Persistent CTD at the exact same spot

[ripple]

No you should do your cleaning after you have reinstalled everything. Cleaning should go somewhere between 'after installing everything' and 'testing the tutorial dungeon sequence.'

 

SkyUI is a mod so you would install it using a mod manager, not manually like a utility.

 

You can post the mods you want to re-install here and poll other users for their opinions. I won't recognize all the mods. Generally though, you should install texture replacers and body replacers first (if you are using any), then installed 'gameplay' mods.

Edited June 24, 2013 by ripple

[CaptainPatch]

Okidokey. Flushed pretty much everything Skyrim, rooted out all those secondary and tertiary locations, leaving only NMM and BOSS. Then I Steam downloaded the game and DLCs again. Now I'll reinstall TES5Edit and Wrye Bash. I'll edit a spoiler of my mod wish list in a couple hours (at a guess; I'll be taking a break for "Falling Skies" in about .... 35 minutes. _Possibly_ "Copper" after that.).

 

Okay, got those installed, along with the BOSS UserList Manager.

 

QUESTION: Several mods are described by BOSS as needing a compatibility patch, which can be found at http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/26230/?tab=2&navtag=%2Fajax%2Fmodfiles%2F%3Fid%3D26230&pUp=1. HOWEVER, before, whenever I tried installing a second patch for a different mod, I was given an either/or choice; only ONE compatibility patch allowed. How can a user get more than one compatibility patch operational at the same time? I'll be needing patches for Better Sorting, Complete Crafting Overhaul, Hideout_Hearthfires, Lost Art of the Blacksmith, Smithing Perks Overhaul, and Weapons & Armor fixes. It will be a bummer if I can only have ONE of those mods because of this limitation.

 

MOD WISH LIST

As promised, this is my mod wishlist, ordered by just how much I want any given mod on the list. Sadly, there's probably far too many in the "REALLY WANT MOD" section. What I'm looking for in turn from anyone willing to give advice is what order I should install these, and at what point I should _stop_ adding mods and start stress testing the mix. And please, please, _please_, if you recognize any mod as being of the "THat mod spawns CTDs like crazy!" category, let me know. Please! Any addition suggestions are also welcome.

 

[Note: All of these were in my last mod mix and had been successfully Cleaned enough so that BOSS had negligible complaints about any of them. Nonetheless, the mix was generating a persistent CTD, making the game unplayable.]

 

 

 

MUST HAVE MODS -- Level 1 Priority

Mod Name Mod Type

SkyUI User interfaces

Unofficial Dawnguard Patch Patches

Unofficial Dragonborn Patch Patches

Unofficial Hearthfire Patch Patches

Unofficial Skyrim Patch Patches

REALLY WANT MODS -- Level 2 Priority

Mod Name Mod Type

Alternate Start - Live Another Life Gameplay effects and changes

Bandolier - Bags and Pouches Clothing

Better Sorting Unassigned

Better Sorting Miscellaneous

Dovahkiin Hideout Abodes - Player homes

Dovahkiin Perks Skills and leveling

Dovahkiin Retreat Abodes - Player homes

Dovahkiins Warehouse and Bedroom--Castles, palaces, mansions and estates

Dovahkriid Grenzganger - Quest and Companions -- Quests and adventures

Dragon Falls Manor Abodes - Player homes

Elysium Estate Abodes - Player homes

Essential Followers Companions - Other

Explorer Dungeon Pack Dungeons - New

Glowing Ore Veins 300 Visuals and graphics

Halls of Dovahndor Abodes - Player homes

Helgen Reborn Quests and adventures

Improved Blacksmithing Skills and leveling

Into the Depths Quests and adventures

Milans Dungeon Pack 1 Dungeons - New

Moonpath to Elsweyr Quests and adventures

Much Ado about Snow Elves - A Tragedy - Act I-- Quests and adventures

Perks Unbound - With DLC Support Skills and leveling

Prisoner Of The Horned Helm - a Death Dealer story -- Quests and adventures

Quest of Seven Keys Quests and adventures

Quest- The Fifth Gate Quests and adventures

Riverside Lodge with Sauna Abodes - Player homes

Robbers Roost Ruins, forts and abandoned structures

RQ - Tanning and Smelting Experience Skills and leveling

Saviors Lodge - Player Home Quests and adventures

Sharlikrans Compatibility Patches Patches **Need several. See post higher up thread.

