AtomsChosen Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 So lets say I wanted to have one settlement that has a build area spanning the entire commonwealth, what is stopping me from doing this? Would this work or would I run into technical errors or a limit if I tried this? I just want to know what the maximum build area I can have is for one custom settlement before running into problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKKmods Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 uGridsToLoad defines the active 3d loaded area around the player and the workshop system will have problems when you try and build further than that distance from the workshop. The default technical value is 10,240 game units (roughly Sanctuary workshop to minutemen statue) but with cell boundaries and cell buffering it can be up to 14,000 units. Its amusing* to watch the ignorance of people publishing extended boundaries without any warnings and then empathise with poor users having all sorts of resource assignment, production, sandboxing, orphan items and such issues with unloaded objects. Learn more here: Workshop Resource Test (why resources are reported wrong) If you want to extend the build boundary you need to increase uGridsToLoad. The maximum uGridsToLoad I could get a vanilla game to load with is around 31 (63k game units) at the edge of an unpopulated wilderness map area and 13 (26k game units) downtown as described here. All based on the number and complexity of objects and geometry in the area. The whole comonwelth map radius is 200,000 game units which would be an unacheivable uGridsToLoad 98. Try it out and let us know ... (*) amusing because they wont be told or educated and that wilfull ignorance amuses me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarannKiar Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 (edited) So lets say I wanted to have one settlement that has a build area spanning the entire commonwealth, what is stopping me from doing this? Would this work or would I run into technical errors or a limit if I tried this? I just want to know what the maximum build area I can have is for one custom settlement before running into problems. It wouldn't work "just out of the box" due to the technical limitations described above but Place Anywhere already has such feature. I haven't used so I don't have first hand experience with it but you can give it a try. Edited October 23, 2023 by LarannKiar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomsChosen Posted October 23, 2023 Author Share Posted October 23, 2023 (edited) uGridsToLoad defines the active 3d loaded area around the player and the workshop system will have problems when you try and build further than that distance from the workshop. The default technical value is 10,240 game units (roughly Sanctuary workshop to minutemen statue) but with cell boundaries and cell buffering it can be up to 14,000 units. Its amusing* to watch the ignorance of people publishing extended boundaries without any warnings and then empathise with poor users having all sorts of resource assignment, production, sandboxing, orphan items and such issues with unloaded objects. Learn more here: Workshop Resource Test (why resources are reported wrong) If you want to extend the build boundary you need to increase uGridsToLoad. The maximum uGridsToLoad I could get a vanilla game to load with is around 31 (63k game units) at the edge of an unpopulated wilderness map area and 13 (26k game units) downtown as described here. All based on the number and complexity of objects and geometry in the area. The whole comonwelth map radius is 200,000 game units which would be an unacheivable uGridsToLoad 98. Try it out and let us know ... (*) amusing because they wont be told or educated and that wilfull ignorance amuses me. If I understand correct Spectacle Island is the settlement with the biggest build area. I looked up some stuff about that ugridstoload thing. What I understand is that increasing this will cause longer load times. I don't think I want to increase it since that seems kind of risky. So as a rule of thumb, I probably should not have a build area on custom settlements any bigger then that of Spectacle Island? Just for fun I will try making a build are a that spans across the commonwealth just to see what happens. Edited October 23, 2023 by RayoftheSun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKKmods Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 I believe that Spectacle island build area is actually is bigger than uGrids so has workshop resources unloading, never actually measured it myself tho. Yup ... I have customer submitted Papyrus logs of workshop resources unloading whilst the workshop is active. Which goes to show the base game developers/builders under commercial time pressure to deliver also make mistakes. You choose the level of quality you aspire to deliver. ps Small uGrids increases to 7 or 9 are "safe" despite what you may read on reddit about breaking quests (no one seems to know specifically what allegedly breaks e.g. distance triggers ... yes and so what ?). Of course it requires more compute and discipline (hohoho) on loaded objects. If you dont have control of those elements then best not depend on changing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South8028 Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 (edited) I believe that Spectacle island build area is actually is bigger than uGrids so has workshop resources unloading, never actually measured it myself tho. Yup ... I have customer submitted Papyrus logs of workshop resources unloading whilst the workshop is active. Which goes to show the base game developers/builders under commercial time pressure to deliver also make mistakes. You choose the level of quality you aspire to deliver. ps Small uGrids increases to 7 or 9 are "safe" despite what you may read on reddit about breaking quests (no one seems to know specifically what allegedly breaks e.g. distance triggers ... yes and so what ?). Of course it requires more compute and discipline (hohoho) on loaded objects. If you dont have control of those elements then best not depend on changing it.I have interiors - a settlement much larger than uGridsToLoad. I don't remember the exact dimensions. I dont remember what exactly I did in ck (it was ~3 years ago), but I probably just made the size of the entire sandbox and construction area huge. There was some kind of bug, but it was minor, like phantom collisions that appeared at the beginning, but as the development increased, the bug disappeared. I built up an area ~5-6 times larger than uGridsToLoad and don't remember any problems.Like this esp. But without Place everywhere you cant build anything there. Because these interiors are like the Institute. Made for the construction of a mega-shelter in empty space.https://disk.yandex.ru/d/mBVRKvCriiPYEQ Edited October 23, 2023 by South8028 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepperman35 Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 Settlement boundary size by itself can be misleading. The amount of objects you stuff into the boundary will also influence performance. I built a huge Institute themed settlement on Spectacle Island and notified some performance issues. Granted some of those could be related to precombines and the like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South8028 Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 Settlement boundary size by itself can be misleading. The amount of objects you stuff into the boundary will also influence performance. I built a huge Institute themed settlement on Spectacle Island and notified some performance issues. Granted some of those could be related to precombines and the like.When building large settlements, first of all, you need to convert all the textures so that there are no mip textures. Either all textures with mip maps should be of the same resolution, or there should be no mip maps at all. Otherwise, at some point, when the number of textures exceeds the video memory size, it will start to glitch terribly, drawing mip maps of distant objects on top of nearby ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKKmods Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 It would be fantastic is someone could explain how WorkshopparentScript.ResetWorkshop which needs to find all workshop attached resources to recalcuate workshop ratings can find non persistent workshop resource objects that are unloaded outside the active uGrids. e.g. just because you didnt NOTICE a problem doesnt mean there WASNT a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South8028 Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 It would be fantastic is someone could explain how WorkshopparentScript.ResetWorkshop which needs to find all workshop attached resources to recalcuate workshop ratings can find non persistent workshop resource objects that are unloaded outside the active uGrids. e.g. just because you didnt NOTICE a problem doesnt mean there WASNT a problem.Well, that's honestly what I said... I didn't notice any problems. ) There may have been problems, but I didnt see them. Objects with physics did not disappear outside of uGridsToLoad, settlers did not fall through. I didnt record the moments of crossing the uGridsToLoad border, because I was building halls and rooms there that stretched 5-6 floors up and I dont know how many, but it was a lot in area. After a couple of weeks of total construction, I got tired of building there and abandoned this map. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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