Random, erratic crashes?

[SkullKnight]

Ive installed a lot of the optimization and Ive looked over the stabilization stuff. It seems like that crash was just a freak accident because I managed to run the game fine afterward. However I eventually crashed due to memory capping out (it was at 1.7 GB). Is there any way to reduce the occurrence of these crashes without having a 64 bit OS and 4 GB RAM (needed for LAA patch)?

[Tomlong54210]

No. There is not. Allowing an application on a 32-bit OS to have more memory is not safe, and that makes me hesitate to mention that patch at all (but it is a valid solution for the right system.) Other things that extend the life of the game are good buffer management mods. If you have Streamline and OSR, you cannot do any better. Have you tried a different heap mode with OSR? If the heap mode is set to 0, you are not yet taking full advantage of that mod. Read the Read Me and the official thread to make sure you do not seriously mess up any of the settings. That mod operates at a lower level where things really can go wrong. Your computer should not break or anything, but you may have to restart your computer and change the settings back. Use a semicolon to comment out the default when you change something, if those comments are not already there.

 

A 32-bit OS is limited to 4GB of physical address space, and, by default, the system really only spares you 3.5GB, saving some space for vital processes. You can turn a certain flag off to get the full 4GB, but that will not help Oblivion from being limited to (theoretically) 2GB. Now, imagine that you have flagged this program to use more than 2GB. Your system's processes are then pushed back to no more than half the space they once had, and that is moving into dangerous territory.

 

Good practice (or safer practice) would be to gauge when you are hitting your memory ceiling. Record the time somewhere if you need to, and then start quitting before your time is up. That's healthier for your computer, your INI settings will be saved, etc.

[SkullKnight]

Alright, Im gonna try replacing the heap with one of the custom ones and Im enabling profiling so I can see how well it does. I may choose to switch heaps now and then and compare the results. Supposedly this should make stuff run better...

[Tomlong54210]

  On 5/23/2010 at 6:58 PM, SkullKnight said:

Alright, Im gonna try replacing the heap with one of the custom ones and Im enabling profiling so I can see how well it does. I may choose to switch heaps now and then and compare the results. Supposedly this should make stuff run better...

Certain heaps increase instability for certain systems. You should definitely do extended comparison tests. See which heap allows you the most time before crashing. Then you should try what I mentioned earlier, figuring out what your average play time is limited to in order to avoid crashes as much as possible.

[SkullKnight]

D: I dont have any idea what any of this stuff means:

 

 

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Critical Sections mode 2 (improve fairness):

MemoryHeap Optimization Mode 1: attempting to replace the Oblivion heap manager with FastMM4 / BorlndMM.dll

MemoryHeap profiling enabled

hook mode 1: using main GetTickCount call

timeBeginPeriod: 0 -> 1

Heap Initialization (268435456, 0)

CS 0x00B32B80 (caller 0x9D7E7A, path 0, spin1000), by-object, set to mode 3

CS 0x00B32B80 (caller 0x9D7E7A, path 0, spin1000), by-object, set to spin 1500

CS 0x02899F00 (caller 0x701748, path 0, spin1000), by-caller, set to mode 5

Memory Performance: 2 M ops, 68 B ticks, -22 worst ms, 14536 avg ns

Memory Performance: 2 M ops, 68 B ticks, -22 worst ms, 11506 avg ns

Memory Performance: 4 M ops, 69 B ticks, -21 worst ms, 5973 avg ns

initialize2() running in thread 1770, renderer at 02899D80

Memory Performance: 6 M ops, 69 B ticks, -24 worst ms, 4861 avg ns

Memory Performance: 8 M ops, 69 B ticks, -24 worst ms, 3854 avg ns

Memory Performance: 10 M ops, 70 B ticks, -24 worst ms, 3291 avg ns

Memory Performance: 10 M ops, 138 B ticks, -27 worst ms, 6847 avg ns

Memory Performance: 10 M ops, 207 B ticks, -27 worst ms, 10262 avg ns

Memory Performance: 11 M ops, 207 B ticks, -27 worst ms, 9969 avg ns

Memory Performance: 11 M ops, 276 B ticks, -27 worst ms, 12662 avg ns

Memory Performance: 11 M ops, 276 B ticks, -27 worst ms, 12333 avg ns

Memory Performance: 12 M ops, 277 B ticks, -27 worst ms, 11826 avg ns

Memory Performance: 13 M ops, 277 B ticks, -26 worst ms, 10619 avg ns

Memory Performance: 14 M ops, 277 B ticks, -25 worst ms, 9190 avg ns

Memory Performance: 16 M ops, 277 B ticks, -24 worst ms, 7835 avg ns

Memory Performance: 18 M ops, 278 B ticks, -23 worst ms, 6915 avg ns

Memory Performance: 19 M ops, 346 B ticks, -23 worst ms, 8114 avg ns

Memory Performance: 19 M ops, 347 B ticks, -22 worst ms, 7834 avg ns

Memory Performance: 19 M ops, 415 B ticks, -22 worst ms, 9344 avg ns

Memory Performance: 19 M ops, 484 B ticks, -22 worst ms, 10881 avg ns

Memory Performance: 20 M ops, 484 B ticks, -12 worst ms, 10800 avg ns

Memory Performance: 20 M ops, 484 B ticks, -12 worst ms, 10426 avg ns

Memory Performance: 21 M ops, 553 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 11257 avg ns

