Unexplained UFO over China

[brokenergy]

Yep Ufology is a real subject and you can get a degree of Ufology at the Universality of Melbourne. It's true

[Pyrosocial]

They use their own people as a sheild. how sickening.

Like i said though, it has to be military or the government would have had fighters on its arse. only thing that makes sense to me anyway.

 

Perhaps this vapor trail, could it be a new form of fuel they were testing?

[Pushkatu]

It's funny how we all debate here, if it's this or if it's that. Thing is we'll never know, unless they want us to. Even if it was an alien UFO, or just a simple military test of sorts, as long as they want they can keep these kind of things way down underground. Remember how many secret experiments where found after the World Wars, things that socked a whole world? Do you think in our days they don't hide things from us, or run secret experiments? I'd say they have at least twice as many as before and with the technology we have, makes you wonder....:unsure: Edited July 24, 2010 by Pushkatu

[Vindekarr]

Its not as laughable as you think.

 

Novels dont get made by a guy in his mother's basement sitting down for a week and typing it up on a computer. They take years to write and design, and you've got to do quite a lot of research first if you want it to be beleivable. Including fringe science. Im no beleiver in UFOs, but you need a very very large general knowledge to be a successful fictional author, especialy if you're writing science fiction. Because if you're books pretend to be realistic, but have nothing to do with science-fact, then you'll be laughed at. The audience almost always knows more about just about everything than you do. So you have to treat them with respect, and assume they'll work out what you're on about with relatively little explaination.

 

Nothing in modern literature is original. Details may change, plot, place, character, but they all have key similar points. Likewise everything has an inspiration that causes it. So it really pays to look at all sorts of diverse stuff, you never know what you might be able to use or benefit from. For example StarGate, a very successful US/Canadian scifi series thats been going since the early 90s, has a lot of its basis in real world UFO sightings like roswell. If you want to be able to come up with a fictional world with any degree of realism, credibility and beleivebility, then you need to consult all sorts of strange sources and histories,

 

Other than that. I can assure you that the military DOES conduct all sorts of secret tests, and that you'd be amazed at what even non classified "find it on wikipedia" technology exists. Such as working laser weapons and railguns. Teleportation also exists in the real world, currently we've only been able to move single atoms, but it DOES exist. Knowing what sorts of classic science fiction fodder has made it into the world of reality. Its not much of a stretch to theorise that a nation with the resources and single minded government of China would be able to throw together their own methjet or some other high thrust alternative fuelr rocket or other futeristic flying machine,

[Thor.]

Geat Show, if you check my profile You'll see where my user name originated from.

 

Yes i agree 90% of ufo's are Stargate origin, that makes perfect since :laugh: :turned:

[Vagrant0]

The point I was trying to make about the contrails not making sense... is that they don't. I'm not a physicist or particularly versed in propulsion systems or aerodynamics, but it just doesn't look right from any standpoint of propulsion as we know it.

 

Where to start... How about the beginning. If you noticed, there's a trail leading back into the distance which is rather narrow, swerving, and has rather a rather specific stream of higher density. The more recent trails however are fanlike, wide, straight, and while it has some areas of greater density, it is mostly uniform along its width. The fact that this transition happens rather suddenly, without any disturbance in the pattern, or direction is very different from how any rocket propelled craft (of any substance) would behave. Although the widening trail leads back into the thicker one, the wider part does not follow a similar path, and still happens rather abruptly. All the way up until there's that "puff", the trail, continues to expand like a balloon, and keeps expanding until it is no longer in frame. This doesn't make much sense physically since propelled matter will normally lose velocity rather quickly (exponentially due to both friction with the surrounding air, and as gravity has an effect) as soon as it leaves the vessel. As the matter in question is clearly a substance which is light enough to stay airborn, it should not be able to produce a swath that wide unless it was really close to the viewer.. Close enough for example to not only be able to see the body of the object, but probably also make out any writing or other features on the object. Projecting a pattern like that, even if not doctored, would be entirely contrary to the very premise of rocket/jet propulsion, in that a more narrow the exit point, the more force, the more velocity. The angle of motion also does not match the angle of the propulsion, even when you factor in that whole bit of a shaky, grainy, image taken from a handheld camera. The fact that the object remains in focus the entire time while other objects move in and out of focus due to the shaking of the camera is also suspicious.

