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In response to post #24750659. #24751234, #24751479, #24751989, #24752184, #24752194, #24752214, #24752369, #24752499, #24752619, #24752624, #24752694, #24752819, #24752834, #24752854, #24752944, #24753079, #24753134, #24753249, #24755354, #24755649, #24755674, #24755734, #24755859 are all replies on the same post. @njits: "A) Modders have every right to ask for compensation for their work as any other artist does." You're making a blanket statement that is just untrue. Modders as a whole DON'T have every right to compensation. Yes, other artists in different fields have such rights under the law. But modders generally don't. So your blanket statement is either ignorant or just disingenuous. I don't know whether you truly understand where rights come from. Just because you think you've done work doesn't mean you suddenly accrue the rights to ask for compensation for it.

In response to post #24750659. #24751234, #24751479, #24751989, #24752184, #24752194, #24752214, #24752369, #24752499, #24752619, #24752624, #24752694, #24752819, #24752834, #24752854, #24752944, #24753079, #24753134, #24753249 are all replies on the same post. Quote @njits: "People have the RIGHT to ask for compensation for their work." Not when it comes to modding. Not by a long shot. Are you forgetting that it was only up until a few days ago that people DIDN'T have any rights to make money off of Skyrim mods? As was the case with The Sims, if people didn't get express legal permission to sell derivative works (which is what mods are commonly thought to be) for money, the developers / publishers of the game can shut them down. Just so we're clear: Modders have NO legal right to monetary compensation for mods unless expressly given permission by the original devs. So, getting compensated for work (to use your phrasing) is very much the exception rather than the norm in the modding world. You might be tempted to say that my point above is moot, since Bethesda did give modders permission to sell their mods, therefore Skyrim modders did have rights. But you'd be wrong, at least on one count... because Beth and Valve did not sort out legal grey areas that would've proven to be stumbling blocks to this, like for example if a paid mod required assets from another mod for promised features (see Chesko's fishing mod). Because such a situation has - to my knowledge - never been contested in a court of law, I don't think anyone can say for certain whether the first mod author really does have full legal rights to any compensation at all. And the fact is that a whole bunch of Skyrim mods absolutely require other mods in order to function properly, so if anyone wants to loudly proclaim that mod authors definitely have rights to compensation, this is a hurdle they have to cross first.

Seriously. Why are you guys acting like mods have never been sold before? Mrs. PacMan was a mod for PacMan . Team Fortress was a mod. Counter Strike was a mod. DoTA was a mod. DayZ was a mod. Day of Defeat was a mod. There has never been a moral decision by modders of "I'm going to do all this painstaking work for free because I love the community." They'd never had the choice to be paid before due to legal reasons. The moment they were given a choice, the community turned their backs on the modders and acted like a bunch of entitled children. You all literally threw a tantrum and took away the modders right to choose whether or not they wanted to be paid for their work...And if they wanted to be paid for their work, that doesn't make them a sellout. Plenty of people get jobs doing what they love to do. Just because they want to be paid to do it doesn't mean they're any less passionate about their craft. Artists can get commissioned to draw fanart and nobody cries foul. Coverbands get paid to play and nobody cries foul. Fanfiction wrtiers can sell license derivatives of others work and nobody cries foul. YouTubers make thousands of dollars off of video footage of them either reviewing someone elses mod, playing someone elses mod, or playing a game and nobody cries foul. But modders get the option to ask people to pay them for their work and everybody acts like they just kicked your cat. Who are you referring to when you said "you guys"? Sorry, I think you must have me mixed up with the people who fundamentally oppose paid mods. I suggest you read what I wrote again, and try to see that I only talked about the endorsement system.

In response to post #24748294. #24748909, #24748959, #24749014, #24749054, #24749074, #24749089, #24749114, #24749169, #24749269, #24749289, #24749409, #24749439, #24749529, #24749564, #24749574, #24749674, #24749709, #24749814, #24749884, #24749889, #24749954, #24750114 are all replies on the same post. The thing is - mod makers (typically) make mods because 1) they themselves love the game, and 2) they love the idea of sharing cool stuff they make for the game with other people. I say this as an ex-modder myself (for other games, not Skyrim). The sites I uploaded my mods to didn't have an endorse / thanks button at all - and guess what? I never got bothered thinking about whether people were thankful for my mods. At all. Seriously. If you're a modder who DOES MODDING BECAUSE YOU LOVE THE GAME, just carry on. Who cares about a number that says how many people endorse or thank you for your mod? It's just that - a stupid number. Please don't get upset because of this number or the lack of it; there are waaaaay more worthwhile things in life that you could get upset over.

In response to post #24748294. #24748909, #24748959, #24749014, #24749054, #24749074, #24749089, #24749114, #24749169, #24749269, #24749289, #24749409, #24749439, #24749529, #24749564, #24749574, #24749674, #24749709, #24749814, #24749884 are all replies on the same post. @bangunagung: Thanks for your reply. So would I be right to say that you think the endorse button is basically a "thanks" button? If so, I would generally agree with you on this. Which brings me to my next question... Do mod makers make mods because they want to be thanked?

In response to post #24748294. #24748909, #24748959, #24749014, #24749054, #24749074, #24749089, #24749114, #24749169, #24749269, #24749289, #24749409, #24749439, #24749529 are all replies on the same post. Why is an endorsement important? I'm not trolling - I really want to know. I only just bought Skyrim Legendary Edition last year, and only got into trying mods this year. Therefore I'm very new to the culture here at the Nexus. Other mod sites don't even have an endorsement button; they may have a 10 point rating system or something. Is such a system better or worse than Nexus' endorsement system?

1. This shows, above all else, that customers (or people in general, really) value good communication. I really think that if Valve / Bethesda had announced the idea way, waaaay beforehand, and perhaps also allowed collaborating modders a platform to discuss their own projects instead of keeping them silenced under an NDA, people's reactions would've been much different. 2. I hope people aren't under the illusion that paid mods as a concept is dead and buried. I'm putting money on Valve trying it again in the future (I mean with IP that isn't their own but just sold through Steam)... Although it most definitely isn't gonna be tried with Skyrim anymore... And hopefully they'll put more thought going into it next time. The idea is out there now, and we can be sure some wise guy somewhere thinks he can solve any problems that has surfaced this time. We ought to brace ourselves for that future. 3. I couldn't help but think Bethesda's own blog sounded sheepish when they talked about the 25% split going to modders. Personally I have no doubt that Bethesda do love making their games and seeing how a community can spring up around their labor of love, but frankly taking such a big cut of any mod purchases just came off as greedy and opportunistic. 50% would've been much appropriate to me. 4. The worst offender (imho) was still Valve though. For a substantial cut of the revenue they couldn't even give their partnered modders proper legal advice? (See Chesko's fishing mod.) Seriously guys? Could you stop doing things so half-assed for once? 5. For the modders: I feel it's worth thinking about whether you could've made some better choices. I totally get that this was an exciting, perhaps once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. And I have absolutely no problem that you gave it a shot: I said elsewhere that people must remember that you were given a chance to turn something you loved doing into an income-earning opportunity. Such a thing is rare in the real world. But maybe some of you could've tried it with entirely new mods, instead of established mods that others might have even donated to you for previously. (And on a more sanguine level, maybe you could've considered working under a different pseudonymn, as I suspect some of the first paid modders on the Workshop might've done?) 6. I hope the rift that has come up between modders and mod-downloaders can heal in time. After having seen some of the more ridiculous stuff that has been written though, I think some wounds will always remain. If you're just a mod user instead of creator and you've poured any amount of hatred on any modder for even considering getting compensated for their time and effort, you should be ashamed.