Communism v. Socialism v. Capitalism v. Feudalism

[AncientSpaceAeon]

I'm simply suggesting a poll.

[Christine777]

Oh yes, a poll would be better. And please include this one in the poll :teehee: - The Combined Sytem.

 

I think no one among the four is really qualified to take the floor. And I do believe that if one among them is given a chance to dominate among the rest, a monster will be created, which later on will dominate even the whole system it oath to serve.

 

I still go with the contention that they should be equitably combined. Perhaps through this, there will be balance. In balance, I mean, a self checking system that can accommodate not only single aspect/need of the society but a variety of those aspects/needs.

 

Allow me to give these four a simple definition:

 

Socialism

– economic and social system under which essential industries and social services are publicly and cooperatively owned and democratically controlled with a view to equal opportunity and equal benefit for all. (Microsoft ® Encarta ® 2009. ©)

 

Communism

- a theory and system of social and political organization that holds the idea of a society based on common ownership of property and wealth. (Microsoft ® Encarta ® 2009. ©)

 

Capitalism

- economic system in which private individuals and business firms carry on the production and exchange of goods and services through a complex network of prices and markets. . (Microsoft ® Encarta ® 2009. ©)

 

Feudalism

- contractual system of political and military relationships existing among members of the nobility in Western Europe during the High Middle Ages. It was characterized by the granting of fiefs, chiefly in the form of land and labor, in return for political and military services - a contract sealed by oaths of homage and fealty (fidelity). . (Microsoft ® Encarta ® 2009. ©)

 

As you may have notice, there is always good in each and every one of them. Why don’t we put them together and take the better part of it. :thumbsup:

 

I have this weird (if not stupid) suggestion.

With these definitions allow me to coalesced things in order to create a New System:

 

The Combined System

- An economic and social system wherein basically most industries and social services are publicly and cooperatively owned (Socialism), but also allowing private individuals and business firms to carry on the production and exchange of goods and services through a complex network of prices and markets (Capitalism). And not denying the rights of granted fiefs to some nobles but enforcing them to a contract (sealed) for military, economic and social service to their country (Feudalism). Since every citizen is an essential part of society, the notion of a society based on common ownership of property and wealth is implied (Communism).

 

PS:

Re-editing is allowed. We can cancel any of the four which we think would not do any benefit to the whole. (e.g. Feudalism)

[Maxwell the Fool]

I will NOT be adding a pole as this is a debate. We're not trying to decide on the best system, nor are we trying to build another system, nor trying to create a super-country. We're just trying to have a discussion, and creating a pole would completely defeat the purpose; people would vote without reading the thread (just as some people posted without reading the OP near the start of this thread.....). It would be useless to add a new, entirely fictitious system to the options as that would off an "easy way out." The point is to pick something with flaws that you know and debate it amongst the other members of the forums, NOT change the opinions of others (a useless endeavor), NOT creating a new system (unless you get VERY specific as to the various pieces of legislation necessary, and give something tangible to debate against).

 

@Maharg: Sorry for misunderstanding you, not very use to this whole forum thing yet..... It's hard to tell what people mean when they have no inflection.

The idea behind Capitalism IS a completely free market, whether or not governments hold to that is irrelevant (just as whether or not governments hold to feudalism is irrelevant). I'll name the book hear and now, I simply did not want the title to undermine the meaning of the concept. Please refrain from any Ad Hominem attacks against the author, as she is not someone I always agree with, it's simply helpful to understand the principal of "good greed" in this particular debate. Atlas Shrugged, by Ayn Rand.

[Christine777]

@ Maxwell

 

To you as the author of this thread, I guess I owe you an apology.

Sorry for my useless adding "a new, entirely fictitious system to the options". (I'm presumming you're refering to me. :sweat:

 

I just can't help it, seeing that I can't favor any of them standing alone.

 

Let's go back to your thread. :sleep:

[Maxwell the Fool]

Thank you very much, I simply don't feel that the purpose of the thread would be served through a non-extant system being added, as the particulars of it would be different in everyone's mind, and even the generalizations and basic philosophy would be dubious at best. I feel that adding a pole would simply cheapen the thread, as someone would just pick one without reading the debate on that particular one.

[ginnyfizz]

There are some truly excellent points being made here. I am myself inclined towards capitalism, but as some of you have already pointed out, there are different shades of capitalism. Indeed, the banking crisis is a perfect example of what happens when cracks appear in the capitalist system...the bankers stick out their hands for a government bail out. I must confess to some very near Commie thoughts when, at the same time as taking Government handouts, the banks were dishing out huge bonuses to their staff, under whose tenure gigantic losses had been made. In any other job, you would not get your bonus if you lost your employer money - more likely you would get fired.

 

To some extent, maybe all capitalism is and will be steered by the Government of the day, in any given country.

[Maxwell the Fool]

You see, those particular pro-communism/socialism thoughts (government regulation of bonuses by those receiving bailouts), would never have arisen if not for the handing out of those bailouts, which is, again, un-capitalist.

[Aurielius]

. I am myself inclined towards capitalism, but as some of you have already pointed out, there are different shades of capitalism.

To some extent, maybe all capitalism is and will be steered by the Government of the day, in any given country.

 

Hence my view of Mercantilism being the most prevalent of the economic systems. I prefer Mercantilism versus the rest , simply a pragmatic view of what is rather than what I would like to be. The problem of discussing economic methodology without the attendant governing political systems ,is that it has little real world context.

Just my two cents...

[Balagor]

In this world we have to day, and with the experience I have gained in life, I will stick with capitalism, despite

it´s flaws.

 

Feudalism needs no further attention. It´s an old middelage system, exchanging services within the nobel classes, leaving the peasants in hard work and pauvertry. We got rid of that system in 1848.

 

Communism has a problem that it is based on "the community" the individual counts less, thus conflicting with the well known Maslow's hierarchy of needs. An ideology that can only satisfy the first 2 level of the hierarchy of needs, is doomed to fail. True you will get perks, and a medal if you work hard for many years ( I am aware I am biased now).

Anyhow I have seen Israelian kibutzts, and other communists communities, ill working due to lack of personal commitment.

Last I have also seen that it is common with job rotations, to make people feel equal(nice idea), but very ineffective, because the manager IS better at her/his job and the carpenter/gardener also sure know how to do their jobs.

 

Socialism, a cousin to communism, but far more liberal. We have had that many times in DK. It works, but most not be exagerated. When we have had it it has been a mix of socialism and capitalism

 

Capitalism is the better choise I think. The donky needs a carrot in front of the nose to make it walk, and so do we. It seems that countries (postulate) with capitalism, are far more effective with everything from production, innovation, invent new things, cure diseases, blah, blah, blah.

 

Only thing none of them can is, share equaly with everybody, control greed, make a good healthcare system.

 

Sorry I brought politics into the economic models. But they go hand in hand, and can not be seperated.

[Maxwell the Fool]

No need to apologize.