Fallout 3

[Harabec Weathers]

Ok sooo, Fallout 3, a game of which we all know and love :)

Theres something about the factions thats just not making sense to me.

Primarily

The Brotherhood of Steel and The Enclave

 

I wanna start of this discussion first with Enclave. I know this is posted in the Discussion section so lets do ur best to keep spoilers out :)

The biggest question I have with the Enclave is (drum roll) are they, in fact, the remnants of the US Government? Or are they just a highly organized and expansive group looking for dominion?

Because if they are in fact the remnants of the US Government, the that would make the Brotherhood of Steel, Outcasts, and you (as the player) a bunch of terrorists lol. But same goes, if they were the actual government, why come in guns blazing in a hellish firestorm killing everyone they come in contact with?

The math just doenst add up ya know lol

So lets hear it folks, whats you're take on the Enclave?

[wrathofnero]

I haven't beaten the game yet, but I take it that since no one has said anything that it can't be explained without spoiling. :)

[Harabec Weathers]

Yea Id prefer not to spoil it for anyone. Lol idk maybe this post will get moved to the spoilers section

[chaosapiant]

I don't think I'm spoiling any of the games story by explaining what these two groups are. The Brotherhood Of Steel is simply a group of militaristic scavengers looking for and hoarding technology and hardware. The Brotherhood in Fallout 3 are a splinter group, and have decided to "fight the good fight" against super mutants and enclaved soldiers. The brotherhood "outcasts" in the game are the actual remants of the Brotherhood of Steel from the first two games. They are the real deal.

 

The Enclave are remnants of the US Government that seek to rebuild the nation at their whim and want to dominate everything. They believe that they are the only pure humans left, and seek to eradicate everyone else. Since it is alluded to that the government was corrupt before the bombs even dropped, it isn't really terrorism to go against the Enclave. If any analogy works, it's more like a revolution. The simple fact is, the Enclave are as amoral as Hitler. They see everyone else the same way Hitler saw the jews: inferior and not worthy of life.

[Deleted457498User]

Yes, they really are the remains of the U.S. Government.

Well. Part of the U.S. Government, anyway.

Mostly, they're the descendants of -to quote Fallout Wiki- "officials and military officers with ties to powerful corporations".

It's hard to say exactly who they are and what their purpose is, because -much like the Brotherhood of Steel- they aren't one unified force: although they're all theoretically working toward the same goal, there's the 'main' Enclave, and then there are many 'splinter' groups of the Enclave who have their own objectives.

As for the whole 'terrorist' aspect, well... 'terrorism' by definition is "The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons."

I wouldn't say that 'survival' is the same thing, which is what you are doing- and I don't know about you, but I don't think the Wasteland has much in the way of laws or governments to terrorize.

Well, unless of course you're playing a straight-up evil character, in which case, yeah, you probably would be classified as a terrorist. (oops.)

 

if they were the actual government, why come in guns blazing in a hellish firestorm killing everyone they come in contact with?

 

They're the government. It's what they do. XD

 

EDIT: chaosapiant, that's not entirely true. The true Brotherhood of Steel is every bit as amoral as the Enclave; they just aren't quite as Knight Templarish about it. And, let me point out that not everyone in the Enclave wants to eradicate non-pure humans.

Just... *coughs* just most of them do. >.>

Other than that though, that's pretty spot-on.

[Harabec Weathers]

Thanks chaosapaint

I never played the first 2 fallouts so all I know of the Brotherhood is what you learn in Fallout 3

I can see now the Enclaves angle, going on that "untainted" idea. Same as that particular Vaults experiment. The untainted humans thing.

But who exaclty is behind the Enclave? I know in this fallout its that president guy (no spoilers :P), but when talking Elder Lyons, he mentioned encountering them on the west coast and they were led by a President Richardson. Mayve similar to FO3s president?

Its all making a lot more sense now lol. With everything gone, they are using the opportunity to rebuild as they saw fit. Yea thats definately making more sense.

Same with the Brotherhood Im getting the picture now. I know the Outcasts are only interested in preserving the progress of humanity itself, and Lyons Brotherhood is having lives and helping people survive.

Things are much clearer now lol.

[Harabec Weathers]

@ AcrylicElf

Yea I see what your saying with the original Brotherhood. Im assuming they saw tribal communities and such as being lost causes so didnt bother helping them.

I didnt notice there is a differ of views with Enclave as you near the end of the game. Between **** and his highly ranked buddy. They have different views of taking care of the wasteland problem. But I wonder what Autum would have done if he...um....didnt get in that scuffle towards the end (damn spoilers lol)

Plus there was that sidestory with the THOSE! mission, about that Enclave deserter, so it seems not all of them are bllodthirsty psychos lol

[chaosapiant]

Yea, the leader of Fallout 2's Enclave was president Richardson. The enclave is almost a carbon copy of the combine from Half-life 2. They basically call their leaders "Presidents." Aside from what is in F3 and F2, little is known about them. We don't know if they have one huge base somewhere, or if they operate independantly is small groups. Since they are all called the "Enclave" however, it leads one to believe that we have yet to encounter the real bulk and source of Enclave power.

[evilneko]

So the Enclave, according to The Vault, originated from a group of politicos and military officers who hid on an oil rig during the war.

 

Is there any mention of East coast-based government in the previous Fallouts? Shouldn't the Enclave had had contact with them (and probably wiped them out, nullifying their claim to being the legitimate government)? Why had the Enclave not already arrived in DC long before the Lone Wanderer emerged from 101? Two hundred years is a long time.

 

Maybe they were there, and were driven out (by WHAT? Super Mutants? Ha!), only to very coincidentally return at a pivotal point in the main quest? Were they just hiding in their secret base in the wasteland all this time? Why would they bother hiding? Too many questions... there should've been Enclave troops on the ground from the start of the game. Hell there should've been at least one vault massacred by the Enclave (as seen in the opening of Fallout 2, which I watched, but didn't have the heart to play after my frustration with Fallout 1).

Although, maybe that vault could be 101 -- if you choose to tell them to let the Enclave in when you return there. You could say "yeah sure let 'em in" and then, if you return again, you'd find everyone dead. Maybe Butch or Amata survives and shows up at Megaton or Rivet City with tales of the horror.

 

 

Personally, giving the Enclave's starting location, I'd be more inclined to classify them as remnants of various state governments (California most prominently, obviously) than remnants of the Federal government. That said, they'd have no legitimate claim to Federal power, making them revolutionaries at best, terrorists at worst. Same for the Brotherhood really, who originated from a group of military officers. The Brotherhood though doesn't seem to have any designs on seizing power.

[Harabec Weathers]

You know, I can see why the Enclave was hiding in their secret base, lol even on very hard difficulty they're soldiers are total push overs haha