[WIP] OBME - Spell Codex

[zenkaidesign]

Oblivion Magic Extender (OBME) - Spell Codex

 

An excellent mod, Oblivion Magic Extender (OBME) can be found at: http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=31981 .

 

A comment suggested creating a library that multiple developers can contribute to, to encourage one proper release rather than hundreds of varied and partial implementations.

 

An excellent idea, for what will be an excellent mod. There aren't many distributed mods making good use of OBME, which is a shame - but it only takes one doing it right to capitalize on all the potential that JRoush's hard work has contributed to the Oblivion experience.

 

As it is a "for the community" and "by the community" mod, I need to get a pulse of the community's thoughts, wishes, and feelings for it, to help development move in a direction that is most desirable to the community as a whole.

 

This project has modular objectives (which will likely be modular .esps as well), as described here:

 

Objectives:

 

1.) Additional Spell Effects

Add a resource pool of the most desired new spell effects through OBME.

Proper implementations only; specification:

[+] Must support magnitude properly.

[+] Must support on touch/target/self properly.

[+] Must operate friendly within any Spellmaking configuration.

[+] Must support enchantment.

[+] Must support alchemy.

[+] Must have a unique, attractive, "vanilla-esque" icon

 

2.) Replacement Spell Effects [Low Priority]

Replace vanilla scripted spells with a unique spell effect, complete with proper handling and a unique icon.

 

3.) Additional Spells

Add a resource pool of spells that utilize the new effects at varied magnitudes and with appropriate names.

3a.) Additional Spell Distribution (Vendors)

Add the additional spells to level-and-lore-appropriate vendors, using a script for compatibility.

 

3b.) Additional Spell Distribution (NPCs)

Add the additional spells to level-and-lore-appropriate NPCs, including random NPCs, i.e. Necromancers.

 

3c.) Additional Spell Distribution (Creatures)

Add the additional spells to level-and-lore-appropriate creatures.

4.) Additional Potions

Add additional potions using the new spell effects.

4a.) Additional Potion Distribution (Leveled Lists)

Add the additional potions to leveled loot lists.

 

4b.) Additional Potion Distribution (Placed, Towns)

Add the additional potions to the game world in towns.

Must have ownership properly implemented where applicable.

 

4c.) Additional Potion Distribution (Placed, Dungeons)

Add the additional potions to the game world, placed in dungeons.

5.) Additional Enchanted Items

Adds additional enchanted items using the new effects.

5a.) Additional Enchanted Items Distribution (NPCs)

Adds additional enchanted items to NPCs (including enemies), using a script for compatibility.

 

5b.) Additional Enchanted Items Distribution (Vendors)

Adds additional enchanted items to vendor NPCs, using a script for compatibility.

 

5c.) Additional Enchanted Items Distribution (Dungeons)

Adds additional enchanted items to dungeons.

 

5d.) Additional Enchanted Items Distribution (Leveled Lists)

Adds additional enchanted items to leveled loot lists.

 

5e.) Additional Enchanted Items Distribution (Sigil Stones)

Adds sigil stones for the new effects.

6.) Additional Ingredients

Add a resource pool of additional ingredients that make use of the new spell effects.

Will likely need retextures or modder resources (or better yet: retextures of modder resources).

6a.) Additional Ingredients Distribution (Plants)

May need some new plant meshes? This option will have to be discussed for viability.

 

6b.) Additional Ingredients Distribution (Vendors)

Adds the new ingredients to appropriate vendors, via a script for compatibility.

 

6c.) Additional Ingredients Distribution (Leveled Lists)

Adds the new ingredients to appropriate leveled lists - this may include some creature lists, depending on the ingredient.

 

6d.) Additional Ingredients Distribution (Towns)

Adds the new ingredients to the game world, in towns, shops, etc. Ownership must be properly assigned.

 

6e.) Additional Ingredients Distribution (Dungeons)

Adds the new ingredients to the game world, in dungeons, etc.

 

 

 

The Effects:

 

It's probably safe to assume we want effects from MW back, such as:

- Mark

- Recall

 

- (some form of) Intervention: My thoughts... Divine Intervention, transports you to the nearest chapel. Or, if your fame outweighs your infamy, it brings you to the chapel. Otherwise it.... does something else.

 

Intervention, Mark, and Recall need a safety soas not to break quests. This can be a cell-based blacklist, or an active quest blacklist. Or both. I love the thought of trying to use Divine Intervention in a blacklisted cell and seeing a notice appear in the corner: "The gods can't help you here."

