The Divide Expanded

[devinpatterson]

I was thinking of how Ulysses talked about how he missed the homeland the courier inadvertently destroyed, and I thought it would be neat if that homeland could be brought to life.

Absolutely, I'd love to see the courier complete the circle and atone for an ill fated delivery. We've been discussing it off and on since last year in the independent NV thread. Here are some posts (there are several pages of ideas starting on page 114, but there are also discussions before and after, scattered in the thread).

 

I think the biggest sticking point for us, was that several of the forums contributors simply didn't think you could have a viable community of any type. I understand that point of view. I mean you have winds that rip the flesh from people (as an example the marked me-but that was there from very early times, a OWB experiment), very powerful NPCs (marked men, even teh irradiated deathclaws, not to mention the overpowered tunnlers), radiation hazards etc.

 

But, I think a "type" of town could exist.....a sort of prospector town. Sure there won't be sunny little dales, with crops and happy fat brahmin, but occupying a military facility would provide a rivet city like setting. It would offer protection (even a tunnler isn't going to get through a hardened military base), food (probably warehouses size stacks of MRE in the commissary) and a safe place to buy and sell (commerce being the backbone of a town).

 

So what does the divide have to offer, what would make men risk their lives to be in such a inhospitable place. Military tech. Lots and lots of it to be recovered. Like the goldrush towns everything would flow from that one treasure (except instead of gold, the treasure is technology). Everything from hookers, to weaponsmith, to tech, to traders, to the caravaneers would all hinge on the prospector/adventures. These hardy souls woudln't be like a typical wasteland prospector, but made of far sterner stuff (to stand up to the divide). Some of them may even be survivors from the original settlement (although I suspect most were vaporized).

 

So I believe it's do-able.

 

In the thread I linked to, Darkus also had an alternate solution that I thought sounded very graphically interesting. Rooftop living. It has a drawback with that killer, knife like winds, but imagine how it could look. Rooftops connected with cables acting like suspension bridges, all linked like a web. Could be cool.

 

And it doesn't have to be one or the other, could be a mix of both.

 

This doesn't need to be a big mod. all I ask is for you to add some generic NPCs to the divide. like, Divide settlers, Divide merchants, Divide guardsmen (I think it would be neat if the guards had the riot armor.) stuff like that. preferably respawning. settlers and guard can sandbox, but I think the merchants should patrol the roads. they should probably get some guards.

Sure, but whether small or large I think you still need to hammer home a reasonable explanation of the how and why. How they are able to exist in what might be the deadliest land the courier has ever traversed and why would they want to. It will make the mod more immerse and believable. If one is going to take those steps, one might as well flesh out the mod as a whole. I think it's a better choice than dropping a wasteland town as a little transplant in a non lore, viable setting for settlers.

 

the absolute, bare mininum: create a couple dozen npcs labeled settler, give them some weapons, and place them around the divide.

I mean you could say there is a valley somewhere in teh divide that's arable, but I think it would be a huge stretch, lorewise. The divide is a killing field, I can't imagine settling it in the same way as the Mojave, IMHO

 

holy crap that sounds amazing. I hope that someone does this.

I know right? It's like a unfinished story, I'd like to see it come full circle.

[devinpatterson]

That's actually very interesting. If I remember correctly I was originally against a resettlement of the Divide but now that I think of it the first missile silo enters (where you find ED-E 2.0) and the Hopeville Missile Base West and East Entrances and the HQ would be the most plausible places for some small communities. The first missile silo would be the first place but after some fighting and aid from the player the settlers manage to push the Marked Men from the Missile Base and settle the area. I think it would also be interesting if the NCR tried to annex the towns once they become prosperous and the player can choose to kick them out with force, peacefully kick them out, decline but allow them an embassy and they become allies (this option would allow the NCR to open up trading with the settlements in exchange the NCR sends in troops to the Hopeville area to deal with the Marked Men once the Legion is no longer a threat), or sway the settlers to become NCR citizens. There could also be a quest that has the player go back to the Mojave too kill X amount of feral ghouls to the south of Primm in order too make trading easier, one excuse for not sending their own guards to deal with it is due to persistent attacks from Marked Men (which the player could deal with later on) and the NCR is too occupied by the Legion and Powder Gangers to send some squads into the area.

 

Also maybe later on the Silo could be turned into a type of market since its so close to the Mojave/Divide boarder.

[devinpatterson]

OK, thanks. Like I said, the town is optional. My vision is more like squatters hiding out along the road. they live in the dilapidated buildings. skirmishing with the marked men with primitive weapons. the merchants patrol the road, with riot armored guards. the guards themselves are placed in barracks and silo bases. this isn't as much a mod to build a city world space as to integrate additional NPCs into the game.

I wouldn't have any interest in that putting together something like that, partly due to lore and partly due to just squandering an opportunity for a great story line. On the upside though if it's just NPCs, without even dialog there's a good chance someone else might help you out (since it's so simple/easy).

 

Anyway I'll just post a few comments to sgtKraigO and then I'll stop bogarting the thread.

