Anyone else disappointed with the Stormcloak questline?

[theconquistidor]

In regards to the Bear of Markarth the Empire seemed to have no problem calling the Forsworn savages when they were in control but seem to sing a different little tune once Ulfric liberates it (the book even states the Empire would recognize a forsworn Kingdome, in the game we see no such thin).

 

The biggest nail in the Imperial's coffin is this little lie they keep telling in Markarth coincidentally.

 

Markarth Legate: What the rebels like to forget is that the Empire is the only thing keeping the dominion out of Skyrim.

 

Ondolemar just down the hall with his inquisitors: The Thalmor are here, and we're watching you.

 

Me: Well, great job protecting Skyrim commander.

 

and one last thing after the war's over as said by Rikke

 

Legate Rikke: Now that the war's over, maybe the Thalmor can stop their damn inquisitions.

 

As another fun fact, in the civil war overhaul mod if the Stormcloaks take Markarth you can view a scene that was originally cut from the game. Galmar will execute Ondolemar and the Thalmor on sight once the cities taken. I'd rather have people like this in charge than outsiders with false promises

[Lachdonin]

In regards to the Bear of Markarth the Empire seemed to have no problem calling the Forsworn savages when they were in control but seem to sing a different little tune once Ulfric liberates it (the book even states the Empire would recognize a forsworn Kingdome, in the game we see no such thin).

 

The biggest nail in the Imperial's coffin is this little lie they keep telling in Markarth coincidentally.

 

Markarth Legate: What the rebels like to forget is that the Empire is the only thing keeping the dominion out of Skyrim.

 

Ondolemar just down the hall with his inquisitors: The Thalmor are here, and we're watching you.

 

Me: Well, great job protecting Skyrim commander.

 

and one last thing after the war's over as said by Rikke

 

Legate Rikke: Now that the war's over, maybe the Thalmor can stop their damn inquisitions.

 

As another fun fact, in the civil war overhaul mod if the Stormcloaks take Markarth you can view a scene that was originally cut from the game. Galmar will execute Ondolemar and the Thalmor on sight once the cities taken. I'd rather have people like this in charge than outsiders with false promises

You are applying a false standard to the notion of keeping the Dominion out of Skyrim. It's very clearly a statement about invasion, not embasies or inquisitors for treaty enforcement. You also ignore the fact that many Imperial Commanders state very clearly that they hate the Thalmor, but there is this little thing called diplomacy.

 

Galmar executing a foreign dignitary is pig-headed and stupid. It shows more the fact that the Rebels can't make good decisions than it does their honesty and capability. At the least he was a good ransom, at mist his death is valid grounds for the Thalmor to invade. Galmar literally represents every stupid nord in Tue provincce.

 

And finally, the Reachmen are, actually, savages. What the Empire had a problem with was their attempt to integrate into 'civilization' and Ulfric stamping them back into the dirt. There was an opportunity to bring a stability to the are that has NEVER existed, and like an idiot Nord, Ulfric ruined it.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Lachdonin

[fraquar]

Treaty enforcement? What treaty exactly are they enforcing with torturing Thorald at Northwatch Keep?

 

"It is my duty to inform you that Thalmor agents have taken possession of the prisoner and have escorted him to Northwatch Keep. I don't think I need to elaborate. It is in everyone's best interest if the matter is dropped entirely. I trust there will be no further inquiries as to this matter."

 

Seems to me he was an Imperial prisoner handed over to the Thalmor - if my understanding of English is correct.

[Lachdonin]

Thorald was an open worshipper of Talos, and under the White-Gold Concordant, Talks worship was outlawed. After it became clear the Empire was unwilling to enforce its treaty ban, the Thalmor stepped in to take crusty of those who were practicing an illegal religion.

 

That doesn't make it RIGHT, but it does make it legal.

[fraquar]

From what I can gather, Thorald (Stormcloak prisoner) is far more valuable to the Imperials in their own hands - where they can interrogate him and get Stormcloak information. Can't imagine they'd hand him over to the Thalmor unless it was to wash their hands clean and let the Thalmor do the interrogating - with methods that would be impossible for the Imperials to do on their own citizens.

 

Added: The comments of the Thalmor guard at Northwatch Keep pretty much suggest that is what happened, since even if they did have him the only way they would release him is by order of the Imperial Legion.

Edited July 18, 2014 by fraquar

[iSmithyy]

I think Ulfric's intentions are good but Ulfric himself is a bit of a tosser, thus my siding with the empire just to rid Skyrim of him. Also, don't forget, he put you in the whole Helgen situation with his rebellion.

[notmyhome]

I really hate how you have to attack whiterun with the stormcloaks.

I'M THE FRIGGIN THANE OF THAT CITY! The jarl took me in when I was but an escaped criminal, despite not officially being admitted into cities as a Khajiit (I do not, however, regret kicking his children out). Adrianne Avenicci showed me the ropes of smithing my own equipment. Ysolda was the most open-minded person about my Khajiit descent, even marrying me in the end. So many nice people who'll be negatively affected by the battle.

[Lachdonin]

From what I can gather, Thorald (Stormcloak prisoner) is far more valuable to the Imperials in their own hands - where they can interrogate him and get Stormcloak information. Can't imagine they'd hand him over to the Thalmor unless it was to wash their hands clean and let the Thalmor do the interrogating - with methods that would be impossible for the Imperials to do on their own citizens.

 

Added: The comments of the Thalmor guard at Northwatch Keep pretty much suggest that is what happened, since even if they did have him the only way they would release him is by order of the Imperial Legion.

 

Admittedly it's interpretive, but after talking to Tulius I got the impression that the Thalmor soldier in question as being Mocking. Tulius ales it rather clear that, while he technically has the power to release prisoners, that authority is on paper only, and the guards know that. Tulius can order Thorald released, but then the Guards will inform Elenwin, and Tulius will at best lose his job, at worst be charged with treason. Unfortunately, that's how treaties and embasies work...

 

I also find it unlikely that the Legion would rely on Thalmor interrogations. We see that they have their own dungeons and torturers, and relying on the Thalmor would require them to truse the information they ad given. Considering the distrust and hatred of the Thalmor and the Dominion in the Legion, I don't think it's likely they'd believe a word the Thalmor said.

[fraquar]

So you are saying the Thalmor can axe the General in charge of all Imperial forces? I guess the Empire is far worse off than even I imagined.

[Lachdonin]

So you are saying the Thalmor can axe the General in charge of all Imperial forces? I guess the Empire is far worse off than even I imagined.

First, Tullius is not in charge of all the Legion. He doesn't even really have a legion under his command, but rather a motley bunch of Nords in uniform.

 

Second, your not overly familiar with the power of diplomats are you?

 

Third.. losing hos job does not mean Tullius would be fired. Rather, he would likely be reposted, leaving the Legion in Skyrim without a commander in the short term, which would be detremental to their efforts to quell Ulfrics stupid little rebellion.