 

- Jump: see concerns for levitation

- Levitation: to implement levitation safely, it may be necessary to include a separate .esp that adds invisible "ceilings" to cities, and around the outside of cities. Another option is to go a la Mournhold, a simple message saying "You cannot use that spell here." Would still have to address the outside of cities, however.

 

Lycanthropy - Enough said.

 

Other thoughts regarding jump / levitation would be a more limited, and therefore safer "Glide" or "Hover" technique, or a limited levitation similar to WoW's - where you "levitate" a certain height off the terrain/water - perhaps combined with a fall-free period, so that you could run several feet off an edge before you begin to slowly float downward.

Terrain-based-height levitation would allow for scaling some cliffs, if properly implemented, granted that they were not straight up and down. Open to suggestions on this one- looking for something fun, useful, and not game-breaking considering all the roofs that are missing collision models and cities that have naught but a void outside their walls.

 

- Lock: A couple potential issues with Lock - what does this do to AI schedules? In addition, what happens when a player does not have an "unlock" spell or lockpicks, and locks themselves in? More importantly, it must not effect already locked doors - or a locked (15) door would override the lock (200) Needs a Key.

 

- Slowfall

- Swift Swim

 

and of course the legendary Conjuration spell, "EXTRA SPELL" ! :huh: (kidding)

 

A popular topic is new summon spells.

What summons should be added, realistically? It would be pointless to add a summon for every creature in the game, I'd like to get the community thoughts on what the most appropriate conjurations would be.

 

Some other proposals I have seen are:

Spectral Form - Would make you immune to normal weapons, ghost shader, perhaps a few temporary stat/attribute changes. Main purpose is to make the player operate much like spectres. Casting on another NPC would be pretty much just for fun - although an interesting twist would be if it added 5000 bounty and removed it after - making the guards attack you or the other NPC on sight for the duration of the spell. And because most town guards don't use magic or silver weapons, they would not neccessarily be able kill the NPC before it wears off and their bounty is removed.

 

Resurrect - Would need a good amount of work to make it proper and viable - but it can be done, and would be quite useful. Would have to be a master level spell to be balanced at all. Perhaps "require" mastery in two skills (you can cast with mastery in one, but it fails/backfires without mastery of the other). Perhaps make it a crime if witnessed?

 

Summon Horse(or other mount) - Some kind of a summon mount script. This would be a bit unbalanced, but perhaps we could balance it. A limited time summon, before you dismount (if applicable) and it fades away?

 

Banish - Banishes the target to a (custom-made) oblivion plane. After 30 seconds, they are restored to where they were banished from. This would be an annoying one when an npc hits you with you. Adding an area effect would just be evil (and probably too unbalanced). Another interesting thought- what if it worked on items? Would probably need a countdown, to be fair to the player. (Banish in 3...2...1...) . An unbalanced, but fun thought would be a similar effect that banishes the target to a custom-made realm where they are surrounded by hard enemies (would have to respawn for next time), in a relatively dark setting, where the only thought is "survive for 20 seconds... survive for 10 more seconds.... survive for...", and equally interesting, you could scavenge the remains of any poor sap banished before you got there (assuming you don't unbanish the dead?)

 

Cutpurse - If the target is carrying gold or a key, they have a chance of dropping it on the ground. Magnitude determines how much gold is dropped, and if they are carrying a key, determines odds of dropping the key (much less likely than dropping a few coins). Non-hostile (or sneak skill governs hostility?)

 

Confuse - Randomize actor variables such as responsibility, disposition, faction, etc every 20 seconds for duration (of course, restoring them on expiry). Non-hostile, but may cause hostility as a side effect.

 

Channeling - A single effect, useable in spellmaking, that directly trades health for magic (conversion point not neccessarily 1 for 1). This would allow people to set their spells to cost health rather than magic, or to make a restore magic spell that costs health. Would be a balanced way to add Restore Magic to spellmaking. Probably with a failsafe if your health is too low.

 

Root/Freeze/Stop/Blind/Veil (name not decided) - A spell that effectively does what drain speed to 0 does, but with a more impressive shader.

 

Snare / Tangle - create a cage made out of tree roots around the target, holding it in place. Similar to bubble, except the cage has openings for attacks/spells/etc/ and is weighted so it will fall if used on a target in the air (unless it clips with the ceiling - in which case we let the physics engine decide what to do with you. pinning to the ceiling would be a nice effect.) Must not be an enchant.

