Porsha Posted November 26, 2008 Share Posted November 26, 2008 Honestly speaking there's a lot of people on this thread given many related and useful examples of why something such as this should be free in a video game but i still want to try to add another one because if we look as how things were in old (but still the best in many aspects) rpg games and how much freedom they've given the players no matter how their graphics were or how many copies of them sold causing the companies made them not exist today, we still call them Legendary (such as Fallout, Fallout 2, Planescape Torment, Baldur's Gate series etc), as Asrayl said someone taken that freedom from players and companies who made those wonderful games for us bit by bit, where we tried to solve the same quest in 6 different ways in price of playing the same game over and over. Same happened for Bethesda when they first announced they will make the FO3 they've faced too many problems, old fans in one side, ESRB and the rest on the other side, and since it is not possible to keep everyone happy (Also the point of big part of costumers contains Console kids who doesn't care about what exactly VATS does but what it exactly shows them when they shoot someone and clearly they need to sell enough copies to keep working on the same project as long as possible instead meeting the same fate of, lets say Black Isle), i still believe Beth did a good job while not cramping the legacy of FO3 in price of adapting it to today's gamers and keeping it safe from the eyes of conservative zealots. Things are different today while everyone is trying to censor something all around the world. My 2 cents about the mod, only difference of FO3 (if we can call it a difference rpg wise) is more realistic graphics than its earlier versions which is the part that gives those people of ESRB or conservatives something to talk about. Otherwise i don't remember anyone having a problem about child killing freedom or when you decided the fate of dozens of people (adult, children) in a small dialogue box and some little graphic animation which a normal person who's not a fan of video games can't see anything repulsive compared to what we have today. Thing is, any normal person who has enough mental stability that played FO or FO2 (evil, good, neutral) and didn't go rampage afterwards or become a pervert, pedo, child killer, won't do it after FO3 either, because some people actually looking for freedom in an enjoyable game and continue their life afterwards having fun couple of hours unlike the others making video's about how they kill children in FO3, how they make goth whores in Oblivion, for god's sake there are Japanese ecchi games for that and compared to some of them (like Rapelay) those petty mods are a joke. Thats why even if you find it useless for you, some people actually trying to narrow our options more and more everyday about what we can choose, in games and in real life both. If nothing else Modders who does a decent job deserves at least credit and useful comments or criticism because as long as there is at least 1 person who likes the mod, dl's it and uses it, none of us got anything to say since its their own taste and it's actually not harming anyone as many people stated above. If someone wants to shoot people randomly in streets, before coming to point of video games there are hundreds of other things that can give them inspiration of doing such a thing as long as they got it in their mind. (Postal is a good example of this as both the games and movie). Distasteful or not Mods are the only things that makes our games today as free as possible, closer the games we adored so much in the past. Discouraging people of doing this will result in more censorship, more dependancy to companies who releases empty games with no story and lots of shooting/banging, and it will eventually come bother you one day like when you are not happy with your current president, it is still so much better having democracy than monarchy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doggydoo Posted November 26, 2008 Share Posted November 26, 2008 I'm glad it wasn't in vanilla game. The concept of running into child cadavers probably would have prevented me from buying it. Merely because it would be depressing. But if people want the realism of mortality for the children, that seems fine too.However there is a potential slippery slope here. But I have faith that anyone intelligent enough to make a sophisticated modification, can recognize that there are limits to what should be modded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macmert Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I'm glad it wasn't in vanilla game. The concept of running into child cadavers probably would have prevented me from buying it. Merely because it would be depressing. But if people want the realism of mortality for the children, that seems fine too.However there is a potential slippery slope here. But I have faith that anyone intelligent enough to make a sophisticated modification, can recognize that there are limits to what should be modded. In today's world, we are cloning people, having scientific achievements many of us wouldnt even dream of maybe a year ago... and we should limit people about what they can mod and cant mod??? There is no slippery slope here, it is only dead kid pixels... If a mod threatens democracy, secularism, the unity of my country (I live in Turkey) I would oppose it... If a mod humiliates ME in person, I would oppose it... But if a mod enhances drugs... Well I dont care, I dont want to be an addict IN THE GAME... Now that is the important part... IN THE GAME... it is only a game... Another thing, tell