my mod needs. Wow, that's dumb if that's really what it is, and I just didn't know I needed to include those. But also awesome, because that's fixable. I would just add a /Scripts folder to my Main ba2 with them included, correct?

 

I thought I used "vanilla" scripts for my stuff. I just looked in my scripts folder and I see recently-edited pex files for the activators that look likely to be relevant. Oddly, though, one of them is for something that IS working for the users.

 

And now I do see a script for the quest that adds the items- it's in this folder: Fallout 4\Data\scripts\source\User\Fragments\Quests. It's a psc file.

 

Would I need to recreate this folder structure in my ba2 file, do you think? Or could I just put the pex and the quest psc file in a folder calls /scripts in my ba2?

 

Man, I hope this works. Thanks a ton.

[steve40]

You are using a quest. Quests create script fragments. You must include all your quest scripts and fragment PEX files in the mod maintaining exactly the same folder structure. PSC files are source code only and not required. Cheers.

[JonathanOstrus]

pls delete. editor didn't update properly to show post completed.

Edited September 27, 2018 by BigAndFlabby

[JonathanOstrus]

There's 3 script references I see that are missing.

• Scripts\Fragments\Quests\QF_Pipsy_zzzTheGiftShopQuest_0100F6A7.pex (the quest stages fragments)
• Scripts\MapToggle on PipsyzzButtonMap "Hologram Activator"
• Scripts\LightsToggle on PipsyzzButtonShutterControl "Shutter Control"

If you used the archive feature in CK that should have packed them for you. Or are you using a staging area and packing things manually?

 

Also you need to clean the plugin. You have a whole lot of ITM (Identical To Master) overrides. This *could* cause conflicts with other mods unintentionally. Also some deleted records. It's normally good practice to use xEdit to remove the ITM and undelete and disable refs instead. There may also be some dirty edits (records that were touched and re-saved with (probably) accidental edits. Those would have to be manually deleted.

 

For reference

[Removing "Identical to Master" records done] Processed Records: 1038, Removed Records: 118, Elapsed Time: 00:00

[undeleting and Disabling References done] Processed Records: 920, Undeleted Records: 20, Elapsed Time: 00:00

Edited September 27, 2018 by BigAndFlabby

[jimmygitto]

Thanks, BigAndFlabby, really appreciate you taking the time to help me out. If you dont mind a PM sometime, I would love to ask you some more specifics. Also love to get your feedback on the mod in general.

I TRIED to clean the esp in fo4edit, in my newbie modder way I guess. I deleted some records I marked for delete in CK, and some dirty edits. (What is with faraway clouds and other such nonsense being so easy to select?? ;) ) I thought I had gotten them all, but I will do it again, thanks.

About the ITMs- are these the cell lines? To be honest I dont know why these are needed, other than to “set the stage” for the decals I have added. Since they dont change anything, I didnt know why the CK puts them in there. Unless it was to allow the new decals to be located. And when I was testing early on, I experimented with removing them, and it didnt seem to be stable without them.

I felt confident that if a user had another mod in the same cell as one of these decals, that the decal would just be added, and this one addition would not “turn off” the edits made by any other mods. And

most are on walls not likely to be specifically modded, Id say.

I packed the ba2s manually with the archiver that comes with the CK. When I do the update I will pack them from with the CK. So it packs up everything you need automatically, huh? Thats great. Thanks again for pointing that out.

I will also go through and try to find any other quest fragments that might be in there. Its confusing to me how the “source code” psc wouldnt be needed, but I take your word for it! ;)

I actually tried for a while to make the added items without using a quest, for simplicitys sake, but the quest was the only way I found to properly apply a unique name to the item.

Again, thank you so much. T(his modding community really is fantastic.) Hope we can talk more as I work through this and learn more for my much-needed first update.

[JonathanOstrus]

RE PM, Yea sure that's fine.

 

I didn't actually try the mod, just browsed through the plugin.

 

The way you would do a "quick clean" like I did is to:

• Open the plugin with xEdit.
• In the left tree view right click.
• Choose "Apply filter for cleaning". Let it run.
• When finished right click on your plugin in the tree view and choose "Remove identical to master records"
• Then right click again and choose "Undelete and disable references"

At this point I like to save the plugin before doing a deeper clean manually looking for accidental dirty edits. Those are things that you might have clicked on and accidentally moved without realizing you did, or without meaning to. It will make an override in your mod that is unnecessary and could cause potential conflicts with other things if they intentionally modify the same record.

 

As for your "hope" that your mod won't cause issue for other mods also editing cells. That's a bit newbish and naive. Whichever mod has the later load order slot will get the final override status. So if yours is last then you could very likely break other mods without intending to. It's good practice to go through your plugin with xEdit and check everything that is there to make sure it's intentional edits. This can get pretty lengthy in larger projects, but if you take a look at it early it's not so bad to keep up with. But that's just my opinion. I noticed there were some small edits that *might* be dirty but could also be intentional. They just moved height, or small location position movements.