Smithing Extended - Skills and leveling

Smithing Perks Overhaul Bug fixes

Smithing Tomes Immersion

Specialized Followers Companions - Other

Sword of Sigdan Quests and adventures

Syynxs Perky - The Major Perk Overhaul-- Skills and leveling

The Cyrodiil Frontier - Fight Against the Thalmor II-- Quests and adventures

The Dead Bee Scrolls Quests and adventures

The Grytewake Legend - Quest and moveable ship-- Quests and adventures

The Hanging Gardens - a Quest Quests and adventures

The Lost Legend of Captain Sharphook Quests and adventures

The McMiller Chronicles Quests and adventures

The Shroud of Jotunheim Quests and adventures

WARZONES - Civil Unrest Combat

Wheezes Dungeon Pack 1 Dungeons - New

Wyrmstooth Quests and adventures

WOULD LIKE TO HAVE MODS -- Level 3 Priority

Mod Name Mod Type

A Quality World Map - With Roads User interfaces

A Quality World Map Installer-4929 (2) (2) Unassigned

Achieve That! Gameplay effects and changes

Adal Matar the Lost Stronghold - Fight Against the Thalmor I-- Quests and adventures

Crafting Complete Overhauls

Extensible Follower Framework Companions - Other

Guard Dialogue Overhaul Immersion

Guardian Stones Expanded Skills and leveling

Inconsequential NPCs NPC

Lylvieve Sisters - Romance and Followers Quests and adventures

Paarthurnax Choices plus3 Quests and adventures

Trade and Barter Gameplay effects and changes

Training costs Skills and leveling

Tytanis - Farming - Mounts - Crafts - Spells - Items - MORE-- Overhauls

 

OPTIONAL MODS -- Level 4 Priority

Mod Name Mod Type

Animated Prostitution - Skyrim Animation

ApachiiSkyHair Hair and face models

Armor Perk Helmet Remover Skills and leveling

Better Nordic Ruins Ruins, forts and abandoned structures

Bounty Gold Gameplay effects and changes

Build Your Own Home Abodes - Player homes

Convenient Horses Animals, creatures, mounts & horses

Deadly Spell Impacts Magic - Spells and enchantments

Enhanced Distant Terrain Environmental

Enhanced Lights and FX Immersion

Exciting Skill Ranks Skills and leveling

Fantasy Music Overhaul Audio, sounds and music

Footprints Visuals and graphics

Immersive Armors Armour

Immersive Weapons Weapons

Improved NPC Clothing Clothing

Ishs Souls to Perks Skills and leveling

Lockpicking interface retex - without wings around keyhole-- Models and textures

Lush Trees and Grass Environmental

Mining More AND Faster Gameplay effects and changes

More Firewood per Chop Gameplay effects and changes

No More Blocky Faces Models and textures

Run For Your Lives Gameplay effects and changes

True Medieval Tavern Music Audio, sounds and music

Vilja in Skyrim Companions - Other

Wearable Lanterns Items and Objects - Player

 

 

 

Monday -- Added SKSE to Skyrim and set up skse_loader.exe. So far so good.

Edited June 24, 2013 by CaptainPatch

[ripple]

Alright, so here is my personal opinion on some of those mods.

 

- Animation Prostitution: not sure you should install this. I've never used the mod, but based on everything I've read, it's somewhat buggy, and prone to conflict with other script mods (at least, other modders have complained about its scripts messing up their mods. I never bothered to look into this so no idea why). Does AP come with a 'safe uninstall' procedure to halt the running scripts using MCM or console commands? If not, skip.

 

- Alternate Start: perhaps a good immersion mod, but is it really essential? How useful is it after you've progressed beyond the initial part of the game? I've read some users experienced issues with it. No idea why since I don't use it.

 

- Warzones: will degrade worldspace stability and stress engine limitations. There are (technical) reason why the Skyrim worldspace is so depopulated, and it's not because Bethesda was lazy. Maybe your rig can handle it, maybe it can't. Just so you are properly warned.

 

- Better Sorting: sorting mods will conflict with any mods you have which edit the same items that have been renamed by the sorting mods. I made my own personal sorting mod for this reason, because then I can merge conflicting changes. It's not a big deal, but it will create some 'anomalies.' You should also make sure the sorting mod you are using contain no error records (usually because they are old and made with a pre-CK tool), because I've seen too many of them that do.