me which one is more twisted, killing kids in Fallout or people getting married in second life then getting divorced... I dont know if you heard it, a woman in second life got married to a man, then the man gets married in real life, the woman in second life feels she is being cheated on and hacks in to the guy's PC and deletes his character in second life... The woman is charged with 3 years of sentence... So maybe cops should arrest me too for killing kid pixels since I am a potantiel child killer, raper and drug addict right :D Also dont forget that Thompson guy was he Thompson? that retarded lawyer who got disbarred??? :D He sued rockstar for GTA, and look where we are, he is disbarred and we get ANOTHER GTA :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BulletSix Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 all in all a nice read here ^^and the following, as always, my own personal opinion. on one hand there´s the argument "wow, cool, more realistic!" and "hey, now i can play the real bad guy!" on the other hand: "meh, its just pixels, no reality here" ... to me that seems contrary, but well one as one pleases as long as he doesn´t disturb others with it. (no i don´t think that the existance of this mod has to be seen as disturbing) and to me its equally "mentally disturbed" to "scream how terrible" as saying "no realism without, thats a must to play". like it, play it ok, your choice (if it were properly done(*) i even might try, and i really don´t like the idea of killing children, pixels or not).And please don´t say it "mercyful" to kill them. You can say that over an animal but not a human being. (*) as long as killing a child hasn´t severe consequences (as e.g. anyone still following a law gives you a hard time if you do it repeatedly AND a real karma-loss for the act per se) i do not consider it properly done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerogue Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Bottom line is, we need children killable so there's the option not to kill them, and even to protect them. The vulnerability of the children in the game should serve as a reminder of the value of the lives of real children. you my mate, have a good an valued point. I think I wil eventually install this mod because of this point alone :) as for the rest, i think Beth answered the call, ppl wanted kids in Oblivion no ? well now they have em. I'v also seen multiple post of ppl saying they could be essentials , well there you go. and still ppl keep complaining :blink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TriAsh Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I like realism in games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enkephalin07 Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I don't think the quality of Deus Ex or Ultima IX was hurt by the ability to kill children. It wasn't in any way rewarding in gameplay or story, in fact Ultima IX made you consider very uncomfortably the value of your actions. But they're there, living in a world where terrible things happen to people, even children. And sometimes they're guilty of doing those terrible things themselves, in which case the consequences should also be theirs. I wouldn't go out of my way to kill children, imo they were the best voice actors of the game, and anyone who's so driven to target them aren't much more advanced in maturity than them. But if you place a child in a brutal world then you expect that they face brutality without any magic forcefields, such as people do in the world we really live. Child-killing should not in any way be rewarding in gameplay, though you can't account for the personal satisfaction some players may take, and should involve a penalty. Someone suggested a karma drop to reflect social value, but karma really really isn't a social quality; reputation is, and that is where it should catch up to you. With the population numbers so badly beaten, even anyone without a child would want you dead. If there's a faction that actually lauds child-killing, then associating with that faction should penalize the player even more; if they hold life in that little value, then they're more than likely to cheat or kill the player themselves. But in the end, it's just a game; no children are harmed in the production or replaying of it, so anyone who's too outraged that it can happen in digital representation should turn off their computer and go get involved in fighting real life crimes against children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikokurk Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Personally I was shocked when I found out they couldn't be killed in FO3. No, I didn't try to kill one I was following the kids I rescued from Paradise Falls to Lamplight when they were attacked by Raiders and didn't get hurt. I figured that they might have been set essential to tell the Mayor. Then I read about it on Bethesda's Forum. WTF. Child Killer was one of the karma thingies they called you in both FO1 & FO2. I killed one in a crossfire in both of the games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skree000 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 I liked being ABLE to (if i chose) kill the kids in Fallout 1 and 2... Some of the real angry buggers at the far end of New Reno were aggro to me for no reason and would belt me with rocks. MINIGUN time! Hose them all down! weeee (or pickup the rocks and throw them right back in their faces, w/ blood mess perk on, BOOM *guts* hehe /evil) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 oh~my god think your file Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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