Geck help: how to make cryo explosion appear on hit?

[griever7x]

Hello, recently I've been playing around wit the geck a bit, and started editing weapons to my liking.
I've discovered the mod Fook adds a weapon called Cryolator to the game; this weapon will freeze enemies on death, making them stand in whatever position they were at the time.

I've found this to be really cool and, upon further inspection, I've noticed there is also a 'cryo explosion' effect.

So an idea struck me: I should add this freezing on death effect to a grenade launcher, and add the cryo explosion effect to the appropriate explosion entry.

So far so good, in game the weapon works beautifully, visually speaking: the explosion covers enemies in an icy texture.

However, what most struck me initially was the paralyze effect: unfortunately this one doesn't seem to work, as npcs still get knocked to the ground upon being hit, rather than standing still, frozen in whatever position they were...

In the weapon settings I tried putting no dismember/explosion effect on hit, kill impulse to 0, impulse distance to 0, no crit effect on death, and in the explosion entry for the projectile I tried putting push force to 0, push explosion source ref only, never knock down living actors, but still, the enemies fall to the ground upon being hit and dying...

I'd like to point out that I'm using the exact same scripts that the original weapon added by Fook is using; the only difference is that this 'Cryolator' utilizes an attack loop very much similar to that of a flamer, so no projectile casing an explosion occurs in any way.

I suspect what's making my own weapon not work properly is the fact it causes an explosion, after all.

At this point, I've discarded the idea of adding this effect to a grenade launcher, or any other explosive weapon, for that matter.

Even so, I would still like to make a weapon that, upon hitting an enemy, or if possible any surface, will display the 'cryo explosion' effect and consequently use the freeze script by Fook.

I think that, this way, since the explosion is only a mesh, a .nif file, it should not make the script misbehave in any way... Having said this, I don't know how to add the explosion effect to, say, a laser beam, as such if anyone can help me I would greatly appreciate it. All I need is a way to make this .nif ( specifically dlc05cryoexplosion.nif ) be displayed on hit by a projectile ( any ), without adding it through the explosion entry in the projectile settings.

Edited January 31, 2015 by griever7x

[Purr4me]

you need to combine the bloodymess perk to the weapon when in use. A frozen NPC will explode in ice particles, I did this using the Gauss weapon.

 

Just built a new one for you to try, it's from fallout 3's DLC's Not Fook.

http://s26.postimg.org/5jhpqt66h/Screen_Shot58.jpg

 

gonna change it cuz the gun graphics stink..

Edited January 31, 2015 by Purr4me

[griever7x]

Thanks a lot!

Do the NPCs freeze in place, without falling to the ground?

That's the important thing..

[Purr4me]

The gun I built, they freeze on the spot, but, if the NPC is in motion? then they will fall over, this is physics 101.

out side vault101 on the road, there is a car's rim, a wheel....pick that up and set it down on edge on the hill, watch what it does.

 

the game responds very close to real life situations. I used the anchorage Gauss weapon, multi shot.

 

depending on how much damage assigned to the weapon determines if they die on impact /explode.

 

one setting I have a delay, so they freeze on hit, if you hit them again they explode....over icing.

 

I watch the pieces fly in small chunks when the bloody mess perk is yet to be enabled.

 

after it gets enabled in the XP section of the game, then. things explode...exponentially. tiny pieces. lot's of em too.

 

a head shot on hit is a dead shot so, it gets exploded as well as frozen.

 

two types of guns I made work differently.

If I want to just freeze them in order to sneak by, avoid them, I shoot for the torso or legs. but one hit only...hit them twice, it's all over.

[griever7x]

Thanks for the in depth explanation, now I understand much better; I didn't know it was a simple matter of physics...

The weapon I put in game had a damage of 150, and an explosion damage of 300, so yeah... Guaranteed kill unless they resist frost

Although, with the original weapon, the Cryolator, the damage is something like 20, but with a higher rate of fire of course ( just like the flamer ) and even if in motion, the npcs would still freeze on the spot: if they were reloading at the time they froze, they will be stuck in that pose... That's what I wanted to achieve with my weapon too...

So, are you suggesting this effect depends on the damage dealt by the weapon?

[Purr4me]

So, are you suggesting this effect depends on the damage dealt by the weapon?

Both, the weapon, xp, achievements made. Damage ammo type. Micro fusion cells shot a projectile, each project tile has Embedded effects. tweaking the effects with other effects, additional add on effects and conditions set create combinations the game goes nuts over. but you can set an item too high and cause the game to instantly shut down.

 

graphics also need to be coded in top the weapon, the connections are not in line with sight seen in code using tools such as xedit "fo3edit", these things ar3e hidden by the geck and not available to access in xedit, *.nif effect is NOT listed in an esp or esm, it's built into the mesh file....so these things are not seen.

 

example, crude too is this: the riffle scope is visible as a mesh file, but in game if the code is incorrect, the scope will not show.

Any weapon can use any mesh or texture file, but actions the weapon does is still restricted the the code in the esm or esp as source.

 

compatibility of these weapons used cause bugs to form, some times even if the weapon is not even used, loading it into inventory sets up the foregoing parameters for the weapn types as you have all code for that type, even if vanilla ..loading once in inventory, it's running equipped or not.

 

this is seen when passing through a cell change, a CTD or freeze can occur.....drop it from inventory and re attempt loading the cell allows passage.

