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Expanded Dragons, Bigger Battles


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#1
Zinnorokkrah

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Has anyone else noticed that despite the vast amount of work put out by Bethesda to make the dragons seem real that there isn't a diverse quest line related to them? On top of that, what is with dragons becoming pushovers at higher levels? Here is my idea for a moded quest line and just regular gameplay features which would add more depth to the dragon story. On top of it, this would likely also include a mod to make battles as they should be, large, chaotic, and a threat to your continued existence along with a higher population in Skyrim.

Features

1. Tougher Dragons with an expanded Shout pool.

Doesn't it seem strange that these natural masters of the Voice use only one or two shouts in combat? Or that they seem to be quite wimpy compared to most opponents? This feature would include a strengthening of the dragons and add two or three shouts to each dragon. Imagine trying to fight a dragon the can use the 'Slow Time' shout, 'Whirlwind Sprint', or 'Stormcall'. That is the kind of fear you're looking for with a dragon.

2. New Dragon Fighting Animations/Attacks.

Fighting a dragon just doesn't seem as exciting as it should. So it slams its tail on the ground, flames you, occasionally bites, and you might get flattened if it lands on you. Big deal, it seems to be quite repetitive. This feature would give the dragons a few new attacks, such as batting you away with a wing, smashing you into the ground, flicking you into the air, or swiping you to the side with its head, kicking out with its feet, and side-swiping with its tail. This would make the dragon fights less repetitive, and on top of it, would make even a weakened dragon a threat.

3. More Dragon Class Equipment.

Dragon Bones and Dragon Scales? Really? We're talking about a creature which supposedly has thirteen different properties just to its blood, and of which every part was said to breath magic and all we can do is craft armour out of them? I'm talking crafting dragon weapons- unique models, not re-skins. I'm talking about new items dropped from a dragon. I'm talking dragon teeth (dragontooth dagger anyone?), I'm talking dragon blood (Healing potion with nasty magic-draining side-effects?) and just the addition of those two items would probably enormously improve the depth to the Dragon Class.

4. More Kinds of Dragons.

Dragonlings anyone? How about young dragons? Drakes, maybe? In any case, this would add a few weaker varieties of dragon to the game, along with a few more unique named dragons which I'll discuss in the quest section below.

5. Unique Dragon Equipment.

Perhaps at Sky Haven Temple, after doing a few new quests for the Blades, Delphine and Esbern recover what appears to be the armour of the original Dovahkiin or at the very least, one of the heroes who fought Alduin the first time. This would be a unique, non-craftable, set of armour which would probably go quite well with the sword dragonbane.

6. Dragon Caverns.

Basically a location where dragons congregate, rest, eat, sleep, etc. This would be the primary place to find dragonlings or drakes. In any case, a basic summary of the place would be cave, quite a few young dragons, one very ticked off baby-sitter (Probably a normal dragon, but maybe an Elder) and a period of time where you need to smash, grab, and get the hell out of there before more dragons show up. This will tie in with the quest below.

New Dragon Related Quests

ACT 1- Dovahjun

Discovery-

Having returned to the Blades after doing a few miscellaneous quests for them you speak with a wizard who has recently joined them, and having studied Alduin's Wall has discovered something which could help you defeat the World-Eater. The dragons are ruled by a council of nine lords, symbolizing the Nine Divines, with Alduin at its head. There is one dragon lord per hold, and the Blades believe that if you manage to kill them all then the dragons will be thrown into chaos, some perhaps only following Alduin because their respective lord does. This quest will mainly revolve around finding another dragonstone, similar to the one from Bleak Falls Barrow, at some previously undiscovered location and then bringing it back to this wizard for him to study.

The Hunt-

You've returned to the Blades yet again and the wizard has finished translating the stone, at least part of it, which has revealed the location of the first of the dragon lords in one of the holds (Probably in the region of Markarth). You are to track him down, fight your way to him, and kill him.

Dovahjun-

You've made it to the dragon cavern the first lord is hiding out in, good job. Now you've got to kill him, his mate (probably the dragon nanny) and all the young dragons who are swarming to kill you- have fun. NOTE: A dragon lord will be a named dragon, as well as unique.

ACT 2- Dovahfeyn

The Return-

Repeat the quest line of 'The Hunt' and 'Dovahjun'. Take out another lord.