 

As for your whole rant on science and science fiction, you are forgetting the whole bit about how those popular things in science fiction are popular because they are part of the whole collective social consciousness. You can't have a US based series about aliens without even mentioning Roswell simply because; it would forsake a convenient premise which does not need to be explained, and leave UFO fans upset about their iconic setting not being included. Even in works of 'non-fiction' the same sorts of themes, locations, explanations, and forms are present, but only so long as that person is enclosed in that social consciousness bubble. While there are constants which exist cross time, culture, most of the important stuff gets lost between the Hollywood cliches. Unfortunately, most of the UFO fans out there care less about anything actually testable, and more about those themes and stuff which just make it interesting.

 

While science has proven some of those science fiction concepts to some form, again, this is mostly due to fans of the series or source getting physics degrees and wondering if they could actually ever make something like that, and if so, how. Some of it pans out (often because the writers or designers did their homework from the start), most of it doesn't. You don't ever hear about all the stuff that simply doesn't though, but nobody cares about that stuff, so it's just as well.

 

As for writing about UFOs and aliens, for every 1 person who is trying to be accurate and truthful, there are about a dozen who can't tell the difference between dreams, reality, and stuff they made up. And for every 1 person lost in their own imagination, there are about a dozen who don't even try to make sense in their delusions, wouldn't know reality if they were smacked upside the head with it several times. And then there are the batshit crazies. The problem however is that those accurate and truthful people not only listen to the other groups, but tend to believe a good portion of it, and start using some of those bits to explain things that they couldn't. This is not to say that secret tests aren't happening, or that there are not things flying around which cannot be classified, just that most of the stuff on the public end of things is utterly worthless from any logical standpoint.

Edited July 25, 2010 by Vagrant0

[Vindekarr]

Thats a good point.

 

Just keeping focus on an object doing mach three with a hand held camera is hard. doing it without wobbling and shaking is nearly impossible. Something really unusual MAY have happened here, but Im becoming increasingly suspicious of the images and video that are coming out about it. The first image I saw was a very onvious hoax, is called a long exposure shot, thats just a cheap camera trick that any amatuer cameraman can do that stretches out the object in focus into an odd distorted shape with massive montion blur. This itself is also starting to look a bit hoaxish because after looking at this on a better monitor it just doesnt really make sense. Firstly SCRAM engines have been around for ages, they're simple to use/build and they can send a similar size object to a lot higher speed for a lot less cost. So why would they bother with such a strange and dare I say pointless slower design that costs an enormous amount of money? And secondly, after viewing it in HD, Vagrant is right, the focus is very odd indeed.

 

Finaly, this isnt the time or the place for such a comment, but I'd like to ask you Thor, to please mind your own business. I dont appreciate being badgered about what I've studied. Its also a bit of a waste of chatter on your part acting all "oooh, kooky" about ufology because I've studied many stranger things than that. Writing requires study, folklore, world events, history, science, ect, its just part of the process. I'd wager if you looked at the educational CV of any major scifi author of the last 30 years you'd find all sorts of "oddity"

[Vagrant0]

That isn't mach 3, that isn't even mach 1. For it to be traveling that slowly on the horizon at mach 1, the trail would need to be several miles wide... which only makes that whole issue of pushing the propellant or whatever that distance even more questionable. But that kinda is the problem, the only thing we have to get a sense of scale here is speculation about just how far material can be pushed by momentum alone, and the speed at which it moves from one side of the horizon to the edge of whatever window the person taking the video was looking through. For something that relatively slow, it would either need to be something small and near, or something very far away. And if it were far away, you would probably have most of it obscured by haze, or a trail that stretches behind the billowing smokestacks in the distance. As the trail passes below and infront, it would mean that whatever it is, is smaller than those smoke stacks are wide. This bit of scale also helps explain the unusual trajectory of the object since it is passing toward and to the left of the viewer.