 

- Footprints: continually updating script. Need to follow uninstallation instruction carefully when uninstalling.

 

- Moonpath to Elsweyr: install only when you want to play the quest, uninstall after you finish it.

 

- Essential Followers: you are better off installing a follower overhaul mod. I currently use 'Amazing Follower Tweaks.'

 

 

The mods in your list that I use:

 

Unofficial Patches are a must.

 

Guard Dialogue Overhaul: 'lightweight' mod, but very cool and makes so much difference for immersion enthusiasts like myself. No scripts.

 

Convenient Horses: script heavy, but comes with MCM and console commands to halt running script for uninstallation.

 

Enhanced Lights and FX: I only use the base module, not the optional additional module that make cell edits. No scripts.

 

SkyUI - just updated to 4.1, and require the latest version of SKSE.

 

ApachiiSkyHair - nice, but 2K hair textures will stress your rig. In my case, I compressed them to 1K. I think the author has a 'lite texture' version now.

 

Run For Your Lives: Arthmoor also has 'When Vampire Attacks' if you have the Dawnguard DLC.

 

Glowing Ore Veins 300: texture replacer, lightweight and harmless.

 

Wearable Lanterns

 

Immersive Armors: this and the following 2 mods have conflicting leveled lists edits, but that's what Wrye Bash is for.

 

Immersive Weapons

 

Bandoliers

 

I also use 'Winter is Coming' and 'Cloaks of Skyrim' (and a ton of add more weapons mods). Conflicting edits to leveled lists can be handled through Wrye Bash, but the conflicting outfit records (between the bandolier, armour, and cloak mods) will require manually made patches, which I believe the cloaks mods provide.

 

Inconsequential NPCs - best Skryim mod ever! The author is also exceedingly good looking and humble.

 

 

Final notes:

 

- you have a ton of player home mods, and you list them as pretty 'high priority'....do you really need that many houses? I am sure they are great mods, but...maybe just pick one or two? The default game and the Hearthfire DLC already comes with a lot of player homes. I guess I am just not a 'decorating' type person. And if you actually manged to decorate all those homes, your savegame would be pretty bloated.

 

- the compatibility patches from Sharlikran's page: select no to replace/update if they are different compatibility patches. NMM thinks they are the same mod because they are all downloaded from the same mod page.

Edited June 25, 2013 by ripple

[CaptainPatch]

- you have a ton of player home mods, and you list them as pretty 'high priority'....do you really need that many houses? I am sure they are great mods, but...maybe just pick one or two? The default game and the Hearthfire DLC already comes with a lot of player homes. I guess I am just not a 'decorating' type person. And if you actually manged to decorate all those homes, your savegame would be pretty bloated.

:ohdear: It pretty much has to do with the fact that when all is said and done, I'm a greedy SOB. My most common character name combines Dyson, Hoover, and/or Bissell because they suck up EVERYTHING with even a 1 monetary unit value. [The landscape is _clean_ after I've passed through!] All those abodes generally have a ton of valuable stuff, just waiting to be snarfed up, free of charge. As an added bonus, about half of those on the list come with a quest or adventure attached, which adds a worthwhile amount of gameplay. So, it isn't that I _need_ the extra abodes; it's that I want the stuff they contain.

 

As for the Alternate Start, I've already played through the vanilla game start a dozen times; it's gotten to be kind of tedious and UNfun.

 

Warzones I added because for a "civil war" in progress, the fighting seems tiny, infrequent, and generally inconsequential. That's one thing that TES V has in common with FNV: _tiny_ combats involving half-squads vs half-squads, and those incredibly infrequent. Heck, cops versus robbers or gangbangers involves more combat than these "wars" that Bethesda gives us.

 

****************

So, I'm going to add the SKSE CIR changes (kind forgot about those) and then I'll install

MCM (new to list)

SkyUI,

all of the Unoffical patches,

Alternate Start

Amazing Follwer Tweaks (new to the list)

Guard Dialogue Overhaul

ApachiiSkyHair (Lite)

Convenient Horses

Enhanced Lights and FX (Lite)

Run For Your Lives (because it makes NPCbehavior more sensible)

When Vampires Attack (new to list)

Glowing Ore Veins 300

Wearable Lanterns

Bandoliers (see: greedy SOB above; they double the character's carry weight)

Riverside Lodge (as an early base of operations)

and Helgen Reborn (because its start point pretty much coincides with game start)

 

I'd really like to add the Perks overhauls and the Smithing and Alchemy expansions fairly soon, because along with Archery/Marksmenship, those are my early character development areas.

