Message to the oblivion modding community...

[LoginToDownload]

Do we have to have every single "my first mod" where People played around with numbers on TESNexus? If your Answer is "No", then you should be able to give that Person a rating other then a 10.

 

If you think a big quest mod has been made technically sound and even marvelous, but with very little "Soul" or Creativity on the Side of the Author, then you should be able to give that Mod a rating other then Ten.

On the Nexus, ratings mean different things than they mean on most other websites. It's not because of the community, but because of the ToS.

 

The commenting and rating system is available on this site to provide users with:

 

an interface to offer positive feedback on the functionality of the file in question based on the author’s initial intentions

the ability to offer constructive criticism on aspects of the file that could be improved

 

By this system, a 10 doesn't mean a great, or even good, mod. It just means a perfectly working mod. A solid house-mod or superweapon, while uninteresting, unnecessary, and unoriginal, does everything it sets out to do. Nothing can be improved about a superweapon; the only thing you can want instead is an entirely different mod. That's also the reason so many low ratings for "unworthy" mods are deleted. It's the low raters, not the community, that don't understand what the system is for. It's a perfectly natural mistake, since ratings are so rarely used this way, and you can't blame them for skimming over the legalese.

 

Something should be done about the system, but changing it to reflect a mod's subjective quality would just mess things up further. Mods are about customizing the game to personal preferences; I should hope that's self-evident. Trashing something done perfectly because you don't like what it does entirely defeats the point. It would be best to change it so its purpose is more obvious, or use an "I approve of this mod" system like the Image Share.

[colourwheel]

It mainly not about the rating system that I been bothered about. What really bothers me is when people leave comments like this...

 

this is such a geek mod. Get a real girl instead of jerking off to some virtual one..

 

http://www.tesnexus.com/modules/comments/i...3&fid=24436

 

Comments people leave like this are very unconstructive and a bit insulting to the community as a whole as well as the work I personally put into this release.

 

Get over it. You know that people will come and say things like that. Ignore them and report them.

 

Maybe it doesn't bother you, but its very annoying and irratating to read. Maybe you might think i am over reacting but honestly how would you feel if you spent hours on end on a file just to read a bunch of non-constructive insulting comments on your file page? would you actually feel like uploading more work for the community for free? I dont think so. You would probably stop. If you notice (atleast I have noticed) a majority of modders in this community are very sensitive about the work they release. And honestly I do not blame them. If this constant trend of modders pulling their mods off this forum for what ever reasons besides negative commenting keeps up. The community will start to shrink and so will the upload traffic.

 

edit: BTW I do report insulting comments posted on file comment pages.

[buddah]

Not all reported posts/comments/ratings are deleted, each is looked at.

 

If the comment is derogatory or inflammatory in nature it will removed, also those that have absolutely no redeeming value Gay, This Sux, Epic Fail, EWWWWWWW and the like will be deleted out of hand. After one of more by the same member have been deleted we will take final action and remove them from the site. Will you get a chance, usually you will get the benefit of the doubt but that is up to the moderator that handles the report.

 

Also it is not so much what you say as how you say it, a little tact and respect for what has gone into making a particular mod goes a long way to take the sting out of a comment.

 

Tact is defined this way, telling someone to go to hell in such a manner they look forward to the trip. Respect is demonstrated as posting nothing you would not say to your mother or holy man.

 

It is not only the raters that cause problems, the authors can be and sometimes are the worst offenders when it comes to trash talk and demonstrating alack of respect for the community in general. I an not pointing fingers at anyone!

 

Dark0ne is in the final weeks of his university/college year, so do look for some major changes to the site at the end of june, he completes his course work about 15 June and give some time to unwind and party his buns off in celebration.

 

But please do post up you suggestions and concerns in this thread on the front page of fallout3nexus....that is where the biggest issues are being caused. They find this side of the site and feel obligated to criticize and act in an undignified manner.

 

http://thenexusforums.com/index.php?showtopic=117513

 

If you think the oblivion site is rough, spend some time on the fallout site. It probably should have been posted on both sites, but the discussion is a good one and the boss looks at it several times a day.

 

Buddah

[TurokD]

It mainly not about the rating system that I been bothered about. What really bothers me is when people leave comments like this...

 

this is such a geek mod. Get a real girl instead of jerking off to some virtual one..

 

http://www.tesnexus.com/modules/comments/i...3&fid=24436

 

Comments people leave like this are very unconstructive and a bit insulting to the community as a whole as well as the work I personally put into this release.