The Revelation-

Repeat the quest line of 'The Hunt' and 'Dovahjun', but with a twist. This time, when you go to fight the lord, he'll speak with you, revealing that there is a collection of dragons willing to rebel against Alduin having learnt that his younger brother Paarthurnax is still alive. Depending on where you are with the Greybeards quest line you might not know this, and that may affect your decision. You'll have two options, let the lord continue to attempt to raise his rebellion, or kill him. This may affect your decision to kill or spare Paarthurnax later in the main quest. No matter what you choose, you'll return to the Blades and question some of them on this subject. They'll reveal a few things to you, including much of Paarthurnax's back-story which could make your decision to let him live or die harder.

Dovahfeyn-

Repeat the quest line of 'The Hunt' and 'Dovahjun'. This time, however, three lords are ganging up on Dawnstar with a few other dragons. You have no choice but to fight them with the help of the guards of Dawnstar and the Imperial Legion. However, things may change based upon you decision in 'The Revelation'. If you spared the previous lord, then he'll arrive with a few dragons as an allied NPC and help you kick the tail of the other three. After this all the dragons near wherever 'The Revelation' took you will be friendly NPCs and the dragon lord a character you can speak to and learn from unless you do something hostile. You will bring this knowledge of a draconic civil war to the Blades, who will deny it, and refuse to speak to you.

ACT 3- Dovahkein

The Return of Paarthrunax-

This quest will depend heavily on your decisions in the main quest. This act is set well after you have befriended Odahviing and potentially killed Paarthurnax. In any case, after the main quest. Alduin is dead and Paarthurnax is roaming Skyrim, attempting to rally the dragons to his Voice. The dragons still loyal to Alduin's cause have rallied around the last dragonlord and refuse to give in. Your mission is to lead a small army of dragons, and the Greybeards, to stop the last remaining dragon lord before he calls Alduin's soul (Which was not absorbed) forth the manifest itself in his body.

The Turning of the Blades-

Disgusted with what you've done, even if it is for the good of a few sentient races, the Blades have turned on you, and all you symbolize, leading an assault on High Hrothgar. You must turn back their small army, which includes many mercenaries, and keep the Greybeards, along with Paarthurnax alive. If the Greybeards die, it will be your duty to find and train their replacements. In any case, the Blades now become a hostile faction with small groups of agents roaming the countryside. However, they can be tricked into fighting other people instead of you by luring them near either Stormcloaks, or Thalmor soldiers.

Dovahkein-

The Blades have recovered the ultimate anti-dragon weapon- a sword wielded by one of the first Blades in Akavir with the ability to absorb the soul of a dragon, and transfer the knowledge of its Thu'um to the wielder. Thus, the Blades have acquired the souls of a few dragons loyal to your cause, and have become Tongues- soldiers able to use the Voice in combat, like Ulfric Stormcloak and a few of the Draugr you've encountered previously. Lead a few loyal dragons against Sky Haven Temple, and either stamp out the Blades, or open negotiations with someone who will act as a secret representative to Esbern who is the less radical of the two and far more loyal to the Dragonborn. If you negotiate, Esbern will overthrow Delphine as leader of the Blades, and there will be peace between your two factions.

That's all I have for now- what do you think?

#2
jimbo553

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I think this is a great idea, clearly very well thought out. If anyone was thinking of making a dragon mod, here's a good template.

#3
Phemetoz

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i was JUST thinking something like this. mainly the new dragon animations and new shouts. Dragon fights tend to get boring after a while

#4
IxionInc

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This is a very well-thought concept. I hate the people who say "PLZ MAKE THE DRAGONS COMPLETELY RAPE ME", because that's stupid and lame, and dragons rape at lower levels anyways. But they don't need to completely suck at higher levels either.

The more kinds of dragons is the main thing that caught my attention. I'd love to see elemental dragons besides frost and fire (Hell, you don't even see a proper fire dragon). Or better yet, even more boss type monsters that aren't true dragons.

Wyverns:
Legendary dragon-kin noted for having a poisonous sting on their tail instead of breathing fire or ice, and lacking in front legs. They mainly attack from the air, doing swooping lunges from above with their tails or talons.
Higher-level wyverns could have poison breath (Similar to a steam centurion's blast), the ability to fire poison barbs, or even grab the player and take them into the sky. Wyvern poison should also be utterly debilitating, and should only go away if the player uses a special cure potion made for Wyvern venom.

Sea Serpents: Not much is known about these gargantuan snake-like beasts. Much has been disputed through pirates' tales and tavern shanties. One thing is certain; Whatever they are like, few have lived long enough to spread their tale.
They would basically be mainly underwater except for their head and tail, which remains stationary above the water shooting breath attacks at the player, or swinging at them should they come too close. If they player manages to land a melee blow on the serpent, it will submerge and swim farther out into the water, or it may just turn around and try to devour them whole. Since the player cannot draw weapons in the water, Sea Serpents are particularly deadly.