 

I take it that once I've got all these installed, it would be the time to do the first thorough Cleaning? Then if there aren't any CTDs or freezes, I'll start to gradually start to add the higher priority mods. (Which includes Inconsequential NPCs, despite the fact it requires extra effort to install.)

Edited June 25, 2013 by CaptainPatch

[ripple]

The reason Skyrim and all previous Bethesda gamebryo based engine games are so 'lifeless' is because it has issues managing more than a handful of AI's. The worldspace is particularly prone to instability caused by this problem (there is also a game setting cap on the maximum of AI's that can be rendered on screen). The 'de-population problem' wasn't so pronounced in Fallout 3 and NV because those games took place in post-apocalyptic settings, but is very much noticeable in Skyrim and Oblivion. In general, the more spawns that are added to the worldspace, the more unstable it becomes. So Warzones, ASIS (with increased spawn enabled), and so on. It's also why mods like 'Immersive Patrols' come in a modular format, so the user and pick and choose as many or as few plugins as their systems can withstand (but at some point, a combination of these mods will push the game engine beyond its limitations, no matter how powerful the user's rig is).

 

I also forgot to mention, you need to check and make sure all of the 'smithing' mods you are using a compatible with each other. I don't use any of them, so I don't know (I only use 'Ars Metallica' for smelting).

Edited June 25, 2013 by ripple

[CaptainPatch]

It sure is nice being on forum at the same time! It makes _my_ life soooo much easier! (Heh, heh, heh)

 

So, where is the MCM mod itself? All my Searches keeps turning up mods that utilize MCM, but not the MCM mod itself.

 

And you convinced me; I'll leave Warzones out, even though, comparatively speaking, my rig IS fairly powerful. [intel Core 2 Quad CPU Q8200 @2.33 GHz x 4, 8 Gb RAM, GeForce GTX 460 w/4 Gb video RAM, 1 Tb HDD]

[ripple]

SkyUI already integrates MCM, so you don't need to download anything else for it.

 

You can try and keep Warzones, since I don't see any other mods in your list that I recognize as adding more spawns to the worldspace. But if you start crashing outdoors, you should probably remove it and force a worldspace cell refresh.

 

Personally, though, I like to avoid removing mods as much as possible.

Edited June 25, 2013 by ripple

[CaptainPatch]

Decided against Warzones for the concerns you mentioned. Why add to what WILL be a heavy strain caused by my heavy mod mix?

 

Got most of the initial list activated on NMM. Next comes the Cleaning.

 

**************

Cleaned. Now to see how far I can get a new start going before a CTD....

 

... Which isn't all that far at all. Click the SKSE loader, game starts with the splash screen appearing, soundtrack starts with "Boom, boom-boom" and then an immediate CTD.

 

The Papyrus logs only show ONE line, which is to say that the Papyrus log opened.

 

Okay, so what did I miss?

Edited June 25, 2013 by CaptainPatch

[ripple]

You've installed a mod that's missing master. Load all plugins in TES5Edit and see which one it is. The plugin that causes TES5Edit to stop loading and bounces an error is the one that is the culprit.

[CaptainPatch]

Bullseye. When I installed Enhanced Lighting & FX, I jumped the gun and added ELFX for Moonpath to Elswyr -- _before_ I was ready to install Moonpath to Elsweyr itself.

 

Going to try this again now.

 

LATER. So far, so good. Rock solid. Not even the occasional video "stutter". About to level up, gain a Follower, and get some Archery training, so I'm going to add

 

Essential Followers

Exciting Skill Ranks

Extensible Follower Framework

Improved Blacksmithing

Mining More AND Faster

More Firewood per Chop

Perks Unbound

Smithing Extended

Smithing Perks Overhaul

Specialized Followers

Training costs

 

Installed and what Cleaning was needed was done.

 

Oddity: Exciting Skill Ranks showed as being successfully downloaded, buttttt it didn't appear in either the Mods section or the Plugins section. So, where did it go? If I try to download again, I'm informed that it already exists. So, _where_ does it exist? Couldn't find it with BOSS or TES5Edit either.

 

3 a.m. here. I'll start testing the stability of this expanded mix in the morning.

Edited June 25, 2013 by CaptainPatch