Bush gets a second term...

[surian]

I think Kerry has a chance still. But as you say, he needs to pull his act together. It's very sad that Kerry can actually fall victem to the slander against his military background when it's so solid. And at the same time he is unable to draw attention to Bush's military background which is spottier than a dalmation.

[eviljim]

Kerry is just too nice to fight back with mudslinging. Unfortunately it will be his downfall. At least we'll only have Bush for 4 more years since he can't run a 3rd time.

[tyjet3]

It's very sad that Kerry can actually fall victem to the slander against his military background when it's so solid.

 

The problem with kerry in this topic is he flips his story around to make it work for who he is talking to...

 

If he is talking to veterns, he trys to sound like he is a great war hero...

 

Then he talks to anti-war people and is proud to say that he burned his medals...

 

He is the public's female dog in this topic. It really hurt him to bring out his war record. he nevr should have done it, but i understand why he did... he was trying to show that he could understand and handle war.

 

At least we'll only have Bush for 4 more years since he can't run a 3rd time.

 

Thank Gaia.

 

I think Kerry has a chance still. But as you say, he needs to pull his act together.

 

Like i said before, he is his own worst enemy.

[Alexander the Great]

My personal stance is that i dont like either choice of candidate. They both seem like theyd do a pretty bad job of something thats pretty bad. I liked the idea of being in Iraq, i dont care if others dont. I dont think America should stand back and wait to be attacked. I think we should use preventative methods like the War on Iraq, but when it comes down to it i dont like Bush or Kerry. But no votes for kerry because i dont like the idea of sending someone new into this office of such power. He doesnt know what he should. Its like sending in an electrician to finish a plumbers job. Get it, got it, doubt it, good.

[Zmid]

My personal stance is that i dont like either choice of candidate. They both seem like theyd do a pretty bad job of something thats pretty bad. I liked the idea of being in Iraq, i dont care if others dont. I dont think America should stand back and wait to be attacked.

That's the whole point of the opposition to the Iraq War - attacked how? There was and is no evidence that Iraq had the intention nor the means to attack the US or UK. Yes, Bush and Blair both repeatedly claimed that Saddam had WMD, but the evidence backing this up was incredibly weak, purely circumstantial, and we now know that some of it was just straight-out wrong. This was being balanced against detailed reports by Weapons Inspectors on the ground in Iraq providing hard evidence that flatly contradicted the intelligence given by Bush and Blair.

 

I think we should use preventative methods like the War on Iraq

 

IMO, the Iraq War was a classic example of why such 'preventative measures' (otherwise known as a 'pre-emptive strike') should never be used. It countered a threat that didn't exist.

 

but when it comes down to it i dont like Bush or Kerry. But no votes for kerry because i dont like the idea of sending someone new into this office of such power.

 

Well, if you don't do that now, you've GOT to do it in four years time. Why wait?

 

He doesnt know what he should.

 

Frankly, IMO, neither does Bush. For example, how to assess intelligence when making the decision to go to war.

[Pack Rat]

I think we should use preventative methods like the War on Iraq,

Total bs imo...

 

the U.S.A knew very clear that there was no thread at all. It's all about money, sorry to say this but for the last 40 years the typical american way...

 

The war had not 'ended' for a month or American company's were granted oil rights... What have I been missing here... Instead of rebuilding Iraq which the USA totally destroyed, no, Bush gives American company's the rights for oil and says Europe has to pay for the rebuilding of Iraq.

 

Surely every sane American cant deny this.

 

And it's true, Kerry sucks at mudslinging. Bush has done it for the past 4 years to almost every country in the world.

 

Surely the American people realises that they are beginning to be hated by the rest of the world. I've seen it happening here and in France. Europe is really starting to hate the US and what are the Americans doing, cheering that Bush wont change his policy...

 

I really dont get it

[Coolhandgoose]

Here's a good preventative measure for war. Don't give dictatorships billions of dollars so they can buy better armies to kill thousands of innocent people. Then call them terrorists and bomb the hell out of them. IMO.

 

In terms of people lying and getting re-elected, look at Canada, we do it all the time. We re-elected Jean Cretien twice (no limit on re-elections in Canada) and he promised us that there would be no more GST (a 7% tax on everything you buy).

 

I think people are generally happy with status quo and are afraid of change.

[eviljim]

this was actually a pm (and my response) from the "greatest villain of all time" thread but i think it fits here. the original sender will go unnamed, unless he/she wishes to make themself known.