 

Bubble - Similar to snare, in that it creates a ball around the target, which does effectively "trap" the target, however it serves two other purposes. Snare leaves openings for attacks/spells. This does not - it is a solid bubble. The bubble is a weightless static that floats where its cast, so casting it on yourself, even in midair, would cause you to be "bubbled" in midair. Could be used creatively to break a fall.

 

Wall - Summons a solid stone wall a few feet in front of the target for the duration. Needs a nice crumbling fader for the expiry. Would allow the caster to wall off a wing of the building, or create a shield to hide behind, or a simple maze-like effect during close combat. Perhaps have a limit of 5 walls in play at a time. Must not be an enchant.

 

Elevate - creates an earthy "elevator" platform beneath the target that floats upward, lifting them up a short distance, and persisting for the duration before disappearing. Can be used to rise out of reach of melee attackers. However, irresponsible use could just crush you against the ceiling. Must not be an enchant. I would chuckle when an NPC casts this and crushes themselves against the ceiling.

 

Death - Sweet and simple. Magnitude / 2 = % chance. Naturally, wouldn't work on essentials or "bosses" (determined by an hp threshold?). With a high enough (balanced) cost, could retain balance. In addition, with a cool shader, would make a nice enchant.

 

Friendly (name?) - An effect that works similarly to invisibility, without the invisible part. Would simply make things in range stop attacking you (or the target).

 

Disarm - Magnitude = chance to make target drop its weapon.

 

Clone - Would only work on living targets- and would have to protect their inventory soas not to be abused.

 

Push / Repel - simply generates a large amount of force on the targeted object, as if it were hit by something. Maybe use an effect similar to paralysis to allow NPCs to be thrown back by it. At high magnitudes, would probably protect the target from dying, in order to throw them farther than would usually be possible without killing them (imagine throwing a dungeon npc all the way across the room, against the wall on the other side).

 

Stop/Slow Time - if cast on self, perhaps use timescale to slow down time, or toggleai (is this safe?) to "freeze" time momentarily. If cast on an NPC, simply increase their speed to a couple hundred momentarily.

 

And a personal addition from me:

Fire Sprite / Shock Sprite / etc... -

This is a more complex scripted spell- would summon a "ball" of the selected element that would move over the shoulder of the target, positioned much like a MAG from the Phantasy Star Online game; it would fire a leveled spell of the chosen element at enemies at random intervals, and the ball (sprite) itself would fizzle out upon lapse of duration. This will be much easier to explain once the demo is ready. Main purpose is that it keeps throwing spells for you, keeping your hands free to use other spells, or fight melee. Would be relatively expensive - the idea is that a melee fighter could expend his entire magicka before rushing in summoning one of these, to help him lay down some additional DPS. The hardest part of this script (for me, anyhow) is figuring out who is hostile towards the target (to support casting a sprite spell on another NPC).

 

 

Please provide feedback. I am working on the MW spell effects now, will start on the new spell effects up next. I'd like to have some feedback before beginning the new effects if possible.

 

I'm not out for credit. If someone else feels they are better suited to manage this project, please PM me.

It's the equivalent of an "open source" project. Or whatever the modding equivalent is.

 

If anyone has already used OBME to develop spell effects they would like to contribute to this project, please PM me - it would be a valuable resource to jumpstart the development of this project.

 

Project is being developed initially for vanilla oblivion - the spell effects are only needed in vanilla. As far as expansions go, only placement of items and arming of npcs will need an extra ESP.

[lanthirion]

Koschwarz has made a mod, "Spell and Enchantment Tweaks for Un-leveled Oblivion," located here, which uses OBME to "remove the magnitude of those spells that depend on the level of the enemy and [now] they only have duration. This means they always work, no matter what level enemy you face. Your skill level determines only the duration of the spell. Of course if spell effectiveness drops below 100% only the duration will decrease. As your skills grow you can access longer duration spells. Don't expect 60 sec Demoralize spells...at novice level you can get a spell with 2-4 sec. With low skills these spells will provide only breathing space and and you gain only a short time for escape or plan your next move. If you want longer duration spells you need to be a skilled mage with high magicka and you may benefit from these spells more then just running away. But even the highest level spells won't last more than 20 sec. But you know...it always will work. Note that touch spells last longer than targeted spells." That quote is from the description of the mod written by the mod's author. The mod in question is intended to make magic more useful but still not overpowered in un-leveled Oblivion mods such as T.I.E.