A cautionary warning about packing with CK though. Before telling it to go ahead, review the file list and make sure it's only adding things that you intend to. Specifically if you have F4SE scripts installed, it likes to pack those as well. The reason being, you're referencing scripts which extend from the replacement ones that F4SE installs so it thinks you need them. You could still pack manually if you're packing from the game's data folder. Just navigate to the scripts that you need and drag them into the archive tool. It should keep the correct path since it has a full data path structure on it. If you use a staging folder to hold all your mod files then that gets a little trickier as it may lose the path info if it doesn't have a full data\scripts\... style path. Like mine are J:\Storage Dump\wip - models\<ModName>\scripts\... and like. So I have to drag everything from the modname folder into the archiver or it screws the paths up.

 

The source code .psc file is only necessary to the person making the mod. The user only needs the compiled output .pex which is in the base data\scripts folder. If the user were to open the mod in CK themselves then they'll get a error message in the fragment boxes (or anywhere script source is necessary) stating that the source is not found. CK will automatically try to pack the source and the compiled script. A lot of authors just leave it be and include it. I personally do not, but then I also use a custom packing method.

 

You can use a leveled list with a name override to spawn items with a custom name. Though that doesn't work if you want to craft it. Only for direct placement or spawning in a container via the leveled list.

[jimmygitto]

BAF, thanks again for all this. Hugely helpful.

I will PM you sometime, hopefully this weekend, I appreciate it. I would like to clarify a couple things, in the meantime. Apologies if I end up sounding a bit defensive, I am really not. I very much appreciate every bit of feedback and help. But I have tried hard to get this right and I don't want to be misunderstood.

I definitely wasn't just hoping my mod doesn't cause issues. I consider myself newbish, but not THAT newbish :smile:. I feel it's my responsibility to make sure I have minimized that possibility, and to be thorough and transparent about any concerns. I tested this a lot and talked to a couple mod authors to try to confirm my understanding/observation/suspicion, as best I could. And I still described it on the mod page and readme just in case. To "warn" users that while I did not see issues, I admit I dont fully understand all the nuances of the CK so they should be aware and check for conflicts if they can. I also asked that anyone seeing any let me know, so I can try to address it. (One has, which they said was easily resolved. I think I will try to tweak that one in my first update to avoid it.)

I would like to talk more via PM about the ITM's you find alarming. I am guessing you mean the cell/worldspace entries? The CK creates these when I place the decals, even if I make no other edits. I tested this with mods that edit the same cells, and found it did not overwrite them. I even tested it with another graffiti mod that has similar entries for its decals. They look to be necessary to locate the decals, though. Although they dont seem to be disruptive, I still kind of wish I could just delete them... Only because they just look like a lot in xEdit. But I figured they couldn't be superfluous, if the CK adds them to accompany the decal they likely serve a purpose. I checked around and tested, and they are indeed needed just to locate the decals. So I tested potential overwrite conflicts by placing one of my decals immediately adjacent to some stuff added by other mods in the same worldspaces - this produced no flags in xEdit, and both worked fine in game, appearing and working in sufficient harmony... :) This is why I say I am confident they don't cause conflicts, it wasn't just a hopeful guess. But I still wanted to mention it to users just to be thorough.

The other minor edits are intentional. I had to move a piece of debris or delete another decal (like rust) for aesthetic purposes on a few. I also added a very small handful of things for context for a couple. (The standpipe for the sledgehammer, for example.) And I added objects as part of my "surprise." I did clean the esp in that regard, so I think I got the dirty edits. And I also tried to place the graffiti in locations not likely to be affected by other mods as much as possible, and I mention this on the page and in the readme.

 

Would you recommend I maybe suggest users place my mod high in the load order, so if there happened to be a conflict it would "lose"? That way people would just potentially lose a piece of graffiti, and not whatever their other mod does. Could be one more layer of confidence about minimizing conflicts.

I will ask you about the LL naming thing in PM too. I had tried that, but it adds the mod descriptions, e.g. "Hardened Automatic Custom-Name" vs. just "Custom-Name" like I was going for. (The idea was for it to be a unique weapon.)

Again, I hope this didn't sound defensive or anything, it's just all this is important to me. I don't want it to seem like I was careless. I tried hard to get this right. Mods have been so enjoyable for me, and so many of you mod authors are so helpful and so creative. I really want my mod(s) to be respectable and well-crafted and enjoyable additions to the community. That's why I am here asking for help and advice!

This weekend I will follow your cleaning protocol and do some retesting. While reading and typing I thought of a couple ways to -try- to cause issues, to make sure it doesn't.

Thanks again, this has already been a massive help.