Fallout Remastered?

[Franpa]

Ah okay, just noticed that there's a gray on gray X in the corner of each forum signature that lets you either ignore a specific users signature, or all signatures. The question regarding them was more or less a curve ball as I knew the first 3 questions were too easy for you!

 

I believe I sent you a PM, tell me if I accidentally clicked Cancel instead of Send lol.

Edited April 23, 2013 by Franpa

[CountFuzzball]

(So do you use master-update with 3.0.15?) That's a big NO. never. Flipping the master flag on .....on plugins deals with knowing what the plugin will do once converted. If you do that and did not know what will happen? it's is the source of the biggest headaches I have ran into.

 

If you download My anchorage tree mod, and use master update on it, you will not have any tree's, what you will have is Bloatware ! LOL.

75 % of the mods every where will end up as Bloatware because the esm factor treats the data in a different way, it's the opposite of a function.

A tool to allow it's use"(esmify)" is a method used to discover if the coding done to the file you create will work correctly or not, it was intended as a tool, for developers, mod authors to decide which way they want to publish. TESedit has a long, very long history, and the authors of the-latest version will flat tell you, "you better know how the program works", read the manual, get an understanding of it's purpose first before you jump into that pool, there may be Purana in that pool.

 

As a result of allowing some information as to how it operates has caused in influx of the user base to miss use the tools and a snowball effect took place, too much so. So, as a result, you will not get much cooperation from US, the Developers as to what's wrong with your plug ins, because we do not know what was done. a big nasty circle of events takes place. If any one offers advices here, you can bet, they have been down that road already and know from experience as to what "might be at fault". most of the time , we find out, some things by the OP of the problem left important things out. AKA master updating all their files and ...oh I like this one, " master updating the patches on top of the patches. including the merged patch !" it never stops.

 

I pulled my support for merged files due to this reason. In the latest version of TESedit. so you know where to look. under the options tab ,have a look there, they moved that data from site. this version is set by default to set all data in a plugin to opposite to parent already. BUT ! they give you access to the inside workings of the program by allowing you to turn that feature off .60 % of the code in a fallout3 game, set to opposite to parent will break the game. and it is not up to you either, it's fully automated and once done,. it's done baby, you can not dig out which string went bad or should not be set that way.

 

make any simple plugin, say a weapon of your choice, or put a NPC some where in the game world. when done set it to opposite to parent and see what happens. That is IF the game will even load it?

 

If you don't mind, just what are the implications of esmifying an esp and building another esp that uses it as a master along with fallout3.esm and then flipping the esm bit back for the mod?

Just to illustrate:

Fallout3.esm

foomod1.esp (esmified)

<create mod based on fallout3.esm and foomod1.esm>

<flip bit back>

Fallout3.esm

foomod1.esp (espified)

foomod2.esp (with masters Fallout3.esm and foomod1.esp)

 

Would this be the kind of thing that would be A Bad Thing? I've done it with some Oblivion mods courtesy of wrye bash, etc to some of the esp-only dlc, but haven't tried it with FO3.

 

As an aside, all of your posts are fascinating to read, the amount of knowledge you have of the game engine is stunning.

 

Cheers!

[Purr4me]

TO CountFuzzball: you want too see what gets changed in between the different format? then down load my anchorage tree mod, it's an esp format. Esmify that, but only after you are in that DLC and playing it. yes, the saved game will change, the code will still function, but only one direction, it will not allow you to reverse this. Once in the game and running around in there, you will see trees as an esp form, But, after you are-running as an esm form, there will be no trees, so, if you wanted to use the data that creates the trees as a master file, meaning my file as a master source, your creation will not have that source data no matter what. you can not use the trees it contains as it gets canceled out as an esm,

 

a tremendous amount of mods are made this way. this mastering thing is a trap, you fell into it. the only way to maintain a custom code such as an *.spt extension in an esm format is to make the top line differently named, there is no other way. 150.000 trees in the game world, of those, I have only one tree I use as a base code, you would call it "Hard coded", that's for me to use and not you. this is software protection. It protects you and me from theft of an idea or the work involved. But, you are more than free to attempt you ideas on my mod, "Have at it !", that's why it's there. Other wise I would not upload it.