Memory Performance: 22 M ops, 553 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 10928 avg ns

Memory Performance: 24 M ops, 554 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 9998 avg ns

Memory Performance: 25 M ops, 622 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 10827 avg ns

Memory Performance: 25 M ops, 691 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 12010 avg ns

Memory Performance: 25 M ops, 760 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 13194 avg ns

Memory Performance: 25 M ops, 828 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 14381 avg ns

Memory Performance: 25 M ops, 897 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 15508 avg ns

Memory Performance: 26 M ops, 966 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 16413 avg ns

Memory Performance: 27 M ops, 966 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 15817 avg ns

Memory Performance: 28 M ops, 966 B ticks, -11 worst ms, 15166 avg ns

Memory Performance: 28 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16002 avg ns

Memory Performance: 29 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16419 avg ns

Memory Performance: 30 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17226 avg ns

Memory Performance: 31 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16654 avg ns

Memory Performance: 32 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16640 avg ns

Memory Performance: 33 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16274 avg ns

Memory Performance: 34 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16433 avg ns

Memory Performance: 35 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16130 avg ns

Memory Performance: 36 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15218 avg ns

Memory Performance: 36 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16016 avg ns

Memory Performance: 37 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15825 avg ns

Memory Performance: 37 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16375 avg ns

Memory Performance: 37 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16317 avg ns

Memory Performance: 38 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16888 avg ns

Memory Performance: 39 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16654 avg ns

Memory Performance: 39 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17002 avg ns

Memory Performance: 40 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16641 avg ns

Memory Performance: 41 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17107 avg ns

Memory Performance: 41 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17563 avg ns

Memory Performance: 42 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17170 avg ns

Memory Performance: 43 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16627 avg ns

Memory Performance: 45 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16811 avg ns

Memory Performance: 45 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16656 avg ns

Memory Performance: 47 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16034 avg ns

Memory Performance: 48 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15437 avg ns

Memory Performance: 49 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15772 avg ns

Memory Performance: 50 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15478 avg ns

Memory Performance: 51 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15864 avg ns

Memory Performance: 52 M ops, 1 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15598 avg ns

Memory Performance: 53 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15826 avg ns

Memory Performance: 53 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16247 avg ns

Memory Performance: 54 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16543 avg ns

Memory Performance: 55 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16377 avg ns

Memory Performance: 56 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16408 avg ns

Memory Performance: 57 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16247 avg ns

Memory Performance: 58 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16269 avg ns

Memory Performance: 59 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16194 avg ns

Memory Performance: 60 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15860 avg ns

Memory Performance: 61 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15469 avg ns

Memory Performance: 62 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15243 avg ns

Memory Performance: 64 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 14885 avg ns

Memory Performance: 64 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15288 avg ns

Memory Performance: 64 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15629 avg ns

Memory Performance: 64 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15596 avg ns

Memory Performance: 64 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16019 avg ns

Memory Performance: 65 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16297 avg ns

Memory Performance: 66 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16123 avg ns

Memory Performance: 67 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16323 avg ns

Memory Performance: 67 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16626 avg ns

Memory Performance: 68 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16920 avg ns

Memory Performance: 68 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16786 avg ns

Memory Performance: 69 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16554 avg ns

Memory Performance: 70 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16327 avg ns

Memory Performance: 70 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16599 avg ns

Memory Performance: 71 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16470 avg ns

Memory Performance: 72 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16125 avg ns

Memory Performance: 73 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16392 avg ns

Memory Performance: 73 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16723 avg ns

Memory Performance: 73 M ops, 2 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16692 avg ns

Memory Performance: 74 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17041 avg ns

Memory Performance: 75 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16736 avg ns

Memory Performance: 77 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16358 avg ns

Memory Performance: 78 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16075 avg ns

Memory Performance: 79 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16132 avg ns

Memory Performance: 80 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 15991 avg ns

Memory Performance: 80 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16305 avg ns

Memory Performance: 80 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16276 avg ns

Memory Performance: 81 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16490 avg ns

Memory Performance: 81 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16812 avg ns

Memory Performance: 82 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16508 avg ns

Memory Performance: 83 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16820 avg ns

Memory Performance: 84 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16632 avg ns

Memory Performance: 84 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16923 avg ns

Memory Performance: 84 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17125 avg ns

Memory Performance: 85 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17015 avg ns

Memory Performance: 86 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16778 avg ns

Memory Performance: 86 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17096 avg ns

Memory Performance: 87 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16861 avg ns

Memory Performance: 88 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17091 avg ns

Memory Performance: 88 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17332 avg ns

Memory Performance: 89 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17228 avg ns

Memory Performance: 89 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17423 avg ns

Memory Performance: 91 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17158 avg ns

Memory Performance: 91 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17310 avg ns

