How far can you patch a weapon mod in the middle of a save?

[kplusa]

Help please! I want to tweak some weapon mods on FO4edit in the middle of a modded playthrough but I'm not sure how far I can go without breaking the mod or corrupting the save. Are there any rules on what I can or cannot change under these conditions?

Can I: 

1. Completely change the weapon's default name like from Laser Rifle to AK-47? Even if it's in my inventory or personal containers?

2. Remove or add the weapon mod to the leveled lists (whether injection or edit)?

3. Remove attachments whether they're equipped or not? What about adding more attachment options?

4. Change the ammunition type to Munitions, Caliber Complex, Vanilla and so on? 

Thank you.

Edited January 31 by kplusa
clarification

[fraquar]

I don't have the technical details to explain - but lets just say two of the things you propose I'd never do mid play through.

#2 and #3.   

Mods that add via LL injection do so one time - when the mod first loads.    How you'd even go about editing that LL entry that is baked into your save game file I have no earthly idea.   How the game mechanics handle missing entries (i.e. loading a weapon from a mod that no longer exists) - I'll leave that to others to explain.

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At the end of the day I follow a simple rule.    If I'm so "invested" in my current game play save - I don't add or remove ANYTHING.    

Ex.  If I've just spent the better part of 5-6 man hours getting my "super settlement" to look and function exactly the way I want - well I'm just not messing with that.    I'll save any "grand ideas" like trying to add, remove or edit existing mods for the next play through.

[kplusa]

Could I still change the ammo/name used by a weapon mod that was added via LL injection at least?

[peacefulhomecare]

Yeah, you can tweak a lot mid-playthrough, but some changes are riskier than others. Here’s a breakdown:

1. Changing the weapon’s name – Totally fine. Won’t break anything, even if it’s in your inventory. You can do this under full name.

2. Editing leveled lists – Adding to lists is usually safe, especially if the mod already uses a script for injection. Removing can be risky if NPCs are already using the weapon. If you're editing directly instead of using a script, make a backup in case it messes with vendor or enemy spawns.

3. Removing/adding attachments – Unequipped ones are safe to mess with. Equipped ones can cause issues, especially if you remove them completely instead of swapping. Adding new options is fine as long as you reference valid attach points.

4. Changing ammo types – Works fine, but any existing weapons with the old ammo type might have issues. If the weapon is already spawned in the world, its ammo might not update automatically. Munitions and Caliber Complex usually work well if patched correctly.

Note: backup your save before testing anything major, and if something acts weird, revert and try again. FO4Edit is powerful but also easy to break things with. Happy modding!

[kplusa]

Thank you @peacefulhomecare  for your explanation

1. What if the weapon mod has INNR due to attachments? Do I just change the full name under weapon tab or do I have to change OMOD and Keywords?

2. Also, how do I lower the spawn rate of a weapon using the LL?

Edited February 1 by kplusa
added another question

[geala]

The rule is to never remove a mod with an .esp or script. I did however all of the 4 listed things several times in different playthroughs, and never had problems.

No. 2 when removing weapons, especially when injected by quest scripts (I don't like injection and try to avoid it, by making my own LL lists), for me is the most dangerous behavior and I would try to avoid it. That said, I did it on a large scale in some prior playthroughs, without negative results. The NPCs did no longer spawn with the weapons but with the new weapons I had attached to them.

That does not guarantee anyone that severe stability problems could not arise in their game. I had however always a very stable Fallout 4, except for the time when I had removed AWKCR and AE and used some no-AWKCR versions of mods, for greater stability. A nice irony, isn't it?. The crashes stopped after using AWKCR and the original mods again.

 

To the last questions, what do you mean with INNR? What do you want to achieve? The weapon name in game has nothing to do with the identification of the weapon by the code.

You lower spawn rates of weapons generally by removing them from LLI lists. My minutemen for example have only a very small percentage of laser muskets in their LLI lists, and more auto combat rifles (5.56 in my game) or medium machine guns (assault rifles, .308 in my game). You lower spawn rates per user by adding other weapons to the LLI list, at least that's how I do it. A normal LLI list with calculation for all leveled item entries distributes all entries in the given relation. If it has two entries of the LL for semi-auto pipe rifles and one entry for the semi-auto combat rifle, the users of the LLI list have 66% pipe rifles and 33 % combat rifles (level requirements aside; I distribute all weapons before lvl 10 and don't care much for levels).

Or do you want users to spawn without the weapon (why?)? Then use the "chance none" edit. I use it for armor, f.e. my normal gunners have a lot of vanilla (leather, metal, combat) torso armor and op custom armor in their list, but 30% spawn without armor (very few NPCs in my game have leg or arm armor btw). My higher gunners spawn with 100% combat and custom armor. 

[kplusa]

Thank you for sharing your experiences and knowledge @geala !

I definitely won't try to remove script injected weapons, especially ones with quests. Way too risky.

Yeah, I'm definitely avoiding AWKCR since it's near universally criticized from what I've read. ECO seems to be more liked but I don't need it.

1. For the INNR, I was just wondering if I had to rename the attachments as well to match the new name. For example, I change Blue Revolver to Red Rifle under weapon tab but the attachments still say Blue Revolver sights/receiver. I tested it on one mod and the INNR still functioned normally even if I didn't change the attachment names. 

2. No, I don't want enemies to spawn weaponless. It's just that I see complaints on some mods regarding spawning too much and not seeing the other weapons. That's why the author usually removes them from the LL. I was thinking of adding them back but without encountering those issues of monotony.

3. Also, do you know how to safely delete a merged patch that was made with xEdit? I can only disable the plugin on Vortex. 

 

[peacefulhomecare]

On 2/1/2025 at 8:21 PM, kplusa said:

Thank you @peacefulhomecare  for your explanation

1. What if the weapon mod has INNR due to attachments? Do I just change the full name under weapon tab or do I have to change OMOD and Keywords?

2. Also, how do I lower the spawn rate of a weapon using the LL?

1. If the weapon mod has INNR due to attachments, just change the full name under the weapon tab. No need to edit OMOD or Keywords unless you want to tweak naming rules.
2. To lower the spawn rate in a leveled list (LL), reduce the chance none value, lower its count, or move it to a rarer sublist.

[kplusa]

Can I change the full name on the mod itself or is it better to make a merged patch through copy as override into?

[peacefulhomecare]

On 2/4/2025 at 11:09 AM, kplusa said:

Can I change the full name on the mod itself or is it better to make a merged patch through copy as override into?

Yeah, you can change the full name on the mod itself, but it’s usually better to do it through a merged patch with 'copy as override into' so you don’t mess with the original file. That way, if something breaks, you can just delete the patch instead of the whole mod. But if it’s a small change, you might be fine editing directly. Up to you!