[zenkaidesign]

That's pretty good! It's different from the goal of this mod, but I would like to ensure compatibility because I can see the usefulness of his mod. Thanks for sharing.

 

Mark, Recall, and Intervention are the first up - I've got a working basic mark/recall, I'm adding a bit to it as it deserves an upgrade since MW. Adding a 3 second countdown after casting before teleportation. Effectively they will recall on expiration. I'll try to adjust it so that longer durations have lower spell costs, instant recall being the hardest to cast. Wondering if I should build in some type of multi-mark, but that could be exploited. Still need to draw up the blacklist. I'll be adding cell and quest blacklists seperately for each mark and recall. (There are some places that shouldn't be marked, there are others that shouldn't be teleported out of, and of course, some that shouldn't be able to do either.)

 

Sorry for the slow progress, I'm still on a contract project for another 11 days. After that pace will pick up.

 

Still hoping for some feedback :)

[UmtheMuse]

Hi, I like a lot of those ideas. I would love being able to make my own version of some of these spells. That's what greatly disappointed me when I got LAME: no custom spells.

 

If you're looking for more spells, I've got a couple of ideas:

Rearm booby traps. Meant for sneaky characters. Maybe grant them this as a lesser power? Require yarn? It would be really cool if they could create their own, but that might be too much...

Teleport from mage's guild to guild. Must already be at one for it to work. Alternatively, have that as a service that you pay for (paying for it would only have role-play value,though).

Weapon enchantments that will buff the user (absorb shield, trade weapons, steal resistances, etc)

Demi--Do damage based on a percentage of their current health

Mystic rituals, where you prepare a spell beforehand by collecting certain ingredients and/or items. I don't want them to add spells like Midas does, though. I was thinking more like boosting your mysticism, and letting you create some of the spells that you would normally need a high level to even access (reflect spells) or are normally nearly impossible to obtain (reflect damage).

Flashlight-esque light spell, possibly with a color filter. The idea is to let you see in front of you without alerting everyone as easily as a normal light spell or torch would.

Friend-foe recognition for spells

Combining spells with drawbacks to get discounts on casting costs. LAME has a couple ready-made ones, but it would be sweet if you could do that at a spell-making altar. Well, maybe spell-making, since that could be easily abused (command creature on self), but it would pretty well on enchantments (still somewhat abusable by, say, enchanting something with 100% resistance to fire and fire damage on self, but it only has limited room for abuse). Along with this is the ability to add multiple enchantments to armor.

Slow flooding of a room

Mana shields--instead of losing HP, the Mage loses Magicka.

Temporary protection against the sun for vampires (would be very dangerous, especially if the timer's short or the spell costs a constant trickle of magicka; they can't cast much else in the meanwhile)

 

I've got a lot more ideas, if you're interested. I don't know how feasable these ideas are, and I realize these tend to be player centric, but hopefully they gave you some ideas.

 

Oh, slightly off-topic, but I was thinking it would be really if I could organize my spells better. I would collapsible lists (ideally, you could highlight one of your custom categories and a sublist would appear off to the side). If it's not possible to do directly, maybe we could add the category as a spell that has the whole purpose of storing other spells. That would be cumbersome, though, since you would have to cast the spell in order to access your spells.

Any way, I'm very excited about this project!

[Tushaar]

Hell yeah, this is superb! All the new spells and stuff

 

BUT!!!

 

PLEASE, make use of screen effects like the mod Fearsome magicka does because that is so cool when your screen shakes and goes blurry and saturation contrast rises lower and whatever, that is just pure awesomeness. Not just a small orange fireball and paff little explosion. :)

 

A nice spell suggestion, if it's possible, shockwave blast in 360 degrees around you. Everyone is thrown away from you :D

[zenkaidesign]

LAME doesn't support custom spells, because it works a little bit differently. Limitations aren't as much of a concern here.

Focus, however, is. This is not meant to be a game-breaking player-centric godpack. The purpose is to keep it limited to useful spells, and moreover, limited to spells that NPCs or enchanted items may use on you or others without breaking the spell.

That's why it can safely support spellmaking etc, because in order to "make the cut", a spell has to be implemented properly, all the way through.