 

Or, we could simply go with the proven standpoint that the video is a fake done in photoshop, and leave it at that.

[Keanumoreira]

 

 

Im no beleiver in UFOs.

 

Not quite right. You mean you aren't a believer in aliens. Everybody has to believe in UFO's because they are unknown aircraft, so if its unknown then you have to believe it is an unidenified flying object right? Just pointing that out is all.

 

Anyway, this part is my opinion on a GENERAL point of view, not yours Vindekarr. I don't understand why people don't believe that aliens can't visit our planet. Seriously, that's absurd. People argue with me all the time that it can't happen, and that's not true. I would like to remind these people just how enourmous our universe is compared to our little world; life exsists not only here but elsewhere. Your going to tell me that there can't be other Earths out there, which BTW, isn't a hard goldielox planet to forge? Yeah, right. Sooner or later, intelligent life, including us, WILL go intergalactic. People agree we will, yet they say aliens can't or haven't done it already? How? Whether you want to believe in it or not, aliens exsist. The Catholic Church itself broke an over two thousand year old belief and tradition, and agreed on the possiblity that life could very well not be unique to Earth. Not only that, they found evidence of fossilized microbes on Mars, and we all know water once flowed on its surface. THIS IS A FACT, IT HAS BEEN PROVEN. And what comes with water? Life. Mars also shows evidence of a once functioning core, atmosphere, and wind system, and how could you possibly deny that? Now, I don't believe this video depicts an alien aircraft, but you can't honestly sit down, look me in the eye, and say that aliens don't exsist, because nature will just laugh in your face.

[Vagrant0]

While bacterial life may be all well and good, the chances of life not only evolving on a planet that can support life for a prolonged period of time is rather low, even when you consider the formulas related to the number of such planets existing. Furthermore, the chance of that life not only evolving to a state of organized societies, but also one which has managed to forgo killing itself or its planet before developing space travel enough to colonize another planet is extremely low. Then the chance that that space-faring race is advanced enough, physically, culturally, and technologically, to travel to another star is exceptionally low. Then the chance that such a race was within several thousand lightyears of Earth, and just happened to be going in this direction just to poke some ants with a stick (abduct, or otherwise study humans) is lower still. Then the chance that there was not just one such race within several thousand light years coming around to poke ants with sticks, but that there are dozens of such races (each with their own interests, technology, shapes, crafts, systems), is far lower still. Now, logically speaking, if all of this were happening in our corner of the galaxy, not only would there be more actual evidence of this sort of thing just lying around, but we also wouldn't be able to look out into space or listen for signals without seeing something. Furthermore, given the rather chaotic debris field that circles our planet, any craft which might be moving through that field would undoubtedly be hitting or otherwise disturbing some of the several million pieces of junk up there that are constantly being tracked.

 

This is not to say that life may not exist somewhere out there, just that the degree to which aliens are claimed to be among us is largely unfounded by any evidence or logic. Even if there was a technologically capable race within 50 lightyears of Earth, they would only just now be able to detect us beyond being just another planet around another star, and would likely be a few hundred years from being able to contact us and ask how WWII ended unless they had developed faster than light travel, in which case, it would still probably be a few decades (from when the radio waves reached them) depending on how much faster than light they can travel. And that's just the dozen or so stars that are within 50 lyr from Earth. Even at 50 times the speed of light, 50 lyr still take a year to traverse. That's an awfully long way to go to shove a probe up some hick's bum and be secretive about doing it.

 

And for the record, Catholicism, both in how we identify it today and its basic set of doctrines and beliefs are not 2000 years old... At best it's about half that.

Edited July 25, 2010 by Vagrant0