nognow
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Posts posted by nognow
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Ohh wow thanks!!! I've been looking for this for ever! If I understand correctly, FO4 only reads the two remaining planes and automatically calculates the third one; a normal texture file can have an image of me in the blue channel for all that matters right lol?. While NV isn't able to calculate the missing plane on it's own, and requires all three planes/all three channels. Did I get it right?Fallout 4 uses a 2 channel tangent space normal map for better performance while storing additional information in the red and green channel akin to BPR information. If you simply invert the blue channel you get a standard tangent space map.
I havenât worked a lot with them other than converting them for use in Gamebryo. I think the Unreal engine uses them aswell.
You can read more about normal maps here https://www.artstation.com/typhen/blog/GZdL/this-is-normal-3-types-of-normal-maps
I don't remember seeing them in UE4 but it's been a while since I've worked with it.
And nothing about bathesdas system is in any way PBR. I went on a super long tirade on discord literally yesterday about how nonsensical and convoluted it is. I've worked with PBR systems before and it's night and day. I'm convinced that FO4 and SSE crank the glossiness of everything to 11 to mask just how shitty the lighting and reflections look. When I first tried importing FO4 maps into NV and noticed that everything is very shinny, I assumed that it's an incompatibility/ improper conversion/etc. But then I tried them in FO4 and realized that they are indeed obscenely glossy.
Although, I could've sworn that I've seen some of those green normals used in NV somewhere. Some modded weapons I think
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That's the green channel; I'm referring to the blue channel (image appears red/green in an RGB setting because the blue channel is missing/empty)
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I've noticed that some normals have a flipped Z/blue channel ("green-looking" normals)
Except for other Bethesda games, I haven't seen them used anywhere. What's the difference and when, if ever, should they be used?
Thanks!
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I've been trying to generate object LOD, but some of Much Needed LOD's meshes are too complex for xLODgen. Much Needed LOD is supposedly optimized for generation, has anyone encountered this issue?
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Do object bounds even matter?
I've noticed that the same meshes in different mods (Like Millenia's individual releases vs the same weapons in WotNM) often have different object bounds in GECK.
Also, since many weapon mods add silencers, extended mags/barrels, etc., the mesh parameters are bound to change.
And when importing the nifs into Blender, the Convex Poly (same thing?) generally clips as well. -
Sure. Just use specular map as an alpha channel on normal maps.
Apart from not being real PBR, I know next to nothing about FO4 texture system, you'll probably find tutorials on Yt about how to adapt them for FNV.
If I have to use PBR textures in FO3-FNV, I usually:
- take the AO and overlay it on the Albedo.
- use the Opacity to make the diffuse Alpha.
- use the Specular or the Roughness or a combination of both for the Normal Alpha.
- use the Emissive for the Glow Mask.
- use the Height for Parallax.
- use the Specular or the Roughness or a combination of both for EnvCube Mask.
Not every Textures are used every time. Filters and adjustments are often done in Photoshop - Gimp - Paint.net to make it work in the old rendering engine.
I noticed that most FO4 and even some NV normals have a flipped blue channel.
From what I know, the blue channel isn't used by either game.
What gives?
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Bullet holes use parallax maps.
is there a point to use them for anything else?
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I had already known that since the slot is called "height/Parallax" in nifskope.It's named parallax in NV. I thought I answered those questions already.
That wasn't my question. I asked why am I not seeing any effects and why is it never used. I haven't seen a single mesh of any kind that uses it.
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does anyone know if height maps are used in FNV?
I never used them, especially for glow textures, I'm not sure what the point would be
Unrelated to glow maps.
Just didn't want to start a new topic for a very similar question.
There's a dedicated texture slot for them but I haven't seen them used
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does anyone know if height maps are used in FNV?
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update 1: setting emissive mult to values under 1.0 DOES work and seems to work inversely (reduces glow maps' colors strength)
similar question: do height maps do anything? there's a slot for them, but I can't see any changes in-game.
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I did search on google. I can't believe I missed it.
But it's missing my main question about TYPES of glow maps. NV's included weapon glow maps are black and white, but I've seen various other permutations.
You can make the part you want to glow any color you want
Glow Map Tutorial for Skyrim
https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/63066
When I was doing it, I would make the part I didn't want to glow, Black, and then I'd use whichever other colors for the parts I wanted to glow.
Red, Blue, Green, Yellow etc.
I figured that part out by Experimenting to see if using different colors would work.
Don't forget to name your glow map properly, with a 'g' at the end of it.
IIRC it's like goggles_g.dds
Then you edit the path in the nif to reference the goggles_g.dds
Thanks!
I fckd around with adding full glow maps (as part of a specular workflow with diffuse/normal/glow) to the entire weapon, actually quite interesting results! setting the multiplier to something low like 1.1.
I can't tell if setting values below 1.0 does anything
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Look for NiMaterialProperty (it's inside of NiTriShape or NiTriStrip) and inside there's Emit Mult as well as color of emission you can change (by default it's black), just below Specular color (you can't change specular color btw).
Actually, spec color can be changed.
Do you mean that the value doesn't do anything?
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I did search on google. I can't believe I missed it.
But it's missing my main question about TYPES of glow maps. NV's included weapon glow maps are black and white, but I've seen various other permutations.