 

this is due to incorrect formats...set up by the source, being over ridden by the tweaked data. it's tricky.

 

bottom line is this: you learn as you go, some mods break other mods due to differences in them.

 

when a perk is installed, it sets up NEW parameters for the Entire game and all of it's weapons used, this also effects add on weapons because all weapons derive there source from the original game data's Vanilla weapons.

 

Poor Fo3 Engine design....NV has a better engine design and also the code used is not the same, so conversions makes things a bit interesting if not a challenge, if you understand any of this at all?

 

opt code...is what is utilized by fose and nvse yet both use different code and are not compatible with each other....so the conversion process is not possible.

 

you can't run fose mods in NVSE games, and you can't run NVSE mods in fose games. the code is NOT the same, therein are the engines differences.

 

So goes the tools world and difficult as it is to understand the complexity of all of this, that's just the way it is.

 

it all goes back to the source, vanilla , in either game. version control. Graphics control, direct-x control, that desk top display driver is tied into all of this.

 

raw, isolated, installed and correct software used and kept solid, no mixing and matching, you get a killer of a game.

throw into the pot a mix set of "garbage" because yo want a special effect one game might have, you have to alter way too much of the original game structure...making it NOW invalid.

 

It means the vanilla version not 1.7 patched is foreign to the source codes once the game was released. best seen and understood by inspecting all data on all fronts and a great deal of time in study of the massive bugs caused by changing formats in mid flight.

 

impact data from one object, a 22mm has little effect, the scope of it's build lies in the mesh, the texture, the code written into the master files...main game...and then the changes in latter esp loading up changing it.

1. change it means you no longer will be using a stable version of that data, it's required *.nif file is tied to an effect mesh, any thing esl it ties into will be effected.
2. scripts that point to a vanilla weapon in one mod, may in fact cause CTD issues or null functions to occur, bad out comes, or really cool things take place. it is a bug gamble. but all if this is a lot to take into consideration, it can not be ignored.
3. altering the masters source is only one way to ensure this goes down correctly as intended but most good authors tell you up front, this is incompatible with that because......
4. quest stages are timed too, and are also using achievements to gain changes in an automatic way, if you alter such changes and do not compensate the rest of the game, at the moment of level up, the game will freeze, do crazy weird things, and there is no way to find out for sure where it started from.

on the zeta ship, in the cryo chambers, there is a place you can activate the effects first hand if planned out right and observe activity there.

study the over all actions taking place, form your own opinions based on what your currently loading and then compare these things against a vanilla raw unaltered game, use the same saved game...if it can remove old code...most of the time you can't , you need a previous saved game.

interesting discussion but there way too much to post in-order to make things understandable to a degree you might get.

[griever7x]

Unfortunately, I don't own Fallout 3, so I can't do that; I found the cryo explosion .nif file in the New Vegas Fallout - Meshes.bsa, so, while I think I understand almost fully every thing of what you said, this asset should be usable in the game without too many issues ( and proof is that it's used already by other popular mods too, like Project Nevada and Fook ).

However I understand what you are trying to explain me, and I certainly don't want to and lack the knowledge to change such complex and hidden things in the game anyways...so I will just play with the weapon as it is: the cryo explosion effect still gets displayed, the enemies falling to the ground is only a minor nit pick ( albeit, I have to admit, if NPCs were to remain still like ice statues as intended, that'd be hella cool! ).

Thanks again for the help; might I ask you to share with me any file you made for testing purposes in reply to my request? This way I can get a look and compare what you did vs. what I've been doing.

[Purr4me]

I will do this: set up a Vm of the game, use Mod organizer as a tool to profile your set up, in order for me to do that, I need more info from you so to get as close to your PC systems requirements as possible, and build them on that premiss.

Yes, I'll send you one file built to your specs.

 

Profiling means I have only one source of the game materials available, Mo isolates profiles and mod's so nothing can get overwritten.

This creates the Ideal coverage to diagnose and install set ups top match others.

 

It's not perfect, but a hell of a lot better than shooting blind.

 

where the game is needs to be outside of system influences. La traffic was murder today so I am quite tired from the drive.

I will use 1.7 version of the game "Patched" so to match your software.

I will use all DLC's....NON patched or modded /altered in any way.

I will extract required data that forms the specs of this gun ....setup to match your rig.

I will zip up the package and make it compatible with any installer program you desire to use or can use.

I need info as to in-game specs also, game setting, graphics and size because I tweak the graphics of the resource files to match that systems specs.

AKA" mesh and texture files".

 

tomorrow.

EDIT: Apologies, I just realized what you posted..("Unfortunately, I don't own Fallout 3") your running Fallout New Vegas.

That requires skyped connections and this current PC has data on it I can not risk access to it, medical things from work. so internet connections will not be possible currently.

 

If you used fallout 3, that I can do for you here. So I can't create a VM of your system today or this week, way to busy with new tech at work and home.

I am sorry about that. NV code is not the same.

 

Kitty

Edited February 3, 2015 by Purr4me

[griever7x]

Yes, did you misunderstand me initially? I thought it was obvious on which game I was doing all of this since, well, we are on the New Vegas part of the forum.

It's fine, clearly your help has already been satisfactory. I have no intentions of making someone waste more time and resources over this minor graphical gripe