 

Great Villains of History

 

In 1904, between 65,000 and 80,000 Namibian Herero Tribal members were murdered by German colonial troops. Germany colonized Namibia in the 1880s and ruled it with a military governor. In January 1904, members of one of the two Herero tribes attacked German outposts. Germany sought to put down the rebellion through force. On October 2, 1904, German troops drove masses of Herero tribal members into the Omaheke desert, poisoned waterholes, and caused large numbers to die of starvation, dehydration, and exposure. Remaining members were surrounded and slaughtered. The Herero were reduced from approximately 80,000 to 15,000. Surviving members were forced into slave labor.

 

Beginning in 1915, the Islamic Turkish state of the Ottoman Empire sought to end the collective existence of the Christian Armenian population. From 1915 through 1918, during World War I, the Ottoman Empire subjected the Armenian people to deportation, expropriation, abduction, torture, massacre, and starvation. The atrocities were renewed between 1920 and 1923. It is estimated that one and a half million Armenians were killed out of over two million Armenians who had lived in the Ottoman Empire. It should be noted that these activities ceased with the institution of the new Republic of Turkey in October, 1923.

 

In 1924, the Soviets forced Ukrainians to adopt the Communist policy of collectivization of all production, including agriculture, under government control. The central government demanded impossibly high quotas of grain creating a food shortage. Finally, the borders were closed, all supplies were cut off, and soldiers guarded food stores. From 1932 through 1933, this man-made famine lead to the death of 5 million of the politically resistant Ukranian people.

 

The Holocaust was Nazi Germany's systematic slaughter of Jews and other groups. During the Nazi campaign to rid Europe of Jews and other `inferior' people, over six million Jews were murdered. Throughout the existence of Nazi Germany, Jews were subjected to social restriction, forced to live in ghettos, imprisoned in concentration camps, and exterminated though gruesome methods. The Holocaust ended with the defeat of Nazi Germany in 1945.

 

The Burundi genocide refers to the massive killing of Hutus by the Tutsi government of Burundi in 1972. After Burundi's independence in 1962, the Tutsi minority assumed power. In 1972, Hutus rose up in opposition to the Tutsi government. From April to August of that year, the Tutsi government responded by killing 100,000 to 200,000 Hutus.

 

After defeating Cambodian's Lon Nol government in 1975, the Khmer Rouge communists, under Pol Pot's leadership, sought to establish order through force. The Khmer Rouge imposed a strict collective labor model of communism and sought to eliminate all opposition to the policy. In the years following the 1975 assumption of power, the Khmer Rouge forced civilians into labor camps working for minimum rations. In all, over two million civilians were killed.

 

In 1983, the National Islamic Front imposed Islamic law on the country of Sudan. The genocide in Sudan resulted from a civil war between the National Islamic Front and non-Muslim political groups. The Islamic Front launched massive suppressive efforts to occupy southern villages. As a result, approximately two million non-Muslim people have been killed by the Islamic Front.

 

On April 6, 1994, the president of Rwanda was assassinated. Hutus accused their Tutsi opposition of responsibility. The resulting Hutu slaughter of the Tutsi population was conducted entirely by hand. Civilian death squads used machetes and clubs to kill over a million Tutsi men, women, and children.

 

The Bosnian genocide refers to an attack in 1995 by Serbians on the town of Srebenica, where thousands of Muslim civilians had found safe haven with Dutch peacekeepers. Serbian soldiers surrounded the U.N. compound set up to protect the civilians. Serb troops separated men from women and children. They forced the men up the nearby hills and the women were deported by the bus load. Thousands of bodies were found in mass graves after the incident. The total population of Srebrenica was either deported or killed as a result of the Serbian aggression.

 

my response:

 

That's an excellent history lesson but I wasn't around for those events. I'm well aware of the existence of several of them but they didn't affect me. Ask A citizen of Iraq who was more evil, Saddam or Hitler?

 

Saddam had influence on their lives so they'll likely tell you he is the greater evil. Bush has had an immense effect on me and many of my friends (they are in the military) in a very negative manner which deems him a candidate for this title. The thing that makes him as bad (if not worse) than the others is that he hides his motives and lies to our faces when he gets caught. He hides his personal motives under the flag of patriotism causing unsuspecting people to think we're doing the right thing. Our country, although our past is colored with blood, is generally considered the good guy and he is destroying that image. That doesn't exactly sit well with me.

 

I know that I have said nothing new but hopefully you can see where I'm coming from on that.

 

eviljim

 

Kerry may not win but he's still getting my vote.

[Slaiv]

...in France....

Ask the general populace of America, even the Democrats, what they think of France. Needless to say, the feelings are mutual.... ;)

[Breton Thief Oriana]

Kerry may not win but he's still getting my vote.

See, that makes me wish I was old enough to vote, and I'd help out, yo.