Troublesome bug involving invisibility spell

[baduk]

Hi.

 

I just pasted this over from the bethesda forums cause maybe different people read these posts.

 

Edit: And their troubleshooting forum does not seem to be dedicated to mods.

 

I am having a strange bug where I automatically begin casting invisibility when an NPC tries to "apprehend" me.

This can be made to happen if I commit a crime or during a quest when an NPC initiates dialogue.

I first noticed this happening shortly after I created my first set of spells at a spell altar which i did upon becoming skilled enough in illusion to cast invisibility.

I tried removing the spells that gave me invisibility but NPCs will still not initiate dialogue and i need to speak to them first.

This seems to break some quests that I would like to enjoy.

 

here is my load order:

Active Mod Files:
00 Oblivion.esm
01 Jog_X_Mod.esm
02 CM Partners.esm
03 Cobl Main.esm [Version 1.53]
04 Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm [Version 1.34Beta3]
05 Armamentarium.esm
06 Cybiades.esm [Version 2.0]
07 Kvatch Rebuilt.esm
08 DA Run Fatigue.esm
09 HorseCombatMaster.esm
0A DIM Elves Of Lineage II Retex.esm
++ HrmnsOblivionScriptOptimizationv1.0.esp
0B Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp [Version 3.2.0]
0C UOP Vampire Aging & Face Fix.esp [Version 1.0.0]
0D Oblivion Citadel Door Fix.esp
0E DLCShiveringIsles.esp
0F Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp [Version 1.4.0]
10 Natural_Weather_HDR_by_Max_Tael_RD.esp
11 Natural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.esp
12 Enhanced Water v2.0 HD.esp
13 ChaseCameraMod.esp
14 FlyingCameraMod.esp [Version 1.3]
15 Living Economy.esp
16 Living Economy - Items.esp
17 Cutthroat Merchants.esp
18 personality_idles3b.esp
19 StandingJOJO.esp
1A Choices and Consequences.esp
1B DLCHorseArmor.esp
1C DLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.5]
1D DLCOrrery.esp
1E DLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.3]
1F DLCVileLair.esp
20 DLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.5]
21 DLCMehrunesRazor.esp
22 DLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.4]
23 DLCSpellTomes.esp
** DLCSpellTomes - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.1]
24 ArmamentariumArtifacts.esp
++ ArmamentariumLLVendors.esp
25 DLCThievesDen.esp
26 DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.5]
27 DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch - SSSB.esp [Version 1.0.4]
28 ExnemRuneskulls.esp
29 Cobl Glue.esp [Version 1.50]
2A Cobl Si.esp [Version 1.32]
2B OOO 1.32-Cobl.esp [Version 1.41]
++ Cobl Tweaks.esp [Version 1.44]
2C Bob's Armory Oblivion.esp
2D Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp [Version 1.34Beta3]
++ OOO-Container_Trap_Instant_Effects.esp [Version 1.33]
++ ArmamentariumLL4OOO.esp
2E VHBloodlines 1.2.esp [Version 1.4]
2F Cybiades.esp [Version 2.1]
30 CybiadesDungeon.esp [Version 2.1]
++ cybCrashFix.esp
31 Ivellon.esp [Version 1.8]
32 BD&R - Deepgrave.esp
33 DibellaTempleWillowLakeVillagev1.esp
34 thievery.esp
35 Unique Dungeons - Lost Glory.esp
36 Unique Dungeons - Lichs Lair.esp
37 DLCFrostcrag.esp
38 DLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.4]
39 Knights.esp
3A Knights - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.9]
3B HeartOftheDead.esp
3C The Lost Spires.esp
3D Mighty Umbra.esp
3E Blood&Mud.esp
3F Billsburg.esp
40 xuldarkforest.esp
41 xulStendarrValley.esp
42 xulTheHeath.esp
43 XulEntiusGorge.esp
44 DibellaTempleWillowLakeVillage-EntiusGorge patch.esp
45 ULFallenLeafEverglade.esp
46 LostSpires-Everglade patch.esp
47 xulColovianHighlands_EV.esp
48 Billsburg-ColovianHighlands patch.esp
49 xulChorrolHinterland.esp
4A VeronaHouseBloodlines-ChorrolHinterland fix.esp
4B xulBeachesOfCyrodiilLostCoast.esp
4C VeronaHouseBloodlines-LostCoast fix.esp
4D xulLushWoodlands.esp
4E VeronaHouseBloodlines-LushWoodlands fix.esp
4F xulAncientYews.esp
50 xulAncientRedwoods.esp
51 xulCloudtopMountains.esp
52 xulArriusCreek.esp
53 HeartoftheDead-ArriusCreek patch.esp
54 xulPatch_AY_AC.esp [Version 1.1]
55 xulRollingHills_EV_withoutWheat.esp
56 xulRiverEthe.esp
57 xulImperialIsle.esp
58 LostSpires-DarkForest patch.esp
59 xulPantherRiver.esp
5A xulBravilBarrowfields.esp
5B BarrowFields-Blood&Mud-Patch.esp [Version 1.0]
5C LostSpires-BravilBarrowfields patch.esp
5D Kvatch Rebuilt.esp
++ Kvatch Rebuilt - OOO Compatibility.esp
5E Natural_Vegetation_by_Max_Tael.esp
5F Harvest [Flora].esp [Version 3.0.0]
++ Harvest [Flora] - Shivering Isles.esp [Version 3.0.0]
++ Harvest [Flora] - DLCVileLair.esp [Version 3.0.0]
60 Harvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.esp [Version 3.0.0]
61 WHOOSH.esp
62 Cobl Hmm.esp
63 diversegrasses.esp
** Salmo the Baker, Cobl.esp [Version 3.07]
64 Toggleable Quantity Prompt.esp [Version 2.2.1]
65 Cyrodiil Border Regions 1.2.esp
66 Enhanced Quest Roleplaying.esp
67 Alternative Start by Robert Evrae.esp
68 DA Fatigued Running.esp
++ DA ReducedBackwardsRunningSpeed.esp
69 DA Sprint.esp
6A AFLevelMod.esp
6B bgMagicEV.esp [Version 1.62EV]
6C bgMagicEVPaperChase.esp [Version 1.62EV]
++ bgMagicEVStartspells.esp
++ bgMagicEVAddEnVar.esp [Version 1.62EV]
++ bgMagicItemSigil.esp [Version 1.62EV]
++ bgMagicSpellTomes_for_WryeBash.esp
** bgMagicEVShader.esp [Version 1.62EV]
6D actors_in_charge.esp
6E EFGAddPose.esp
6F bgMagicLightningbolt.esp
70 Forward Motion Blur.esp
71 MotionBlur.esp
72 Elves Of Lineage II.esp
73 GB_Oblivion Tournament.esp
74 SwordDancer.esp
75 Argent Iron Armor.esp
76 Battle China Dress.esp
77 Gloria Armor.esp
78 MHSNKirin.esp
79 Western Armor.esp
7A SedaArmor.esp
7B Stylish Jump.esp
++ Cobl Races - Balanced.esp [Version 1.52]
** Cobl Races TNR SI.esp [Version 1.53]
** Cobl Races TNR.esp [Version 1.53]
7C Cobl Races.esp [Version 1.52]
7D CapsAdmin.esp
7E exhDual_Wield_Complete.esp
7F UFF Warrior Skin.esp
++ [GFX]_Initial_Glow-self.esp
80 Bashed Patch, 0.esp
81 Streamline 3.1.esp
82 Deadly Reflex 5 - Timed Block and 250% damage.esp
83 DeadlyReflex 5 - Combat Moves.esp
84 ActorsInEmotions.esp