 

That's actually very interesting. If I remember correctly I was originally against a resettlement of the Divide but now that I think of it the first missile silo enters (where you find ED-E 2.0) and the Hopeville Missile Base West and East Entrances and the HQ would be the most plausible places for some small communities.

Exactly, it's the gateway to teh divide and arguably one of the safer parts of the region. It's fortified and makes a great home base due to it's proximity to both world spaces. And the idea of annexation (NCR) or subjugation (Legion) will be echos/reverberations of the past.

 

(this option would allow the NCR to open up trading with the settlements in exchange the NCR sends in troops to the Hopeville area to deal with the Marked Men once the Legion is no longer a threat

I think they will be doing trading with teh NCR (or at least in towns with a NCR prescence) regardless. I my opinion once they get tech back through to the Mojave it's likely that NCR will be their customers. The story of the divide's evolution lies in a sort of NCR greed of tech. They recovered an item from an enclave facilities with marking similar to teh divide and tasked the courier to deliver it with catastrophic results. They want military tech badly and I think they'd be willing to pay for it. Other factions may also barter for it too (gun runners for instance).

 

But yeah I think we're both on the same page here in general. It may even have a bit of a stalker vibe to it. Crazy adventures or mercs going into a forbidden zone to recover relics of great power, even though probably less than 1 in 10 stalkers will return from the zone.

 

Also maybe later on the Silo could be turned into a type of market since its so close to the Mojave/Divide boarder.

Yes that's what I'm thinking, something like rivet city. It has several parallels I'd like to exploit. It can cater to the prospector mercs in many ways (rooms, girls, food, maybe even a church), but it's lifeblood would be the bazaar where booty was sold, but also where the hardened adventures outfitted themselves to face the terrors of the divide (weapons, armor, key cards, codes, etc etc). And if they have the commissary (which should have been opened by the courier already) it becomes a pretty efficient system.

 

There is also a ton of possible adventures protecting, aiding, organizing the settlement. Rescuing lost parties. repealing invasions. Possibly even detonating nukes that are located near hotspots that the courier can't personally conquer with one man. It just goes on and on.

 

Anyway I'll make new thread, copy over these posts from you and I and copy over the info from the independent NV thread. Then we'll have something resembling an organized post.

[devinpatterson]

Also I'd like to follow up on the tunnler's implied threat. Primarily I'd like an adventure where the courier penetrates to the tunnlers lair into the colony hatchery and detonates a pre-war nuclear warhead buried there. A way of killing untold numbers of eggs and sealing the tunnlers back in their tunnels as they were before the accidental nuclear detonation the courier caused (once again an act of atonement, although not for the tunnlers :wink:

 

I'll copy the stuff from the independent NV thread later.

[sgtKraigO]

That sounds like good way of doing it. I could see a few quests that would have the player go and hunt some of them to lower their numbers. As well you may see hunters in the Divide stalking after Tunnlers. It would be interesting if the leader of a hunters guild or the most experienced and popular hunter contacts the player and asks them to deal with them for good because they see how big of a threat they really are but no one will listen.

[Nexusaurus]

I think that this thread is more likely to have success. you guys seem to know what your doing more than I do, so I'll leave it to you guys.

I did notice you said I needed a storyline for my version, and I do think I had one. I would just like the opinion of a veteran fallout modder to know if this is doable or possible with the lore.

 

I'll do my best to summarize my lore.

 

My settlers are basically a splinter group of the NCR. they were dissatisfied with the Bear's policies, and left to colonize one of the most inhospitable areas of the wasteland. they have taken one of the symbols of the old world (the one star flag), and the armor as a uniform (all the variations of the riot armor.). The settlers haven't created a new town, but have occupied existing building and taken control. I think the best camps would be empty buildings with no enemies. just set them to sandbox and boom, a small settlement has been founded. the settlers whose homes are open to the outside will have a hard time surviving, so maybe one or two Divide Guards could be stationed there. and this isn't Goodsprings. there aren't any farms. the people are hard bitten scavengers, who don't bother with things like farming. they mostly survive off MREs, scavenged food, what those commissary terminal give them, and what Mojave merchants manage to get to them. These people live here out of necessity and their own conviction. Conviction can only go so far, however, and the creation of the Divide Defense Corps was necessary to keep the peace. Since they are ex-NCR, they know their way around high technology, and have secretly taken control of some of the short range missile silos, to use as a secret weapon if invaded. this would explain all the Divide Guards in the silos. The merchant caravans seem to be one of the most interesting features to me. due to the swarms of monsters, especially tunnelers, any small caravan would be killed. I think 3 or three large caravans, with several brahmins, a few merchants, and about four Divide Soldiers would cut it. Basically, in terms of tech, they are between NCR and BoS, but have the smallest amount of territory. So, depending on your worldview, they are either a plucky young nation carving out a name for themselves, or a nest of dangerous criminals with access to powerful weapons.

And, their glorious leader:

 

The general.

He would be situated in the farthest outpost from the entrance, the capital of the Colonies. He would certainly be an interesting character.