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Apart from not being real PBR, I know next to nothing about FO4 texture system, you'll probably find tutorials on Yt about how to adapt them for FNV.
If I have to use PBR textures in FO3-FNV, I usually:
- take the AO and overlay it on the Albedo.
- use the Opacity to make the diffuse Alpha.
- use the Specular or the Roughness or a combination of both for the Normal Alpha.
- use the Emissive for the Glow Mask.
- use the Height for Parallax.
- use the Specular or the Roughness or a combination of both for EnvCube Mask.
Not every Textures are used every time. Filters and adjustments are often done in Photoshop - Gimp - Paint.net to make it work in the old rendering engine.
From my research:
Albedo or (Albedo x AO) x Metal = diffuse
Albedo or (Albedo x AO) x Inv. Metal = spec
or via this method(slightly different results): https://marmoset.co/posts/pbr-texture-conversion/#metaltospec
Inv. Roughness = Glow
So that's obviously very straight forward and simple. But in practice, it doesn't look good in-game. Metals are too dark because the original meshes lean heavily on shaders.
Here's a comparison of a rendered model, and an in-game demo of this https://gamebanana.com/models/3666.
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I gave that as an example.Sure. Just use specular map as an alpha channel on normal maps.ÃÂ
I meant to ask is there a way to combine those textures with existing ones or something.
I know how to convert metallic workflow to specular workflow, but there's still something missing; the diffuse always looks too dark and lacking detail. Like it's missing a layer of something
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no, how is it done?Did you edit the NIF mesh in order to make it illuminate?
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You need to use nifskope to edit the mesh file, by adding luminance to it.
There are plenty of tutorials on how to make glow maps, I used to make them for Fallout 3, ad "maybe" New Vegas (I don't remember)
Could you please give a bit more details about the nifskope part? How do I add luminescence to a mesh?
There are plenty of tutorials but I couldn't find anything specific to FNV/FO3. Since everything about this engine is so unusual, I figured it can't be as simple as a run of the mill glow map; there must be some quirk.
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thanks!
What about metalness, roughness, ao?
There's no such thing in NV, unfortunately.
Thanks!
Is there a way to convert/optimize those incompatible textures to work with NV?
Kinda like combining the spec map with the alpha channel of the normals etc.
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T
Does it matter though?
I noticed that file sizes decrease by less than 0.1 kbs at most.
And modders seem to use both interchangeably.
Short answer: yes.
Optimization is less about the weight of the nif than the way it is proceeded trough a 2006 game engine (Oblivion) patched for FO3 and later once again for FNV.
A poorly made nif will not make a big difference if only added to the Vanilla mistakes already existing. But the accumulation of bad material will only lead to poor performance and/or issues difficult to troubleshoot.
And yes, many modders don't have the knowledge or the will to learn and bring clean mods but that doesn't mean they have to be imitated.Thanks!
Sorry for late the late "thank you"; I took a few days to test this stuff in-game.
Is there a loss of quality when stripifying meshes? why aren't all meshes FNV tristips (in fact, most are trishapes I think)?
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Did you edit the NIF mesh in order to make it illuminate?
no, how is it done?
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I tried adding glow maps to weapons I'm working on, but nothing seems to change.
How do they work? which of the following examples is in the appropriate form for fake LEDs on a weapon (two-tone black and white, greyscale, regular RGB, Transparent background RGB)?
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of course I notice
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Yes, that's how you proceed with the pseudo-pbr of FO4. You take a separate spec map and you integrate it in the Alpha of the Normal map. But linking a spec map only in a slot of the texture Shader in a FO3-FNV nif won't do anything.
There is 6 slots available, There's a naming convention.
Diffuse/Alpha Texture/Transparency Name.dds
Normal/Alpha Relief/Specularity Name_n.dds
Glow Mask Mask for Emissive Color Name_g.dds
Parallax Depth effect Name_p.dds
EnvCube Reflection on the object Name_e.dds
EnvCube Mask Mask for reflection Name_m or Name_em.dds
Diffuse & Normal can be in DXT1 or DXT5 depending the need.
EnvCube has its own setting, the other are in DXT1.
Glow Mask & EnvCube mask are telling which part to reveal of a setting that applies on the whole NiTriStrips/Shapes.
If you set an Environment Cube flag in your nif but don't assign an EnvCube map, the game will assign (an ugly) one by default.
If you don't assign a Envcube mask while having flag and EnvCube map set, the game will use the Specular (Alpha) of the normal. These two situations might lead to an increased Draw Calls and GPU strain.
You can use the Specular map to generate a *_m.dds or draw one in graphic app. The dark part will mask the EnvCube map reflection, White part will fully reveal and nuance of grey to attenuate.
thanks!
What about metalness, roughness, ao?
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Triangulating converts strips to shapes
Correct, my mistake. You should Stripify your nif.
Triangulating converts strips to shapesCorrect, my mistake. You should Stripify your nif.
Does it matter though?
I noticed that file sizes decrease by less than 0.1 kbs at most.
And modders seem to use both interchangeably.
Mesh lighting lines
in Discussion
Posted
I've been trying to import Heffy's AK/AR15 set for FO4 into FNV, and for some reason I get these lighting lines that I've never experienced before. Lighting looks like sheets of paper being scrolled through. Updating tangent spaces and removing unused vertices didn't help. any idea how to fix it?
Thanks!