 

You're going to deal with jerks, no matter how swift the moderators are. If your concern is more about nasty comments than the rating system itself, theres not much anyone can do. As much as its difficult to swallow, like Amayakyrol said, just let it go. Or better yet, focus on your downloads and positive comments that are reaching the hundreds and then compare them to the negative comments. Two entirely different tunes.

[colourwheel]

It is not only the raters that cause problems, the authors can be and sometimes are the worst offenders when it comes to trash talk and demonstrating alack of respect for the community in general. I an not pointing fingers at anyone!

 

Yes you do have a very good point. I will admit, Sometimes Even I might be to blame for trash talking when I not mean to. But ussually I will atleast try to quickly appologize if the subject aims toward drama.

 

and BTW I do think all the staff here does a great job reguardless of what some people say. For as big as this forum is everyone here seems to moderate it better than even some small forums i lurk from time to time.

[worm82075]

Whether it was intended to be that way or not the truth is the rating system can really only tell us one thing, how popular a mod is. If it is very popular then it gets lots of ratings. That is why there is no point in giving a mod low ratings because nearly every single mod out there will have a larger number of people that dislike it than like it and even if everyone rated every file there would 50 9's and 10,000 5's

 

No matter what kind of rating system gets employed the result will always be the same so why not just avoid all the subterfuge and ditch all the 1 to 10 crap(which is a lie anyway) and just go for the thumbs up option. Simple to convert old ratings, every vote 7 and up becomes a thumbs up.

 

This will silence this discussion permanently.

[RGMage2]

I think part of the problem is that many mod users have absolutely no idea about the amount of time and effort that goes into the making and releasing of a mod (good or bad). You combine that with the natural inclination that we humans have to be judgmental, and the predisposition that many people have toward negativity, and this leads to people becoming or acting like what we refer to as trolls.

 

I would also point out that many of the people who give low ratings or make hurtful comments do not perceive themselves to be trolls. In many cases they honestly believe in what they are saying and they believe they have the right to say it. You can not talk to them about it or change their mind in any substantial way. It comes down to their perception of the world, and what they believe to be their place in this world, which will usually be one of exaggerated importance. Not surprising when you consider that most of us live in our own little world, where we are at the centre and all things revolve around us.

 

Many users also have a misconception as to why modders mod and release. Mods are often referred to or treated as if they were products released for profit, whereby kind words and kudos are the currency for purchasing a mod, and negative comments are a fair response expressed by a dissatisfied customer.

 

I'm almost tempted to start a new thread asking the questions "Why do you mod?" and "Why do you release or not release?" Perhaps if modders where willing to explain why they do what they do, and what they get out of it, or hope to get out of it. And I don't mean just a few glib lines, but actually go into detail about where we are really coming from, and who we are as human beings, maybe there could be a greater understanding between the makers and the users.

 

Getting back to the subject of rating, I personally do not rate very many mods. I really should but I don't. It comes down to my downloading habits. Very rarely do I download a mod and use it right away. When I see something interesting I DL it right away, but then it might sit on my hard drive for a month (or two) before I even unpack it. By the time I get it in game it usually has so many good ratings that a rating from me wouldn't mean anything.

 

My criteria for rating? Simple. If I couldn't give it a ten I wouldn't rate it. Does that mean that a mod would have to be perfect before I would rate it? No. There is no such thing as perfection. Anything can be improved. As a modder. there is nothing I can do today that I wont be able to do better tomorrow. Skills evolve, we get better at what we do. That is the way it is.

 

So what type of mod would I give a 10 to? Would I give a ten to an All Armor Playable mod, or an All Eyes Playable mod? Well I might. :smile: It would depend on who made it. If I made it then it would not be worth rating, It would be an embarrassment for me to release something like that. :yucky: However, if someone who is new to modding and new to Oblivion released it, and lets say it is their first mod. They just opened up the CS one day and they figured it out for themselves - no help from anyone else. They just saw the possibility and it was like... oh... look what I can do. And then they had the courage to release it. And believe me it takes courage to release any mod, let alone your first one. I think I could find it in my heart to give that mod a 10.

 

As for you colourwheel, you are the queen of Oblivion erotica and you will always be a 10. :)

[worm82075]

Well that's pretty much the whole problem, everyone rates for different reasons under different criteria. Take away the guess work and have but one criteria. Did you like the mod? yeses are tallied and displayed as thumbs up count.

 

if you divide the number of ratings(for the sake of argument we'll say that they are thumbs ups)

into the number of downloads and then divide the dividend into the total number of days the mod has been available then you get a top ten that looks just like the one up now. don't believe me? try doing the math on each of the top ten files and see if they don't stay in their current positions.

