Join Empire or Stormcloaks? My Thoughts

[Lachdonin]

Edit: And more of a Question- I find it odd, and probably you as well, that the Thalmor is almost not talked about in terms of 'losses' and Army size by the battle/The end of the war. Surely you do as well?

 

I am personally of the mind that there is something fishy going on in regard to what the Dominion actually suffered in the Great War. Their entire army in Cyrodiil was slaughtered to a man, and yet they still negotiated from a postion of remarkable strength. They were able to hold onto Hammerfell, fighting against the most gifted warriors on the continent, united for the first time in almost a thousand years, whome we know possess both airships and gunpowder... And it seems they still have troops and mages aplenty to serve as escorts for dignitaries.

 

It's almost like the Dominion lost nothing of note.

[117649AR]

At least lore wise, the Dominion is incredibly powerful due to the fact that the Summerset Isles have always been a center of magical advancement, and the Altmer accordingly count many incredibly powerful mages among them. Many, if not most, sources that describe Aldmeri military actions tend to mention even if only in passing their use of magic as a force multiplier. It does make sense that a soldier who can increase the strength of his armour, summon ethereal weapons from Oblivion, heal his wounds, block offensive spells, and summon fire, lightning, or frost, among other magical skills, has a significant advantage over a soldier who, while very well trained in the use of contemporary weapons such as swords, bows, and polearms, possesses little magical prowess. While the Legion does employ battlemages, they are not very many in number, whereas (if Skyrim's gameplay has any bearing) all Dominion forces from the foot infantry to the wizards have at least a basic array of offensive/defensive spells. Given the size of the Empire and the slower birth rate/maturation rate of Mer, I would say that the Legion likely outnumbered the Aldmeri Army, but the quality of their troops on a man-to-man basis was far greater if only by virtue of magic. As for their losses in the Great War, I think it's fair to say that they suffered a considerable loss with the decimation of Lord Naarifin and Lady Arannelya's hosts, still had enough troops that it could continue inconclusive warfare, and knew that the Empire could not strike the Summerset Isles. The Thalmor want nothing less than the destruction of mankind in its entirety, so if they believed they had a reasonable chance of victory, I believe they would not have agreed to the Concordat and simply continued the war. Further things for consideration, it's also important to note that the Aldmeri Dominion possesses the most powerful Navy in Tamriel, perhaps on all of Nirn. Their ships are described as being incredibly well armed and armoured with advanced design, and there are likely a large number due to the fact that the Altmer depend on ships very frequenty given their position in the Isles.

 

That said, it is important to always keep in mind when considering the Civil War that the Thalmor are actively seeking the erasure of mankind from existence, both physically and metaphysically. While they hold power in the Aldmeri Dominion, mankind cannot know lasting peace; the Thalmor must be destroyed, or man as a race risks its own destruction. This is why the Civil War works to the advantage of the Dominion; no matter the outcome, whether it is an Imperial victory or a Stormcloak victory, the Civil War in Skyrim weakens humanity. An end to the conflict is not ideal obviously, as it may shift the attention of the Empire back to the Dominion, but regardless of which side claims victory, the fact remains that the Imperial Legion is much weaker than it was before the Civil War, and is set back even further in its recovery. Think of the post-Great War period as a Cold War of sorts between the Empire and the Aldmeri Dominion, both of whom are attempting to grow their military might as quickly as possible so that they may outpace the other. Both parties know that a coming war is inevitable, and seek to be the victor in that conflict. Thus, they do what they can to undermine the other. While we do not know much of the off-screen Imperial efforts to weaken the Dominion (though they are surely happening, as the one thing that both the Legion and the Stormcloaks hold in common aside the admiration of Tiber Septim is a great hatred for the Thalmor), we can see the Dominion's moves during the Civil War: Justiciars as Inquisition, executing, detaining, and torturing worshipers of Talos giving the Stormcloak Rebellion as their cause for intervention. They fan the flames of the War in order to further polarize Skyrim, and keep the Imperial Legion embroiled in a conflict that costs the Empire both men and coin. The Dominion is the greatest threat to Tamriel as it quite literally aims to destroy creation, and any event that causes the factions that could potentially oppose it to divide or fight one another is a defeat. The Empire is the greatest obstacle and greatest enemy to the Dominion, not only because it is largely comprised of men (although, as I said, it is incredibly racially diverse), but because it represents the only other faction that rivals the Dominion in military strength and political influence. Whether the Empire wins the Civil War or the Stormcloaks do, the Legion is still considerably weakened: Skyrim is thus a Thalmor victory. Siding with the Empire and killing Ulfric Stormcloak is not the best solution obviously, as the most ideal solution would be peace without further bloodshed. However, given the circumstances and the fact that diplomatic solutions are impossible, the best choice for the survival of humanity is the Empire.

[ZerglingEXP397]

Literally nothing can be said against that- And I agree whole heartily with it. And you've actually convinced me otherwise either way- Both because my knowledge is little and as much as I researched I can't counter said explanation. Not to mention my side was more fo why they aren't as they are 'seen' as, not... Exactly why they were right per sey. Though I did try to justify why they should be.

 

Nonetheless, bravo sir. I have nothing more to offer or say.

[ThrillaWhale]

Empire. Always the Empire.

[MidbossVyers]

The Empire right now is pretty crumbling. It's really a question of whether you want to restore it internally or build anew externally. Even my characters who end up joining the Legion tend to "serve the Empire" in the following way:

[117649AR]

The primary issue being that it still represents the last best hope for defeat of the Aldmeri Dominion. Of course the Empire as a whole is a shell of its former self and must be reformed if not entirely rebuilt to more fully benefit Tamriel, but as it stands this cannot happen while the "Cold War" with the Dominion continues. Any Imperial reformation would have to happen after the Dominion is defeated, otherwise it simply presents an opportunity for the Thalmor to press the advantage.

[Lachdonin]

It's also worth noting that the Empire managed to beat the Dominion on the field. Regardless of the Concordant, or the loss of Hammerfell (the forces therein didn't really contribute much... In fact, Hammerfell seemed to be reliant on former legionaires left there from the Great War) the Empire drove the Dominion out of Cyrodiil. It fought from a crushing defeat and the back-est foot to grind the war to a stalemate.

 

For all the claims that the Stormcloaks and Skyrim COULD stand against the Dominion, the Empire HAS. Unprepared, caught totally off guard, and with no real preparation to speak of, they still managed a draw. They may not have won, but they did a hell of a lot better than could reasonably have been expected under the circumstances.

 

There's considerably less supposition and 'what if' involved in considering what the Empire could acomplish now that it is prepared, than in considering what the Stormcloaks could do.

[117649AR]

Not to mention the fact that the Empire had suffered a great deal during the Oblivion Crisis (which was centered in Cyrodiil) and the post-Septim succession wars, from which the Medes emerged victorious.

[MidbossVyers]

Well, relatively everyone loves the Septims (even the Stormcloaks maintain the Septim currency after winning the Civil War), but much less people love the Medes. In fact, both sides seem to fight for what they think Tiber Septim would want.

[117649AR]

Of course the Medes are no Tiber Septim, but for what it's worth they have been keeping the Empire together through very turbulent times. Titus Mede I defeated all opposition and kept the Empire intact through the conflict of succession in the wake of the Septim Dynasty's end, while Titus Mede II led the Legions from a crushing defeat to a grinding stalemate in the Great War, and had managed to keep the Civil War in Skyrim from spiraling out of control prior to the events of TES V. In fact, before Alduin's intervention, it does seem that the Civil War was almost coming to a close with the capture of Ulfric Stormcloak.