Dragon City Mod
Posted 15 December 2007 - 01:09 AM
Posted 15 December 2007 - 02:19 AM
Actually, I'm curious now. I might run some NPC-creature tests, but why would movement be funky?
Posted 15 December 2007 - 04:40 AM
The reason why the Bruma battle was probably a bit smoother is because it was setup as a complex scene, so normal AI functions like pathing or fighting styles get toned down significantly, allowing more NPCs to be in action. The whole area is devoid of rocks, plants, everything for good reason. Even still, once you get over 10 NPCs fighting, you end up seeing some lag in reaction times, and an altogether poorer combat experience. Try watching it again when you aren't trying to fight for your life. Using creatures as NPCs won't necessarily be an improvement. Play with 10-15 skeletons in a room some time.
Well, I didn't do all the towns... but I'm not quite sure how they could have done that, as I've used mods with less NPCs than that, and I still got massive slowdown, yet I didn't really get any at the battle of Bruma... how did they manage that? Strange...
As for the NPC creatures... it could, possibly work, but I really don't know. I don't think it's ever been tried before...
But that's just one part as to why there is a slow down. Polygon counts also play a major role. More empty areas are a bit more forgiving, areas with plants, buildings, and other things are even less so. Even if you don't care about the AI, you'll have to deal with horrible frame rates when you go over that polygon count. Duplicate NPCs or creatures can lessen the strain somewhat, but planning some sort of big important event around this is just irresponsible, no matter how cool it may seem, nobody will really be able to see much of it.
The reason why NPC creatures would be a bit funky is because you need to redefine their animations, and sounds, in addition to having the body and head meshes prepared. There's a reason why Bethsoft went with NPCs for their knights of the order it was easier to setup. Compared to the possible performance boost, if you get any at all, it's not really worth it.
Posted 15 December 2007 - 05:42 PM
Cheydinhal, standing at the gate, looking at the shops/trees/chapel. KillAllActors left 7 essentials (Yes, I know). Standard FPS is 17-18, with the most high-poly view I could find. (From the west gate, looking at the shops/trees/chapel across the river) 2 spells, one of which places 4 standard NPCs (one with a sword, one with sword and shield, one with a bow, one mage) with standard wander packages at the player, another which places 4 similar "Faceless" (Creatures using full dwarven armor and a human skeleton as their body meshes. They have all the standard animations of humans, and a few idles. Standard wander package, and they sound like liches due to my incompetence at making TESSounds) at the player. A wide-range, low damage, fire spell.
4 castings (16 NPCs) dropped the framerate to around 10 if I kept them all in sight and kept looking at the high-poly chapel view. They chatted and wandered as normal. The game consistently crashed after attempting a fifth casting, I would imagine due to PlaceAtMeing persistent references). Hurling a fireball into them caused only a slight few of them to react, (I'm going to attribute this to a mod-induced glitch, as vanilla guards have behaved similarly in areas that didn't have that many NPCs.) the rest stood and stared at me. The game crashed shortly after. Very little framerate alteration, still easilly playable.
4 castings put the framerate to 14, again keeping them all in sight. They seemed a bit slow wandering, but did so. 7 to 11-ish castings dropped it to 13-12. Obscene (at least 17) amounts of casting caused the framerate to go to 8-10, but didn't crash it. They look exactly like humans in dwarven armor, no graphical flaws to be seen. Upon fireball-lobbing with 4 castings, significantly more of them reacted, but it still crashed shortly. No significant framerate change. They only used H2H, no spells/shields/weapons, but I attribute this more to my incompetence/differences between NPC and creatures skeletons.
Posted 15 December 2007 - 09:24 PM
"Any thoughts" on that?
Posted 16 December 2007 - 03:09 AM
Posted 17 December 2007 - 08:16 PM
Posted 17 December 2007 - 08:35 PM
I am looking at skeletons, and tried slapping on a torch node to the left hand, (and removed superfluous scabbard-nodes) but have yet to test it. As a bonus, though, they do cast spells with no trouble. I just wasn't giving them enough magicka. Having them fight in large numbers also turned out fine after they all stopped standing around dumbly.
Posted 19 December 2007 - 04:15 AM
Posted 19 December 2007 - 05:08 AM
Question... Why are you playing around with the nodes? You have the armor weighted to a skeleton with all the normal nodes right? Have you clicked "weapon and shield" above "pc level offset" in the creature tab?
I feel sort of guilty making another post for this, but no luck. I have no idea how to make them weild weapons. The "torch" node just, somehow, elongates their fingers (not uncooly, I might add) on the torch-hand and, on occasion, makes their arm point off in one direction, dragging the body behind, when they die. That and those I equip with shields (It's either that or, somehow, their basic attributes) are completely invisible and the game thinks they can be mounted. (Up to the point where you select them with the Horseshoe icon, it enters third-person, then snaps back to standard view as if nothing happened) Sorry...
You probably won't be able to give them torches, but provided you have the animations copied for that skeleton, you should be able to use weapons.