 

It's a training tool from my perspective. My patch file is also a training tool, It's use is to solidify the false sense you are receiving using this subject as a ground, where it has no grounds. You do not have the source codes needed to create a game Default esm file, only Emulation.

 

Here, this post , is a hint of how that Emulation can be turned into Hard code. That's all I am willing to post, any further and I may get into trouble. I don't want that. You have the data in my signature and the wealth of knowledge is also contained in the mods I support. Dig it out.

 

All tools are based on what is known to be defaults, off the disc, once you make changes to how the code operates, Tools like Wrybash do not function correctly any more, it only gives you a summation of an outcome that will work, not the data it's self, A compiled array of code that works only.

 

My teacher was not liked much here, and My tutors are all gone now. The geck is Graphics card dependent, and it's very hard to deal with. The Olivia CK is a stringer set of software, I can and have used for faout3 to make some things work where the geck will not allow you to make it work, but, once created and set, the geck will load it, some times it complains because the code it see's is not from this games structure, It's from the base code that made the game in the first place, Oblivion is the core of fallout3. Map, world space, LOD, waters, etc... you take all of this, and know just how much work and knowledge the tool makers have, and contributed their time to make a tool as string as they can to fit this codes base, then further taking it passed that realm to be cross platform, They deserve the credit, I learned from the doing and watching what was done, and doing it my self. Fo3 edit, TES V, TES4 tools, is where it all starts. Then Papyrus came into the picture, I am sure that last new version of Java "papyrus" will be in the new faoout4, it's just a hunch, so I am ready for it. you can download the papyrus software and learn how it works, make thing with it, and be ahead of the game before the game comes out. once you understand the new way the code works, these old RPG games will lose luster. I hope you have a good Internet connection as the world around us is advancing every fast, smaller, hand held devices, and Glass, The games may end up in the palm of your hand .

 

I will upload an extra esmified version of the control tree that sits right in front of project purity so you know I am not just blowing smoke. That should suffice as a guide. as soon as I find it.

 

Kitty.

[CountFuzzball]

so, if you wanted to use the data that creates the trees as a master file, meaning my file as a master source, your creation will not have that source data no matter what. you can not use the trees it contains as it gets canceled out as an esm,

 

So, what you're saying is setting your anchoragetrees file as an esm and then attempting to create an esp based off of that, with the intent of lets say, populating the Wasteland with them, won't work because I 'physically' won't be able to select your tree in the GECK due to the 'hard coding'/data manipulation magic you've done to the orignal esp file?

 

and then flipping the esm bit back so the custom mod i made depends now on both fallout3.esm and anchoragetrees.esp?

 

If so, hats off to you, that's ingenious 'copy protection'!

 

 

a tremendous amount of mods are made this way. this mastering thing is a trap, you fell into it.

Like I said, I was only flipping the bit, doing the editing and created a small derivation on a few of the mods, then saving the new esp file, so it has the masters as oblivion.esm and KOTN.esp as masters (oblivion engine supports .esp files as masters to other esp files just fine it seems, but the CS seems to be missing the ability. The esp needs to be esmified for the duration of the editing/creating a new derivitive .esp for it to work).

 

you would call it "Hard coded", that's for me to use and not you. this is software protection. It protects you and me from theft of an idea or the work involved.

Can't argue with that. Copyright is copyright.

 

But, you are more than free to attempt you ideas on my mod, "Have at it !", that's why it's there. Other wise I would not upload it.

Won't be the last to say that much of my knowledge is from looking at and hacking at others' mods to see how they work and then applying that knowledge to my own mods (that and a lot of reading of the CS/GECK wiki!). "Standing on the shoulders of giants" and so on. I do give credit where it's due.

 

It's a training tool from my perspective. My patch file is also a training tool, It's use is to solidify the false sense you are receiving using this subject as a ground, where it has no grounds. You do not have the source codes needed to create a game Default esm file, only Emulation.

 

I think I understand what you're saying. Making a .esm file out of a .esp mod (i.e 99% of the mods on nexus) without a really *really* good reason for doing so causes "havok" with the game engine (stuff not rendering/displaying properly, instability, CTDs etc) and should be totally avoided by anyone who doesn't know the exact reprecussions of esmifying their mod?

 

Cheers for reading this wall of text, Kitty!

 

CountFuzzball.