The General would not hesitate to use force. The DDC (Divide Defense Corps) is frequently deployed against any internal threat. However, he is willing to listen to envoys and negotiate a treaty. he has learned, through hard hearned experience, that a swift military response is the only way to survive in the divide, and is still adjusting to the intricacies of the rest of the wasteland. he represents the shifts the whole nation is going through, and embodies the spirit of the United Divide Colonies (UDC). If someone download this mod, I assume they do so with the intent to join this budding country, as such, I have a basic role planned out for them. Having lived in the wastes for a long time, they are most suited to spread the influence of the United Divide Colonies (UDC). Will you be a diplomat or a conqueror?

Will you be a single envoy of part of an invasion force? Will you embrace the new cultures of the wastelands or will you just kill everything in accordance with the old traditions of the new nation?

I think that the story would be spread out in tapes and notes across the divide.

of course, your ideas are just as good, or probably better, given that you have more experience with the lore.

I'm thinking more and more that your mod is more likely to be acted upon, so maybe mine could be compatible with yours, but as a much smaller faction inhabiting only a few places.

anyway, good luck!

Edited March 17, 2014 by Nexusaurus

[sgtKraigO]

I like your idea, I'm just trying to expand on it. I like the idea of captured missile silos, it would make them a force to be reckoned with, but I would like too see them not use them against outside targets for fear of retaliation and because they would rather have peace and trade than fight. As for the ex-NCR members, it would definitely work well with the my idea of the NCR trying to annex them. They would harbor some mistrust towards them and possibly some hatred, but that doesn't necessarily mean they wouldn't ally with their former government if it meant independence and protection from the Legion. But their underlying mistrust/hatred for the NCR could also be exploited by the Legion given a chance.

 

As for a General leading the communities I'm not in favour. I would rather see him in charge of the DDC while having a peaceful president in charge (I would just rather have a peaceful faction rather than one who's militaristic since the game has enough of them already. This could also cause some tension between the 2 and open up for some interesting missions.

 

My idea of the general would be a former resident of Hopeville only surviving due to enlisting with the NCR Rangers and climbed up the ranks fairly quickly and became a leader of an experienced squad. He was deployed to the Mojave and so that would explain how he survived the destruction of his home town, but it was kept secret from him for unknown reasons when it was destroyed (this would cause him to have some hate for the NCR and give him a reason to leave them). He traveled a bit and found others who mistrusted the NCR, this is around the time he met the soon to be president. The president decided that they could split from the NCR and live on their own. The general knew the Divide would be a place where the NCR wouldn't bother them and thought he could become the leader of the new faction since he has military training and knowledge of the land, but almost everyone else thought it would be better to have someone who could manage trade treaties, come up with laws, etc. etc. rather than a shoot first, ask questions later type of person. This would create some drama within and when another faction tries too create a trade deal it would also cause some drama that the player could sort out.

 

Of course this would be more time consuming to create compared to your but I think it would open up the possibilities of more quests.

[devinpatterson]

As well you may see hunters in the Divide stalking after Tunnlers. It would be interesting if the leader of a hunters guild or the most experienced and popular hunter contacts the player and asks them to deal with them for good because they see how big of a threat they really are but no one will listen.

I like the idea of tunnler hunters, evokes an image of some pretty serious bad*sses. Since tunnlers are abominations the hunters could have special equipment like flare guns etc.

[Nexusaurus]

Wow, these ideas seem really cool

 

 

 

 

I like your idea, I'm just trying to expand on it. I like the idea of captured missile silos, it would make them a force to be reckoned with, but I would like too see them not use them against outside targets for fear of retaliation and because they would rather have peace and trade than fight. As for the ex-NCR members, it would definitely work well with the my idea of the NCR trying to annex them. They would harbor some mistrust towards them and possibly some hatred, but that doesn't necessarily mean they wouldn't ally with their former government if it meant independence and protection from the Legion. But their underlying mistrust/hatred for the NCR could also be exploited by the Legion given a chance.

 

As for a General leading the communities I'm not in favour. I would rather see him in charge of the DDC while having a peaceful president in charge (I would just rather have a peaceful faction rather than one who's militaristic since the game has enough of them already. This could also cause some tension between the 2 and open up for some interesting missions.

 

 

Of course this would be more time consuming to create compared to your but I think it would open up the possibilities of more quests.

 

I think you are right about the general. A peaceful leader and a general vying for power would make a more interesting story.

 

But I think I may not have been clear enough on my description of him. He is a general, and is used to acting like one, but he is more than that. for the first time in his country's history, he is opening his borders to the other countries in the wasteland, even the factions he may not agree with. he is trying to get over the militaristic traditions of the past and gain the respect of the other factions by not being another mindless warlord. I think the most opposition would be from his sub generals, who prefer the olden days when the military was in full control. he is not a militaristic warlord, but a progressive, adaptable man who genuinely cares about his people. Of course, we could add an option for the player to join a coup and start another dictatorship, just for the sake of diversity.

[sgtKraigO]

This is a new community though, if they had closed their borders they wouldn't survive in the Divide. Sure they have weapons, armour, and MREs too eat but they lack clean water (If I remember correctly the Divide has no water at all). So they would have to continue trading with Goodsprings and other places near by for water.