 

As for shaders, of course. One of my favorite parts of this. IMO shaders were horribly underplayed in the original. I used to add shaders to my character just for fun using the console. I've come up with a couple most interesting shaders (reptile skin, etc) which I look forward to implementing somewhere. However, they are going to have to make sense. Can't have our spells completely outshadow the originals. They can be unique, however, and will be.

 

My response to suggestions:

 

Rearm Booby Traps - In addition to being a scripting nightmare, this would involve being location specific. Would have to be custom scripted for each and every trap. This involves overwriting a lot more data than spells/spell effects, and is therefore beyond the scope of this project. (Not to mention it would not support any mods which use traps without the mod author having to specifically implement it, which probably wouldn't be easy.) That said, I was already considering trap spells of a sort, similar to a proximity mine. Much safer, much easier to implement, and much more useful.

 

Teleport from mage's guild to guild- I like the idea, because its a great throwback to MW, which for being 50 years prior, is a great deal more advanced magic-technology wise (and much better jumpers!). However, this isn't really a spell, and falls outside of the scope of this project. That said, I could probably throw something together for you on the side (if there's not something already, which I find hard to believe.) Great feedback though, you're making me really think.

 

Weapon enchantments that will buff the user - of course

 

+Absorb Shield - This is different. I will consider it. Would be tricky to get the timers right, but other than that I think it can be done. question is whether there is enough demand to justify it.

 

+Switch Weapons - I like this. I need to see that it can be done safely. If so, definately.

 

+Steal Resistances - I don't think this would actually be a good idea. Would break lore when you can hurt ghosts with weapons, and it's not really neccessary for most fights.

 

Demi--Do damage based on a percentage of their current health - This I think I like- problem being how to cap it. If you cap it low, such as 20%, that means the hardest boss in the game will only take 5 hits to kill. The other option would be to make spell cost so insanely high you couldn't cast a 100%, and would have difficulty reaching that 20%. If you have a suggestion on how to cap it, I will consider adding it. Not very lore-friendly, though. I don't think I would explain to the player it's percentage based, just more along the lines that it "uses their own strength against them" or something.

 

Mystic rituals - I was already considering reagent spells. Problem isn't in concept, it's in implementation. It would be hard to label a spell as needing a reagent, and possibly confusing to the player. As far as going into full blown rituals, beyond reagents, that would have to be another mod.

 

Flashlight-esque light spell - Other than purely cosmetic, I'm pretty sure night-eye eliminates the need for this. This could be fun with a dark lighting mod, for a more horror-like effect, but other than that, I don't see an existing need for it. That said, I am considering adding a berserk spell, which among its effects includes an alternate shader night-eye if you're just looking for a color change.

 

Friend-foe recognition for spells - Recognition for spells? Or just like a "detect friend/foe" that lights friendlies green and foes red/etc?

If it's the latter, I like it. I have to see how to go about it, but I do like it.

 

Combining spells with drawbacks to get discounts on casting costs. I like it - but because of SEVERE balance exploits, I think it will have to be limited to Channeling, which restores magic but drains health. I'm trying to modify Channeling to simply reduce spell cost and damage health.

 

Slow flooding of a room - Too many limitations, sorry. Fun idea, though. Maybe if someone can script a water block object, but not if it has to depend on the actual water level.

 

Mana shields--instead of losing HP, the Mage loses Magicka. - Most definately. Unlike Fable, however, this will have to be a time limited effect. This will require an ASM edit to work, unfortunately, unless I can find another way around it. But I like it, and it's useful.

 

Temporary protection against the sun for vampires - This could be fun in short duration. I will take a look at the technical implications, and if it's not too bad, consider it in. Problem is enchanting. It could be exploited via enchantment.

 

 

360 degree shockwave - Problem with this is cast range. In order to be around you, it has to be cast on self. But you don't want it to apply to you too, do you? But if it doesn't effect the target, what would an on-target version be worth? I like it, but seems like it would have to be limited to cast on self in order to be valid.

 

if I could organize my spells better - This sounds like a UI project more than anything. Unfortunately, a good ways outside of the scope of this project. (This project is limited to effects, but shouldn't give any trouble to a UI mod).

 

 

>> Any way, I'm very excited about this project!

>> Hell yeah, this is superb! All the new spells and stuff

 

Thank you very much. 'Tis your encouragement that keeps me from getting too distracted with IRL work.

 

 

I'd say we have enough effects now, it's time to narrow them down to a focused initial list and discuss implementation, how they should work, how much they should cost, what should limitations/exceptions be, what happens on self, target, touch, magnitude effects, etc.