Drakes: Drakes, not necessarily dragons themselves, lack the ranged power and breath attacks that a regular dragon does. However, they make up for this by having excessive physical prowess. Making swipe attacks with deadly claws, having massive maws, and two extremely prehensile bladed tails makes them lethal at close-range. They can only fly for a very short while with their under-sized wings, so therefore cannot escape when being beaten.

As for elemental dragons, I feel that all the dragons look too much alike. So true elemental dragons should really reflect their element in a vibrant way.
Maybe similar to (And I know this is a very childish example) the way Wizard101 themes their monsters:
Posted Image

Ice dragons should generally be furry, cold, or likewise suited to their environment. Fire dragons should be warm, stony, and reptillian. Shock dragons should be serpentine, metallic, and possibly fish-like, with fins and such.

Also, another idea for making the dragons thematically different would be to look at the Dragon Gods from RIFT: Planes of Telara: http://telarapedia.c...iki/Blood_Storm

#5
Zinnorokkrah

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Thanks for the replies! I like the idea of a poisonous dragon- but the dragons of Skyrim already fit the wyvern template. Perhaps you could give a new dragon (swamp dragon perhaps?) poisonous breath along the lines of the Chaurus along with the regular shouts? I, however, don't like relegating the dragons of Skyrim to elemental niches. Perhaps we could have some dragons specialize in certain areas, like in the north there is a higher chance of meeting a dragon using 'Fo' but I don't like restricting dragons based on elements. In any case, I've come up with a chart for the new dragons, the edited dragons, and the respective shouts they're able to use. I'll post that, along with my concept for Bigger Battles & Populous Skyrim later. This will include a few new quests featuring the Imperial Army, the Stormcloaks, a few Guilds, and the Blades.

#6
Galacticat42

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Something similar to this is already in progress. My mod The Fallen Greybeards introduces dragon nest caves, dozens of new dragons types, more dragon attacks & animations, new quests, equipment, and more.

#7
Zinnorokkrah

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Cool- seen your work, it looks great. However I'm trying to go with something a little more 'Lore Based' and less 'This would be cool'. As such, I don't tend to like dragons that are purely mystical or are restricted based upon elements. I really like what Skyrim did for dragons, and I am finding that I want to stay as close to their lore as I can while adding elements that the player wants, so for now- I'm going to stick with this.

Alright, here's the first chart- Edited Dragons

Dragon

'Yol Toor Shul'- Fire-Breathing
'Fus Ro Dah'- Unrelenting Force [In the air]
'Raan Mir Tah'- Animal Allegiance [On the ground]

Frost Dragon

'Fo Krah Diin'- Ice-Breathing [In the air]
'Fus Ro Dah'- Unrelenting Force [In the air]
'Raan Mir Tah'- Animal Allegiance [On the ground]
'Wuld Nah Kest'- Whirlwind Sprint
'Iiz Slen Nus'- Ice Form [On the ground]

Blood Dragon
'Fo Krah Diin'- Ice-Breathing
'Yol Toor Shul'- Fire-Breathing
'Raan Mir Tah'- Animal Allegiance [On the ground]
'Wuld Nah Kest'- Whirlwind Sprint [On the ground]

Elder Dragon

'Fo Krah Diin'- Ice-Breathing
'Yol Toor Shul'- Fire-Breathing
'Fus Ro Dah'- Unrelenting Force [In the air]
'Raan Mir Tah'- Animal Allegiance [On the ground]
'Wuld Nah Kest'- Whirlwind Sprint [On the ground]
'Zun Haal Viik'- Disarm
'Lok Vah Koor'- Clear Skies [When attacked with 'Storm Call']

Ancient Dragon

'Fo Krah Diin'- Ice-Breathing
'Yol Toor Shul'- Fire-Breathing
'Fus Ro Dah'- Unrelenting Force [In the air]
'Zun Haal Viik'- Disarm
'Feim Zi Gron'- Become Ethereal [When health reaches %25]
'Strun Bah Qo'- Storm Call [In the air]
'Lok Vah Koor'- Clear Skies [When attacked with 'Storm Call']
'Tiid Klo Ul'- Slow Time [On the ground]

Paarthurnax

'Fo Krah Diin'- Ice-Breathing [In the air]
'Yol Toor Shul'- Fire-Breathing
'Fus Ro Dah'- Unrelenting Force [In the air]
'Wuld Nah Kest'- Whirlwind Sprint [On the ground]
'Zun Haal Viik'- Disarm
'Strun Bah Qo'- Storm Call [In the air]
'Lok Vah Koor'- Clear Skies [When attacked with 'Storm Call']
'Tiid Klo Ul'- Slow Time [On the ground]
'Iiz Slen Nus'- Ice Form [On the ground]