 

Thanks

[dezdimona]

General Load-Order Guidelines

Here are the guidelines that I adhere to, personally.

 

~ Unofficial Oblivon Patch should always be first on the list. The fixes are great, but most aren't essential, so if a mod overwrites them its not a big deal, and the fixes have the potential for screwing up other mods if loaded later.

 

~ Offical Content (DLC's) should be loaded last, until you complete all quests associated with them (that includes buying all furniture for the houses and whatnot). Once they're complete, they can be safely moved up in the list. This is especially important for Knights of the Nine, which will have some fairly major problems unless loaded last (unless you get the UOP for KotN)

 

~ Major overhaul mods (OOO, Frans, MMM) should be loaded near the end. That gives you the most complete experience with any of those particular mods. It also lets you carefully choose which other mods to load afterwards... only move mods that you know will conflict and that you want the changes from. For example, I have Improved Soul Gems below OOO because I know that OOO changes the icons of some of the SG's, and ISG needs to be below to show through.

 

Some people will recommend putting larger mods first, but personally I disagree. There are a number of mods out there that make minor tweaks, and loading after a large mod will end up completely overwriting a chunk from one of the bigger mods because of the way conflicts work in Oblivion (even one minor change will take precedence over the entire record... for example, simply tweaking the speed of a weapon can cause every stat of that weapon to be retained to vanilla levels if loaded later).

 

So basically, it stacks up like this...