 

I'll get a list of initial effects for review later on today/tonight, and would love any and all feedback that you guys can offer because that's the stuff I really need feedback on. Ideas are the easy part, however the difference between a dreamer and a scientist is implementation.

 

Thanks again for the support, definately a fun project!

[UmtheMuse]

Cool, fast and thorough response. Much appreciated.

Sorry about some of those ideas--I had the wrong idea about what this project was about (it was late and I was way out of it). So this is supposed to be kind of like the mage's answer to COBL, right? I was thinking that it was kind of like FCOM 2 or something. I've also got to admit that I'm more of a dreamer than a scientist. I do have a basic understanding of the CS, though, and I'm willing to test things out.

You'd mentioned wanting traps, too. There's already a mod for traps. I've got it, but there were a couple things I didn't like: they were implemented as items (I know, makes sense), so I always forgot I had them. That meant that I just ended up selling them when I find them. As items, anybody (re: any PC) could use them, too. Enemies couldn't use them. That would be hard to implement, I imagine, but it is kind of unsportsmanlike. They were also really weak. What I did like about the mod was the basic implementation: you could just drop them, and you'd see the triggerzone. You never trigger your own traps, which might or might not be a good idea, I don't know.

 

You're right, the teleport from mage's guild to guild already exists, as does your divine intervention, Daedric intervention (you pay some health and get teleported out of battle to one of the Daedric shrines), short distance teleport, teleport out of a cave (my favorite) and random teleport (you don't know where you'll end up, and there's a small chance that something bad happens instead of the teleportation). And these are just in LAME and Supreme Magicka. I don't think that we need to bother including them, as they seem to work pretty well, and seem to fall outside the scope of this project, right?

Demi is a spell from Final Fantasy. It works off of current hp, not max hp. Theoretically, you could cast it forever, and never kill with it. I don't think you should let it have an area effect, if it's possible to disallow, but it would be wicked if an enemy used it on you. It would, of course, have to be an expensive spell, and you should probably scale it to do a max of 50% of current health or something. And, of course, you don't have to do it. I just think about demi whenever I summon something.

 

I'm glad that you like the Detect Attitude idea, but I had actually meant making a "smart spell," where your area effect spell won't fry your teammates/summons/you in the process. I'm pretty sure that mods like Supreme Magicka and Midas' Magic handle spells where you get a ring of fire surrounding you, or whatever.

Is force push/pull type spells lore-friendly? I see them in a bunch of mods and this is the first Elder Scroll game that I've played. I like the ones where you can trip the enemy (all the fun of a paralyze spell, but none of the drawbacks? Makes sense to me!), but if you've seen LAME's windplay spell effect (the enemy goes careening into Neverneverland), I think that goes way too far.

 

On the mystic preparation idea, yeah, I could see how that could easily get out of control. Would it be possible/not too hard to make a device where you can convert potions into scrolls? I'm not sure exactly why one would use it (just to get around the 4 potions rule? You would still have to actually go through the motions of casting the spell, so maybe it balances out). I just know that the way that scrolls work now, I always think that I'm going to use the powerful ones, "later," and then I forget about them in the heat of battle.

 

On the spell effects you've already mentioned, Midas already has a bunch of these. It's just slightly annoying to not be able to set or even see the magnitudes, duration, etc. of his spells. OTOH, maybe seeing how he did his can make it much easier to use (I haven't actually dl'd OBME yet, so I don't know for sure).

Spectral Form--That sounds like it's too powerful, IMHO. Maybe you could get away with it if the caster can actually transform into a ghost/wraith/gloom wraith/Will O' Whisp (that last one would be really wicked. That would be an awesome reward for master perk) temporarily. That would stop them from being able to use their uber weapon/ Ultimate Spell of All Time^tm or whatever, but still allow for the "coolness factor." As this is supposed to be a library, it would maybe be best if we let the modder decide what the player can transform into (again, I don't know if that's possible). That way, they could get a, say, werewolf mod working.

 

Summon horse is not broken. What could you do with it that you can't do with a teleport spell? Saddlebags? The mount just disappears! I think that it would be a decent addition, without being overpowering. Now, if you were going to make it a magic carpet or a dragon, now that would be game breaking. The only issue with summon horse that I see is that it might not be considered lore-friendly (only the well-off ride horses in Cyrodil, right? I don't think that any of the mages do).