Alduin

'Fo Krah Diin'- Ice-Breathing
'Yol Toor Shul'- Fire-Breathing
'Fus Ro Dah'- Unrelenting Force [In the air]
'Wuld Nah Kest'- Whirlwind Sprint [On the ground]
'Zun Haal Viik'- Disarm
'Lok Vah Koor'- Clear Skies [When attacked with 'Storm Call']
'Tiid Klo Ul'- Slow Time
'Slen Tiid Vo'- Resurrect [Used to bring back dead dragons, could be scripted to summon draugr and reanimate corpses to fight for a certain period of time.] {When health reaches %50}
'Norok Staadnau Kruziik'- Meteor storm [Used at the beginning of the main quest on Helgen.] (Translation: Fiercest Unbound Ancient) {When health reaches %25}

What do you think?

Edited by Zinnorokkrah, 16 January 2012 - 05:36 PM.


#8
IxionInc

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Thanks for the replies! I like the idea of a poisonous dragon- but the dragons of Skyrim already fit the wyvern template. Perhaps you could give a new dragon (swamp dragon perhaps?) poisonous breath along the lines of the Chaurus along with the regular shouts? I, however, don't like relegating the dragons of Skyrim to elemental niches. Perhaps we could have some dragons specialize in certain areas, like in the north there is a higher chance of meeting a dragon using 'Fo' but I don't like restricting dragons based on elements. In any case, I've come up with a chart for the new dragons, the edited dragons, and the respective shouts they're able to use. I'll post that, along with my concept for Bigger Battles & Populous Skyrim later. This will include a few new quests featuring the Imperial Army, the Stormcloaks, a few Guilds, and the Blades.

I don't see the Dragons in Skyrim swooping down and grabbing people or doing melee attacks from the air all to often.

Basically, the Wyvern idea was to make-up for the lost flying bits of the regular dragons. However, due to it and the Drake not being true dragons, I don't think they should have access to the Shouts.
I don't care too much to have the Vanilla dragons amped up so much that they can attack you every which-freaking-way.

So Wyverns are to fill the aerial attack niche, what with the swoop-grabbing and the sky-stinging, and Drakes are to fill the ground assault niche. The regular dragons were kinda to be a balance of the two.

I had hoped to do the elemental dragon thing, at least for the named boss dragons, but make it far more subtle than having just a giant reptile made out of rock and magma. But alas, seeing as that doesn't tickle your pickle, you could always go the Dragonology/Dragon Hunters route, and simply make different subspecies of dragons, instead of a blatant elemental incarnate.

Edited by IxionInc, 15 December 2011 - 04:03 AM.


#9
Galacticat42

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Cool- seen your work, it looks great. However I'm trying to go with something a little more 'Lore Based' and less 'This would be cool'. As such, I don't tend to like dragons that are purely mystical or are restricted based upon elements. I really like what Skyrim did for dragons, and I am finding that I want to stay as close to their lore as I can while adding elements that the player wants, so for now- I'm going to stick with this.


Naturally, but for example a Stone Dragon would simply be a dragon with more shouts that affect the ground and an Aerial Dragon would shout for tornadoes, etc. All the dragons would have the basic shouts, but they also have their own specialization whereas the vanilla dragons simply get older, the unique dragons will be more specialized the older they are. Fire Dragons can shout to an inferno, Blood Dragons may as well get actual blood shouts...

@IxionInc
Sorry to burst your bubble, but my mod is going to let dragons pick up and drop people that aren't facing them - even the player. This is in addition to the extra dragon attacks on ground and the shouts from above.

#10
IxionInc

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@IxionInc
Sorry to burst your bubble, but my mod is going to let dragons pick up and drop people that aren't facing them - even the player. This is in addition to the extra dragon attacks on ground and the shouts from above.



Okay? It's not like it's a completely bad thing if it's JUST dragons. However, I'm saying that if you're going to have more than just dragons, then don't make the dragons all-powerful. Making every dragon have every single attack is bloody overwhelming unless you're going for a "hardcore" type of gig which, like I said, I; as in me and myself, don't particularly care for. I think that, if I were to make a mod expanding upon the dragons and dragon battles, or, y'know, share SUGGESTIONS on such a mod, I'd spread the abilities out a bit. I can't really speak for other folks.

But as you say, quite excessively might I add, it's your mod you're making. Do whatever you like. If it's not up to my liking, then that's cool.

Edited by IxionInc, 15 December 2011 - 05:54 AM.





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