 

Oblivion.esm

Unofficial Oblivion Patch

<Minor Mods / DLC's (Post-Completion)>

<Major Overhaul Mod/Mods>

<Mods that specifically conflict with overhauls and need to take precedence>

<DLC's (Pre-Completion)>

 

 

 

Expanded Load-Order Guidelines

by dev_akm

 

I would extend this to include:

 

Oblivion.esm

Unofficial Oblivion Patch

<Weather/Environment/Sound Mods>

<Minor Mods/New Items/Houses/DLC's (Post-Completion)>

<Major Overhaul Mods>

<Mods that specifically conflict with overhauls and need to take precedence>

<DLC's (Pre-Completion)>

<Quests>

<Compatibility Patches/UOMP/Merged Leveled Lists>

 

And a special-case warning for Knights.esp (Knights of the Nine) -- you may not be able to move it earlier than some other mods (some people have had problems after moving it before OOO, for example).

 

That's basically the structure I use and I have 140+ mods working well together.

 

Another way of describing this (posted by DMan77):

....

Oblivion

unoffical patch

Deeper realism mods that add sights and sounds

added content like weapons/items

gameplay changes, like 'must eat and sleep'

The OOO type

the 'new begining' type mod..

................................................................................

................

[Vagrant0]

It may not be a problem of conflicts, it may also be a "feature" of some thivery mod. What is happening may be the exact intention of the mod as a means of getting away with stealing things.

[baduk]

Thanks for the replies. I`m not at my system right now so don`t have my current load order. I did alter it a bit to see if it fixed the problem but the invisibility bug is still happening. I was having some french dialogue issues that got cleared up by the change tho. Strange i was having those since I was pretty sure i downloaded the english versions of mods but I kind of liked the foreign language cause it made the world feel a little bit more alien to me.

 

The invisibility bug is also dialogue related so there might be a connection. When I have some time (maybe this weekend) I will sit down and go through the mod disabling process. I will let you guys know what I find.

 

btw. thievery.esp is from Thievery in the Imperial City. That mod has almost 50000 downloads over a couple years, ranked 80th on the Nexus. If this kind of behavior is an intentionally implemented feature, could it be a playtesting feature implemented by Bethesda to prevent a CTD while testing the DLC`s?

[Vagrant0]

btw. thievery.esp is from Thievery in the Imperial City. That mod has almost 50000 downloads over a couple years, ranked 80th on the Nexus. If this kind of behavior is an intentionally implemented feature, could it be a playtesting feature implemented by Bethesda to prevent a CTD while testing the DLC`s?

I was not pointing out any specific mod, just suggesting that some mod which alters how thievery works may be responsible for this.

 

It is very doubtful that Bethsoft would do anything of the sort since they clearly don't test their DLC's or expansions, and casting a spell probably would cause more CTD than it would solve.

[baduk]

Its been a litle while but i have an update.

 

I altered my load order a bit and finished some quest mods and put em nearer to the top of my order. I also went and disabled some mods but none of those fixed the problem.

 

I have a workaround though. If I cast a charm spell at the NPC before they talk to me and it causes their disposition to reach 100 they will be able to initiate dialogue without any problems. Using the console command "moddisposition" wont work tho. Any NPCs that have 100 disposition towards me already can always initiate dialogue without any problems.

 

I am thinking that the bug is caused by a load order problem that causes a script to be applied to my character instead of the intended NPC. Maybe there is an NPC that is supposed to "escape" when I try to talk to them. I have not encountered this NPC yet, I did encounter one who behaved similarly but I think i was swinging my sword at him instead of trying to talk. At least I dont experience all NPCs disappearing when I try to speak to them.

 

I used BOSS with the october version of the masterlist to set up my load order initially. I positioned other mods by hand after reading alot about load order on dev_akm's site. Even though I am not currently using Fcom. It was confusing though because the BOSS masterlist does not follow the same guidelines and other load order guides disagree on various points. It is also difficult to know what is wrong because I experienced no problems until my character was able to cast journeyman illusion magic. (except for some simple terrain issues like missing water and holes that are easy to fix)

 

Ok. so i guess the easiest way to fix my problem is to thorougly test my mod combinations by disabling them. But I think i might wait until I feel like messing with it since it is rather tedious and winter vacation is over and I already spent a large amount of time trying to get my FPS up runing fcom+ the other mods I wanted to use, and eventually cutting back. Oh, and i have that clunky workaround to rely on also.

[bben46]

I would suspect a mod that adds or changes some basic magic features. I was unable to find out much on bgmagic check that one out. It's also possible that what you are seeing is an accumulative effect of a combination of items, like very high chameleon from multiple enchanted objects.

[baduk]

hI.

 

woops. hit tab instead of caps loc and it made me post.. lol

 

I appreciate your input. bgmagic is actually part of "Less Annoying Magic Experience", LAME for short. Great mod with lots of features. I really like the changes to the magic system and it has synergy with the DA running mods via its continuous spells system. It is one of the mods that I tried disabling but that didnt make a difference with my problem. good thing you mentioned it cause i noticed that there is a newer version 1.66, I am using 1.62 that i downloaded only a month and a half ago. I might as well take a look at the changelogs and update.