Edited May 1, 2013 by CountFuzzball

[Purr4me]

It took one stubborn tree at project purity , to find the right sequence of code and keep it there no matter the format. here in lies the problem. Only that one tree is stable, the geck and the engine will not allow you to change substructure of the objects, only the over laid data, a dead tree is now a live tree, yet, still a dead tree, see? same goes for a tin can, it's an object that can be used ,picked up, has havok responses, is a collision item, and can be thrown or moved about.

A dead tree in this game has collision. you can't pass through it, but, if you replace the item after it loads with another object that has no collision, then that objects code gets turned off, ...........it's still there, just not seen. For example. at the anchorage memorial, I, and a friend have been discussing the hardwood trees there. the way the fallout3.esm has them anchored in place. these items are duplicated in the Broken steel.esm file too.

 

If I tried to change these specific trees using the method I have for the others, I am left with a large set of holes in the planters where they reside, further more, the ground under neath the memorial is sunken too. well, I am one that does not give up. I found another way, the Original way the game was made to remove those trees as if they never were placed there to begin with.....after the game load them, only before rendering them, they are removed and yet not.

 

I did not attempt to replace them in that world space. I just wanted NO trees to be there. the game does not like what I am doing, it does respond correctly, but some where, in the engine, these items all are using the structures for other things. I can only Summarize, Vector points math for placements, if we change the vectors in the viewing window, the games engine recalculates and we end up see what we want ,only other things are now out of place. That's the draw back. Too many changes will get a messed up program to crash. So, the program needs to be fixed, Fose it seems is my only alternative to change how the engine operates in ram. switch things around on the fly sort of speak. works wonders. But, then it';'s no longer default

one single tree opened up a window of unseen applications, that led to a different path, now, any object I don't want to show up, I no longer need to write code for it, I have yet another method to clean up those mistakes the default game places into the view finder. No graphics hit,s no stabilization bugs. just nothing there for any math to calculate. and all of the data is still there. The problem is the engine. I just tried the trick on 2 other games, it works on those too. saved games have no hits, no bugs found, one way or another. Funny, I used one thing to replace another and the snowball keeps rolling.

http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/8792/harwoodtreesgone.jpg

 

Kitty.

Edited May 1, 2013 by Purr4me

[Purr4me]

All hardwood trees are just gone from the game, not seen, and not required to be seen, in some places, where other objects are connected to them they remain, but stand alone back drop items are all gone. LOD over lays are touchy items to mess with. one way or another , I will learn how these things operate and remove the drag the game places on machines. My mod will not run on my lap top, requires too much machine...as it was, now it runs , and runs very fast.

 

There is a lot to be said to an idea, maybe in the future of things to come ,there might be ways to remove standing standards in all PRG games for new equipments to run the old stuff. So far, it's an uphill battle all the way.

[Purr4me]

Ok, topic change here. "Hair", as in moving, hair, wavy hair. I found out why it's as stiff as a board, Hair is a party hat !! that's right, a stiff red cone.

That's why no one can change anything with hair.

Odd thing here, Just suppose you use an animation sequence for the hair parts from the tail of the Brahman ? go into the game and just watch it or load up the geck, enable havok and watch the tail. No body said we can't use THAT code to make the hair real as possible. Th *.kf is all we need. for the tail part.

 

any experts with Nifscope? have at it, pull it from Bethesda's root, the bsa archive Creature section, and open that bad boy up and mix and match.

always Hair was a problem with Project Beauty and hair packs. Party hats??? oh my lord, why not cardboard. a tin can.............

[Franpa]

So I completed Raven Rock and the next quest won't begin... unless my memory is faulty the next quest should automatically trigger? Anyways when entering the Citadel Laboratory I find all of Lion's Pride, one of the scribes and the main scribe guy (In blue uniform) standing around as though something is meant to trigger, but nothing does. I can nudge them around and they'll move back in to position but no dialog or anything.

 

I want to play with the big robot :/

[Purr4me]

untick remastered mod while standing there and see if it releases, check you quest log in the pipboy and see if the escape from the base completed, I knows it posts a message, but does it post that in the quests completed list?

 

Kitty.

[Franpa]

You are correct that in the Pipboy it displays the quest grayed out but the last item on the check list "Escape the Enclave" isn't marked as complete. progressing from Eden with this mod disabled, fixed the issue.