Mage vs Warrior

[dukethepcdr]

Since the main theme of the game is being a dragonslayer, it seems to me that the most effective thing to do is to focus on ranged attacks. Whether that is through magic or ranged weapons is up to the player's preferred style. I have more fun in dragon fights (the main point of the game) when I have leveled up my ranged shouts and my bow weapons. The mod that lets you buy fire arrows is really handy for this and I highly recommend it. The cool thing about it is that it lets you buy a whole bunch (if you have the coin) so you can be over-the-top, or you can buy just a few of them and use them as a last resort.

 

I also like to use my dragon shouts as a last resort too. I like to role play my hero as someone who is not all that keen on magic and who trusts his sword arm and bow more than he does spells. When I start a new game, which is fairly often as that is my favorite part of the game, I like to start out with almost nothing like a refugee running for his life would do. If I was really trying to get away from a place as fast as I could, I wouldn't stop to pick up everything in sight. Light, fast and sneaky is the way I'd do it if I really had to.

 

Another must-have mod is the one that gives you a bunch more guide stones on your way to Riverwood. Of those, my favorite one is the Spy Stone as it gives you bonuses to several of the most useful attributes in the game including charisma and ranged attacks.

 

I find that having really high charisma and really high ranged attacks are the way to go in this game. Charisma gives you more options when interacting with NPCs which makes the game more interesting and more than just a shooting gallery.

[Blackraptor31]

You mean that the combat of skyrim isn't broken providing you self-nerf?

 

You have to deliberately choose not to do something otherwise it makes the game too easy, even on master.

 

Do what I did; download a combat mod, there are plenty out there although I prefer the "Athyra's Comprehensive Enhancments" as this fixes everything that was broken about enchanting, alchemy, and all weapons and magic whilst adding a ton of new features making combat more intuitive. Now fighting as a warrior is more than just smacking them until they keel over.

 

If the game is still too easy, download some realism mods. Freeze to death if you fall in icy water, and make sure to wrap up warm at night. Don't forget to eat and drink. Disable fast travel.

All these things help make the story better IMO. The game becomes about the journey, not how you managed to kill that dragon.

"The Hobbit" was a good book because of the journey. The overall plot isn't that far from Skyrim's (go and kill the bad dragon) but it is a literary classic because of how they got to the Lonely Mountain. Skyrim can be the same.

 

I don't know, the word "selv-nerf" is a little weird, if you ask me. Because the only way you can "self-nerf", is if the game was planned to be a rushfest. It was not -- every TES game is about exploring. So instead of rushing, you loot. I.E. It's not really "self-nerfing" as you'd put it.

 

And the other problem with combat mods for Skyrim, is that Skyrim isn't a combat game. As in, you can make monsters scale and/or make them twice as strong. In the end it does not matter: Either I get oneshot, I need to kite for half an hour, or I smack something on the head for 15 minutes. It isn't fun either way.

Most combat improving mods simply scaled enemies, then give them more toys to play with. Perhaps even get some perks and use their abilities. Now, that does not make it more fun for anybody. Now you either get oneshot by a dragon, or any archer in general, or you need to wither down half a million hitpoints.

 

That is the complete opposite of what I said. The only way to play vannila skyrim without it being broken is refusing to use some of the abilities open to you. Don't enchant, limited alchemy, no sneaking or else you turn the game into easy-mode.

And the combat mods do none of what you said. The one I use doesn't give enemies more HP, it makes the combat more intuitive. There are far more things you have to consider. Your stance for example will affect how much damage you do, it isn't always just your weapon base dmg+combat lvl+crit%.

 

Download the ACE combat mod, you won't regret it.

[Matth85]

That is the complete opposite of what I said. The only way to play vannila skyrim without it being broken is refusing to use some of the abilities open to you. Don't enchant, limited alchemy, no sneaking or else you turn the game into easy-mode.

Eh, no, what you said there and what I said earlier got no connection at all -- not opposite.

There is a very big different between:

 

Having maxed out sneak.

Having maxed out enchants.

Having maxed out Alchemy.

 

And:

 

Using maxed out alchemy with maxed out enchanting, with maxed out sneak.

 

Try to play Skyrim at 60+ where you use what is logical. I.E. A mage uses enchanting, yet does not enchant 100% less cost on 2 spell schools, and a warrior gets smithing, yets only upgrade gear he have allready found as loot.

Neither is "self-nerfing" yourself, they are instead logical and not using everything you got aviliable. The end result is a game where you feel like a "demi god", yet get your ass handed when the revered dragons fly by. Damn sucker oneshot me with 350 health.

 

 

And the combat mods do none of what you said.

I've tried multiple combat mods. And even if they put in some fun stuff like stances and what-not, the core is still there: Enemies either destroy you, or you destroy them. Either way you will click the same buttons. This is not a game with a in-depth combat system.

The outcome of every combat mod is the same: You either get destroyed by a mudcrab, or you will whack on a dragon for half an hour. Wether I get the ability to do more damage, yet take more damage, is irrelevant.

 

Now, I believe we are sidetracking a little, as this is outside the original threads intent. We both got our points across, and most likely agree on whatever we are talking about. I am not even sure by now. Hm...