Memory Performance: 92 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17480 avg ns

Memory Performance: 93 M ops, 3 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17356 avg ns

Memory Performance: 94 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17505 avg ns

Memory Performance: 94 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17359 avg ns

Memory Performance: 95 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17191 avg ns

Memory Performance: 96 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17301 avg ns

Memory Performance: 96 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17579 avg ns

Memory Performance: 98 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17635 avg ns

Memory Performance: 98 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17564 avg ns

Memory Performance: 98 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17807 avg ns

Memory Performance: 98 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17783 avg ns

Memory Performance: 99 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17668 avg ns

Memory Performance: 100 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17782 avg ns

Memory Performance: 101 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17666 avg ns

Memory Performance: 102 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17478 avg ns

Memory Performance: 103 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17321 avg ns

Memory Performance: 105 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17011 avg ns

Memory Performance: 106 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16815 avg ns

Memory Performance: 106 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17074 avg ns

Memory Performance: 106 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17052 avg ns

Memory Performance: 107 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 16947 avg ns

Memory Performance: 108 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17028 avg ns

Memory Performance: 108 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17256 avg ns

Memory Performance: 109 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17213 avg ns

Memory Performance: 109 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17419 avg ns

Memory Performance: 110 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17271 avg ns

Memory Performance: 111 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17344 avg ns

Memory Performance: 111 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17323 avg ns

Memory Performance: 112 M ops, 4 T ticks, -11 worst ms, 17114 avg ns

Memory Performance: 114 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16873 avg ns

Memory Performance: 115 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16713 avg ns

Memory Performance: 116 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16895 avg ns

Memory Performance: 116 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 17089 avg ns

Memory Performance: 117 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16899 avg ns

Memory Performance: 117 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 17096 avg ns

Memory Performance: 119 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16865 avg ns

Memory Performance: 120 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16668 avg ns

Memory Performance: 121 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16811 avg ns

Memory Performance: 122 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16700 avg ns

Memory Performance: 123 M ops, 4 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16498 avg ns

Memory Performance: 124 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16640 avg ns

Memory Performance: 125 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16527 avg ns

Memory Performance: 126 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16334 avg ns

Memory Performance: 127 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16517 avg ns

Memory Performance: 127 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16500 avg ns

Memory Performance: 128 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16550 avg ns

Memory Performance: 129 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16498 avg ns

Memory Performance: 129 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16618 avg ns

Memory Performance: 130 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16539 avg ns

Memory Performance: 132 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16395 avg ns

Memory Performance: 132 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16594 avg ns

Memory Performance: 132 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16804 avg ns

Memory Performance: 133 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16937 avg ns

Memory Performance: 133 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 17115 avg ns

Memory Performance: 133 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 17098 avg ns

Memory Performance: 134 M ops, 5 T ticks, -10 worst ms, 16941 avg ns

 

 

 

EDIT: Also, I noticed in the readme that it says that the default spin value provided for critical sections (1000) may be a bit small, and the ideal value increases with the number of cores/hardware threads. Since I have a quad-core computer, should I increase this? And if so, what would be a reasonable amount to increase it to?

[Tomlong54210]

I would not mess with that at this point. Just deal with the heap settings. If you want to try tweaking other things, you should browse the official thread on the BethSoft forum.

[SkullKnight]

I tried some of the changes listed in the readme's common tweaks. The tweaks were suppressing the optional critical section and dynamic hashtable resizing. Both resulted in crashes way before the memory cap was reached (both around 1.2 GB).

 

As for the spell hostility thing, Im pretty sure some part of the Deadly Reflex scripting is causing it. Sometimes casting any kind of spell while facing an NPC causes their Deadly Reflex combat script to run. Ive had NPCs duck and shield bash me when I casted Minor Heal Wounds while facing them. In IC market recently, I got arrested with a 40 gold bounty after casting Minor Heal Wounds "at" someone.

 

And...is there any way to minimize Oblivion? I can minimize other fullscreen games Ive played, but not Oblivion for some reason.

 

I searched the site and found a mod called "3gb Enabler". Apparently its just LAA patch with instructions to make it work on 32 OS. Grrr...need to upgrade my RAM...Or is there a way to make it allocate 2.5/0.5 so it still stays within 3 GB?

[Tomlong54210]

No. You should not use that patch without 4GB. Do you understand that the system needs space to run system processes? Using that tweak is definitely not recommended for users that do not know what they are doing. As I said, you should probably not mess with anything in OSR other than the Read Me. If you have the DR hotfix installed, I have nothing more to say about DR. I can CTRL+ALT+DELETE out of Oblivion, but minimizing is risky regardless. This is a huge application when modded. Do not go overboard with the tweaking, or you will seriously mess up your machine.

[SkullKnight]

Ok lol, Ill leave it with the heap tweak and stop.

 

Another thing, Streamline is ignoring part of my sl.ini. None of the changes I make in the miscellaneous section are taking effect. I have to actually access the main menu in-game to change them.

[Tomlong54210]

Remember, you have to reinitialize SL in game when you make changes with SL loaded. You have to use the Init from INI command...