[Mur_Zik]

Honestly I don't mind construstive criticism when people rate my work. But I am a very concerned about when people not only rate my work but anyones work for unfit reasons low. If you honestly feel like any file deserves a rating of 1 or even a low rating, it is best to not even rate or leave comment at all. concidering how the current rating system is set there really should be no reason to rate any file a 1 or even a low rating at all. I would have to say over 99.9% of all files uploaded on this site I have seen do exactly what they are suppose to do, yet I always see people try to justify why they rate a file a low.

 

Honestly if you are one of those people who rate low for any other reason than what a file should do just ask your self this... How would you feel if you were a modder uploading files on a forum to download for free and people rate your work unjustly?

 

Do you honestly think even if you feel an author deserves a low rating for a file that it will change anything?

 

how do you think others in the community will look at you when they see you rating low or commenting negative criticism?

 

Ussually if files are rated low or a comment is left with negative criticism it will just be removed.

 

Dont worry I am not going to pull my work off this forum or anything. But lots of times you will see lots of Authors pull their work off any forum when they feel people do not like their work.

 

Well CW, i'd like to note some things finally... In my opinion you are much more a

busyness-lady or so than a modder... As i've noticed, you're VERY worried 'bout ratings of your files and simply ignore the fact there were no any of your mods if there were no the meshes made by MODDERS. Texturing and copy/pasting in NifScope is a great Job, but agree you couldn't texture/copy/paste something that doesn't exist...

So if you you just remembered that ~9/10 of the work was done by other people, i suppose you'd be much less worried about ratings/etc... Or i'm wrong?

P.S. I wonder what would be your reaction if somebody just inserted one of your mods in his own one without asking your permission and noting in read-me that downloading your mod is recommended but isn't necessary as all content is present? I think the moderators would be very busy for some time...

[colourwheel]

Honestly I don't mind construstive criticism when people rate my work. But I am a very concerned about when people not only rate my work but anyones work for unfit reasons low. If you honestly feel like any file deserves a rating of 1 or even a low rating, it is best to not even rate or leave comment at all. concidering how the current rating system is set there really should be no reason to rate any file a 1 or even a low rating at all. I would have to say over 99.9% of all files uploaded on this site I have seen do exactly what they are suppose to do, yet I always see people try to justify why they rate a file a low.

 

Honestly if you are one of those people who rate low for any other reason than what a file should do just ask your self this... How would you feel if you were a modder uploading files on a forum to download for free and people rate your work unjustly?

 

Do you honestly think even if you feel an author deserves a low rating for a file that it will change anything?

 

how do you think others in the community will look at you when they see you rating low or commenting negative criticism?

 

Ussually if files are rated low or a comment is left with negative criticism it will just be removed.

 

Dont worry I am not going to pull my work off this forum or anything. But lots of times you will see lots of Authors pull their work off any forum when they feel people do not like their work.

 

Well CW, i'd like to note some things finally... In my opinion you are much more a

busyness-lady or so than a modder... As i've noticed, you're VERY worried 'bout ratings of your files and simply ignore the fact there were no any of your mods if there were no the meshes made by MODDERS. Texturing and copy/pasting in NifScope is a great Job, but agree you couldn't texture/copy/paste something that doesn't exist...

So if you you just remembered that ~9/10 of the work was done by other people, i suppose you'd be much less worried about ratings/etc... Or i'm wrong?

P.S. I wonder what would be your reaction if somebody just inserted one of your mods in his own one without asking your permission and noting in read-me that downloading your mod is recommended but isn't necessary as all content is present? I think the moderators would be very busy for some time...

 

Mur_zik I really do not understand what your problem with me is, If you are still upset about something that happened in the past between us months ago, you really need to get over it. I have supported your work to the fullest over time. And helped to apply your work in many mods over time. I have sent you Emails, and PMs appologizing for any confussion about posting a pic of one of your animations you personally gave me and also took them down from the uploaded site to try to make you happy. I did not for any purpose use any animation you might have gave me in the past in any mod that was not already claimed by you as free resorce. If anything you should be greatful to have someone who has thought so highly of your work that they decide to use it in their own. honestly you really need to grow up Mur_zik, to personally attack anyone in a public forum is very childish.

 

I already tried to appologize to you months ago sending you emails and PMs, I am not about to spam your email now saying I am sorry anymore. If you feel so strongly about some of my work using your sexy_walk animation I would be happy to remove all my files from nexus just for you... you only need to say the word and it will be done. Because I have retired from modding oblivion.

 

edit: I have made all my files hidden till I hear from you just to make you happy. and Agian since you never checked your email way back in november, I am sorry I ever took a pic of an animation you gave me in the past without asking you even though i did even remove the pic from the uploaded site.