 

Matth

[NeonDX7]

What is Vanilla Skyrim? By the looks of it, it seems like a mod that buffs up Skyrim's difficulty. Also, isn't it the complete opposite, in the beginning being a mage is difficult, and at the end it becomes easy?

[Matth85]

What is Vanilla Skyrim? By the looks of it, it seems like a mod that buffs up Skyrim's difficulty. Also, isn't it the complete opposite, in the beginning being a mage is difficult, and at the end it becomes easy?

 

"Vanilla" is used to describe "original" and/or "clean". So, vanilla Skyrim is Skyrim before any mods, DLC or expansions.

 

Warrior starts out exceptionally strong. Being able to 1-2 shot anything for quite a few levels. At mid levels warriors gets problems, mostly due to NPC mages hit like trucks. Towards the end, meaning 40-81, warriors wreck everything.

Mages starts out weaker, with mana issue and all that fun stuff. Mid game mages get overly strong, lasting well up to late 30ish. At last, at 40+, things get bad. Spells does not scale, but the enemies are now top scaled.

 

AN example in end-game, on my battlemage without mods:

Droug Deathlord is the enemy.

Warrior: 1 powerhit will whack of 20-30% of his hp, and most likely stagger him.

Mage: Master level fire spell takes 10% of his hp, and draisn me of 70% of my magicka.

 

Note that this is a balance of +magicka, less destruction cost and + 2 handed damage enchants. My Health/Stamina/Magicka is all equal at 350, or at least close.

[NeonDX7]

What is Vanilla Skyrim? By the looks of it, it seems like a mod that buffs up Skyrim's difficulty. Also, isn't it the complete opposite, in the beginning being a mage is difficult, and at the end it becomes easy?

 

"Vanilla" is used to describe "original" and/or "clean". So, vanilla Skyrim is Skyrim before any mods, DLC or expansions.

 

Warrior starts out exceptionally strong. Being able to 1-2 shot anything for quite a few levels. At mid levels warriors gets problems, mostly due to NPC mages hit like trucks. Towards the end, meaning 40-81, warriors wreck everything.

Mages starts out weaker, with mana issue and all that fun stuff. Mid game mages get overly strong, lasting well up to late 30ish. At last, at 40+, things get bad. Spells does not scale, but the enemies are now top scaled.

 

AN example in end-game, on my battlemage without mods:

Droug Deathlord is the enemy.

Warrior: 1 powerhit will whack of 20-30% of his hp, and most likely stagger him.

Mage: Master level fire spell takes 10% of his hp, and draisn me of 70% of my magicka.

 

Note that this is a balance of +magicka, less destruction cost and + 2 handed damage enchants. My Health/Stamina/Magicka is all equal at 350, or at least close.

 

 

 

 

You're totally right, man. I have experienced this, I was a mage(pure mage, no weapons) at once, in the beginning, it was annoying when you lost all your magicka, you'll have no offense and that leaves you quite vulnerable. Then you'll have to run till your magicka bar refills. However, the destruction spells did an insane amount of damage to enemies. When I brought the spell firebolt, plus with impact+ dual cast destruction, my firebolt will usually 2hko enemies, well, usually bandits, because of impact, I will be able to destroy Frost Trolls aswell, the stagger was very useful. But again, running out of magicka was a pain. Then when I beat the game, I got to enchanting some gear(dragonscale armor), I got 0% magicka reduction for both destruction, and Conjuration. This was mid-game, btw. The master destruction spells were pretty cool, very useful against Dragons. All went well into I reached like level 45, my destruction spells did not do a thing against bandits, I'm talking about the high level bandits, forgot what they were named. My destruction was even weak against the guards. I couldn't use illusion because one you reach around level 40, the enemies become to strong for illusion spells, even master illusion. The guards too weren't affected by my master illusion. My Dremora lords weren't much help either. Especially against large groups of enemies, the Dremora hardly assisted me. Right now, I'm going to be a warrior with a shield, shield charge looks pretty fun.

[Rooker75]

You didn't fill out the Illusion perk tree if guards were too powerful. Taking all the perks and dual-casting lets Rout, Pacify or Frenzy affect almost everything except dragons and mammoths. Only special named very-high level draugr should be unaffected, if I remember right. Maybe dragon priests too.

 

Personally, I like Dremora lords, especially when I can use two at once. They can take on even high level draugr deathlords and overlords. If one does goes down, the other keeps the enemy busy while I conjure another. They're not much use against an ancient dragon though, it turns out.

[Blackraptor31]

The illusion tree is limited. There is a maximum level which you can get your spells to reach and this is far lower than what is nessercary to work on the harder enemies at high levels.

 

A full-blown mage needs to get the special spells from completing the lvl 100 school quests in winterhold. They are basically the only spells that are any good later on.

 

 

Warrior is ok all game if you can get the enchantments up, but assassins have it easy even with basic gear. I've completed the game using only the stuff the Dark Brotherhood gave me and it was a breeze by the end.

[Relativelybest]

All I know is that my low level mage character is still stabbing things with a sword half the time, because she runs out of magica way too fast, and I can't machinegun out fireballs the way the NPC apparently can.

 

I also decided to have her run the mage college quest line before doing anything else, and I'm sorta dreading having to fight Morokei.

[Rooker75]

Just take the Impact perk before you get to Morokei and keep him stun-locked until he dies.