Interior -> Exterior NPC zoning to wrong location.

[fcmem]

Guys im about to pull my hair out.

 

Im working on a mod and learning as I go.

I duplicated cell: "FFRadioCache02"

 

I created a new door in the waste land and linked it to the ladder (door) in the cell.

 

This works just fine for me, I can zone in and out no problem.

My followers can also zone in with me, again no problem.

 

However when the NPC's try to zone they teleport to the exit point

of the original cell, NOT the linked door.

 

The mod is pretty simple.. A pack of feral ghouls set to sandbox in Canterbury.

The tunnel is just a "holding area" durring daylight hours.

 

I made them part "player faction" and sat inside the tunnel waiting for their

travel packages to kick in, got the ref of one of the ghouls.when they zoned out I used console to take me to them and thats when I found out they're not

zoning to the door I placed in the waste land instead they're going to the original cells exit point.

 

I checked the teleport data a dozen times, recreated it a half dozen times, and even deleted the ladder completely and it still wont work.

 

I checked the geck wiki and I don't know what im doing wrong if I udnerstood it

right the NPC's use teleport doors just like the player.

 

I decided to delete the later, zoned in using a console command

and then watched the NPC's run to where the ladder use to be, and zoned out, HOW?

 

Is there another setting somewhere for NPCS to zone out of a interior to a exterior?

Please any help or nudge in the right direction.

Thanks in advance.

[prensa]

fcmem - Hello!

 

Have you updated the navmesh for your interior & the exterior where your doors are?

 

NPC's need the navmesh to tell them where doors are, if you add a door you must update the navmesh info by selecting the navmesh editing toolbar & clicking on the "Finalize Current Cell's NavMeshes" (red tick).

 

You'll then see a green triangle where your door is, the normal navmesh will be red triangles.

 

You also have to Finalize the navmesh where the exterior door is too, again a green triangle will show up.

 

Info on Finalizing:

 

http://geck.bethsoft.com/index.php/Navmesh_Creation_Workflow#Finalizing

 

General tutorial for navmeshing in case you're unsure of that:

 

http://geck.bethsoft.com/index.php/Bethsoft_Tutorial_Navmesh

 

Hope this helps!

 

Prensa

Edited May 2, 2013 by prensa

[fcmem]

Yup, that did it, I was able to get it to work with the auto generated navmesh.It looked prety ugly though, I'll probably go back and clean it up.

 

I thought the navmesh only handled where the NPC's could go.
Apparently it also saves portal information for NPC's, since they was still zoning (to the wrong area) even after I removed the door.

 

I did'nt think navmeshing would be nessary since I duplicated a alrady existing cell and made only minor changes.

 

Thanks again for your help.

Edited May 2, 2013 by fcmem

[prensa]

fcmem - Hello!

"Yup, that did it"

Great, glad to have hleped! :smile:

"I was able to get it to work with the auto generated navmesh.It looked prety ugly though, I'll probably go back and clean it up."

Yes, automated navmesh is usually pretty rough. :smile:

Navmeshing by hand is best, it takes a little getting used to but is actually pretty easy once you get the swing of it.

Main thing to remember is to save often while navmeshing as it's a little touchy & can crash at inopportune moments.

"I thought the navmesh only handled where the NPC's could go."

It let's them know where they can walk, where the exits are & where they can find cover if they get in a shoot out.

"I did'nt think navmeshing would be nessary since I duplicated a alrady existing cell and made only minor changes."

If you copy & paste a cell by hand, the navmesh won't get copied to the new version.

If you Duplicate the cell in the Cell Window the navmesh should be copied too.

However door portals always have to be updated for the specific cell as they are unique to each door.

Prensa

Edited May 2, 2013 by prensa

[fcmem]

"If you copy & paste a cell by hand, the navmesh won't get copied to the new version.

If you Duplicate the cell in the Cell Window the navmesh should be copied too.

However door portals always have to be updated for the specific cell as they are uniwue to each door."

 

Ya I duplicated it by using the cell window, must have been why they was still able to leave at all.

Luckly it's a very small cell so it should be easy to cut my teeth.

 

This is actually the second part of my mod, the first part I added more npc's and made some modifications to Canterbury.

 

I knew I was going to have to tackle navmesh in CC because NPC's was hanging up on the new additions.

So I guess that leads me to ask what happens if someone uses more then one mod in the same area?

All my changes to CC was additive, I did'nt delete or move any preexisting items in hoes not to cause any

conflicts.

 

But if I change the navmesh and then use another mod that adds objects to the area that has had it's navmesh played with then which navmesh is used? how does that work? it seems like it would be a huge conflict even if both mods do not conflict with each toher from a "object" stand point.

[prensa]

fcmem - Hello!

"Luckly it's a very small cell so it should be easy to cut my teeth."

Yes, start small with navmeshing is a good idea, it won't take you long to get the hang of it.

Took me a day or so to get my head around it at first but soon I was able to navmesh a room very quickly.

The only places that I find are a pain still are caves because of the uneven floors. :)

Just remember to save often as I mentioned above, GECK loves to CTD while you're doing your navmesh.

"I knew I was going to have to tackle navmesh in CC because NPC's was hanging up on the new additions."

Yes, if a new room has no navmesh then NPC's clump together & don't move properly.

"I did'nt delete or move any preexisting items in hoes not to cause any"

Definitely do not delete anything added by the vanilla game, if any other mod does something with a vanilla asset that you deleted the game can CTD.

If you don't want a vanilla item, sink it into a building or the ground.

"But if I change the navmesh and then use another mod that adds objects to the area that has had it's navmesh played with then which navmesh is used? how does that work? it seems like it would be a huge conflict even if both mods do not conflict with each toher from a "object" stand point."

That's an interesting question.

With other changes, like moving a rock, the last loaded mod is the winner.

I'm not sure if that applies to navmesh though, I've certainly never had a navmesh overwrite problem before.

Obviously there's no need to worry about all new navmesh within your mods unique buildings. It would only be the outside connection made to your new cells & if someone else's mod changed the exact area.

I've used mods like DC Interiors which adds many new doors to the DC area & not seen a problem.

The honest answer would be I'm not sure. :)

There is a well known bug with new navmeshes that are added by mods that are .esp's that you should be aware of.

Sometimes a the new cell's navmesh will be fine until you exit the room & return at which point the navmesh will be scrambled. Most notable by NPC's clumping up in the room.

Sometimes you may not be affected by this bug, I suspect it's linked to the size of the new cell added.

This bug only affects .esp's & the normal solution is to make a mod adding navmesh an .esm.

Prensa