Saving the Brotherhood

[Yukichigai]

I've been intrigued by this idea for a while, ever since I found the unused quest finish option in the geck. In all honesty it would fit better with the characterization of House: a businessman first and foremost. If the Brotherhood could offer something substantial to his benefit, in this case adding an extra layer of protection between him and the land-gobbling NCR, then he would take the deal. The fact that it isn't even offered as an option to discuss with the Brotherhood is telling. My guess is that Obsidian ran out of time.

 

Regardless, the option is salvageable, provided nobody minds some reused dialog. I'm going to root around and make sure that unused voice files aren't hiding somewhere, but as best I can tell the unused quest completion option is all that's left of this.

 

On a side note, for some reason I think siding with House would be a Hardin move more than a McNamara one. McNamara is willing to bury the hatchet with the NCR; Hardin is more the "hatchet you in the back" type. Give him a chance to settle some old scores, backed by someone with high tech or not, and he'd jump at the chance.

[HaikenEdge]

I don't get people's problem with the quest. When house asked me to destroy the BOS i just went into his lair and put him out of his misery. House is an idiot and he must die, end of story. If you blew up the brotherhood for this jerk you really deserved the bad ending. You can't expect to work for an evil character and end up with a "good" ending.

 

Yeah of course you could script your way out of the misery, but it simply wouldn't fit. Would be like scripting an option to the intro that goes like "Oh benny dont shoot me" and hes like "Oh okay *hands over platinum chip*"...

 

What i would really have liked to see was a way to really help out the brotherhood more, like if you kill all NCR troops with Archimedes then like the brotherhood takes back Helios one.

 

Well, Obsidian apparently disagrees, since they originally included the option. Even the published player's guide includes a reference to the diplomatic option. I'd also disagree with your assessment of Mr. House. So far, he seems like the closest thing to a good path in the game to me. The NCR puts on a good show, but it's increasingly clear as you go along that the leadership is corrupt and power hungry. And the Brotherhood, while certainly not evil, is not good by any stretch of the imagination, either. Personally, I want to save them because I like them, not because I think they're great people.

I'm not exactly sure how you could even say House is good. Well-meaning? Maybe. But he's most certainly not good, considering that he has no qualms about killing anybody and everybody who he views to be a threat to his hold on New Vegas or his vision for its future. He's morally ambiguous, in my opinion; he believes what he's doing is right, and in many ways, it is, if you're only looking at it from the economic standpoint, but his willingness to crush the opposition through force and stifle civil liberties doesn't for a good person make.

[Thanos001]

Let me see how the GECK handles endings, I think I could swing it if I can find the script and quest handler. The House portion of the quest is easy enough but getting the rest done is bit of stretch.

[Garak84]

I don't get people's problem with the quest. When house asked me to destroy the BOS i just went into his lair and put him out of his misery. House is an idiot and he must die, end of story. If you blew up the brotherhood for this jerk you really deserved the bad ending. You can't expect to work for an evil character and end up with a "good" ending.

 

Yeah of course you could script your way out of the misery, but it simply wouldn't fit. Would be like scripting an option to the intro that goes like "Oh benny dont shoot me" and hes like "Oh okay *hands over platinum chip*"...

 

What i would really have liked to see was a way to really help out the brotherhood more, like if you kill all NCR troops with Archimedes then like the brotherhood takes back Helios one.

 

Well, Obsidian apparently disagrees, since they originally included the option. Even the published player's guide includes a reference to the diplomatic option. I'd also disagree with your assessment of Mr. House. So far, he seems like the closest thing to a good path in the game to me. The NCR puts on a good show, but it's increasingly clear as you go along that the leadership is corrupt and power hungry. And the Brotherhood, while certainly not evil, is not good by any stretch of the imagination, either. Personally, I want to save them because I like them, not because I think they're great people.

I'm not exactly sure how you could even say House is good. Well-meaning? Maybe. But he's most certainly not good, considering that he has no qualms about killing anybody and everybody who he views to be a threat to his hold on New Vegas or his vision for its future. He's morally ambiguous, in my opinion; he believes what he's doing is right, and in many ways, it is, if you're only looking at it from the economic standpoint, but his willingness to crush the opposition through force and stifle civil liberties doesn't for a good person make.

 

I didn't say he was good. I said siding with him is the "closest thing to a good path". Anyway, whatever, I just want another option in the game. Not like I'm asking for a godcheat weapon or something, lol.

[HaikenEdge]

I don't get people's problem with the quest. When house asked me to destroy the BOS i just went into his lair and put him out of his misery. House is an idiot and he must die, end of story. If you blew up the brotherhood for this jerk you really deserved the bad ending. You can't expect to work for an evil character and end up with a "good" ending.

 

Yeah of course you could script your way out of the misery, but it simply wouldn't fit. Would be like scripting an option to the intro that goes like "Oh benny dont shoot me" and hes like "Oh okay *hands over platinum chip*"...

 

What i would really have liked to see was a way to really help out the brotherhood more, like if you kill all NCR troops with Archimedes then like the brotherhood takes back Helios one.

 

Well, Obsidian apparently disagrees, since they originally included the option. Even the published player's guide includes a reference to the diplomatic option. I'd also disagree with your assessment of Mr. House. So far, he seems like the closest thing to a good path in the game to me. The NCR puts on a good show, but it's increasingly clear as you go along that the leadership is corrupt and power hungry. And the Brotherhood, while certainly not evil, is not good by any stretch of the imagination, either. Personally, I want to save them because I like them, not because I think they're great people.

I'm not exactly sure how you could even say House is good. Well-meaning? Maybe. But he's most certainly not good, considering that he has no qualms about killing anybody and everybody who he views to be a threat to his hold on New Vegas or his vision for its future. He's morally ambiguous, in my opinion; he believes what he's doing is right, and in many ways, it is, if you're only looking at it from the economic standpoint, but his willingness to crush the opposition through force and stifle civil liberties doesn't for a good person make.

 

I didn't say he was good. I said siding with him is the "closest thing to a good path". Anyway, whatever, I just want another option in the game. Not like I'm asking for a godcheat weapon or something, lol.

I would argue that the "closest thing to a good path" would be the independent route, after allying the Kings with NCR, killing the Powder Gangers, Fiends and other raiders, and then blowing off both of the primary factions, but that's just me.

[est]

I'm interested in this as well. I was all for siding with House (questionable ethics or no, he seems the most capable of looking after Vegas), right up until this point. Were it not for Veronica, I wouldn't care so much about destroying the Brotherhood.

 

It's true that there are still references in the quest to a diplomatic option that must have been removed prior to release. It has "(Optional) Inform Mr. House that you've negotiated a peaceful solution with the Brotherhood" as the objective and "Player has convinced House that the Brotherhood is valuable against the NCR" in quest stages. I'm having a look, but my modding experience is limited to minor tweaks only; I'm not sure I'm experienced enough to start messing with main quests.

Exactly what I found

 

http://www.thenexusforums.com/index.php?/topic/256235-peaceful-negotiation-with-bos

[jimbo553]

Let me take a look at the files, I'll see what I can do. Btw, to cheat past it you propably have to use a setstage command, idk the idea of the one you want.

[est]

Let me take a look at the files, I'll see what I can do. Btw, to cheat past it you propably have to use a setstage command, idk the idea of the one you want.

 

setstage didn't work as I expect. Can someone experienced with quest system tell me the trigger conditions?

[Garak84]

Let me take a look at the files, I'll see what I can do. Btw, to cheat past it you propably have to use a setstage command, idk the idea of the one you want.

 

setstage didn't work as I expect. Can someone experienced with quest system tell me the trigger conditions?

 

I experimented with several console commands, but could only get it to count the quest completed, but not enable Mr. House to recognize it and give me the next step, effectively breaking his entire questline.

[NickMcHazard]

I just went ahead and did this on Sunday. I haven't posted the mod yet but I will do so soon.

 

Bear in mind it is kind of ghetto since I can't seem to get any of the VO sound files to work with replies. Also, I tried making BoS membership a requirement of the dialogue option, but apparently the value is still 0 even though I'm a member. Go figure.

 

I may set the option to require a speech check as well. I want to make some small improvements so that the thing actually SEEMS like a reasonable House response, but I really can't do that until I figure out how to use VO files in GECK.

 

So, in short:

 

1. I have made a mod that allows the player to spare the BoS in House Always Wins V

2. I want to improve it a little so it is still realistic and immersive (e.g., House probably won't be thrilled)

3. I really really want to know how to view, access, and use all of the VO files in GECK

 

- Nick