 

My favorite on your list is "cutpurse." Makes a lot more sense to me than being able to pickpocket, say, their shovel. You know what I mean.

Death--sounds good. I would lower the odds to maybe one in four or five, especially if area effect is possible. Don't forget, we want them to be able to cast it on us, so we need a way to stop it.

 

I've gotta go, but I hope this helps!

[zenkaidesign]

The purpose is to fully implement new spell effects. Some of the spells may be similar to other mods, some not. It's worth implementing the ones that are in other mods, because the level of integration and if I may say so, "perfection", will make it desirable in the end. If you grab just any spellpack, you look forward to hitting the baddies with a few new tricks. Install this mod, and you'll end up saying "WTF just happened? He just turned into a ghost, bound me to the wall with roots, stole my gold, and teleported out of here..." Or something along those lines. Probably not so extreme. But the moral of the story is that NPCs use new spells too.

 

>There's already a mod for traps

Not a problem. I'm talking a spell mod, which NPCs can use too. NPCs will fire them at you by default. But when you dodge this particular fireball, instead of "missing", it anchors in the wall behind you waiting for you to get too close. As for self-detonation, undecided.

 

Intervention does exist, but it was a true spell effect / scroll effect in MW, which is the purpose for bringing it back. I'm also putting a unique spin on the teleport spells (duration = countdown before teleport, higher duration = lower cost). This twist adds a fun challenge - cast it while taking heat, fend off the heat while it charges up. Moreover, a modder could have severe fun with this in a dungeon, something casts it on you with a 30 second duration, you have to find the hidden dispel potion before you get plucked outta there. Still debating the pros/cons of allowing it to be cast on creatures/NPCs. (Pros: mad fun, somewhat unbalanced. Cons: Everyone in the nearest chapel dies an unexpected death.)

 

>Demi

I completely misread the "current" part. I like it now.

 

> but I had actually meant making a "smart spell,"

This is much more difficult, but much more useful. I will have to do some research on implementation and I'll let you know.

 

 

>Is force push/pull type spells lore-friendly?

Somewhat. Not directly, but telekinesis is, so it's not that much of a stretch. Items are light enough to grab, people are heavy so the best you can do is knock them around a bit. Speaking of "/pull", that's pretty interesting. I could see a lot of fun with a Reptile-style "Git over here...."

 

>Would it be possible/not too hard to make a device where you can convert potions into scrolls?

I'd have to figure out how this one makes sense. In addition there's a technical issue - it would probably have to declare each potion individually, meaning it wouldn't work with mods that don't directly support it. An interesting idea, I'd request this mod elsewhere. Not really part of the scope (yet- scope may expand once the basics are complete).

 

>On the spell effects you've already mentioned, Midas already has a bunch of these.

They aren't fully implemented (no spellmaking, no NPC usage).

 

>Spectral Form

Would need some serious balancing (pros and cons). I'll add details shortly.

 

>Summon horse

Actually, I'm looking to make it something other than a horse. But a summonable mount. Pros would be that it will move faster than a normal mount; cons are that it goes poof easily. (wip, lol)

 

>My favorite on your list is "cutpurse."

Definately one of my favorites too.

 

>Death

I agree balancing will have to be fine tuned.

 

>I've gotta go, but I hope this helps!

It does, tremendously, thanks!

Be sure to stop by later, I'll be posting a technical schematic of the semi-finalist spells late tonight. :thumbsup:

Edited November 23, 2010 by zenkaidesign

[zenkaidesign]

Spell Effect Schematic

I didn't have time to finish it, I will be updating it over the rest of the day. Please provide any suggestions/feedback/comments.

 

----------------------------------------

Berserk

School: Destruction

Cast Type: Self, Touch

[Edit: Target removed because it disables magic, at range would be overpowered.]

 

Shader: Character turns very dark red

Screen Shader: Similar to night eye, a bit darker, and red instead of blue

 

Duration: Determines how long the effect lasts

Magnitude: Magnitude * 2 is the point value boost to strength and speed effects.

Bonus Factor: Athletics silently maintains stability. Every second a roll takes place, if the roll is under your athletics skill, you won't lose rage.

 

Effect: On cast, you become a very powerful killing machine - fast and strong. Disables magic altogether for the duration, however. It runs a risk of destabilizing. If this happens, the effects breaks and you fall to the ground momentarily. If it completes without destabilizing (based on athletics (i.e. "can your body take it"), you will get the entire duration and will not fall down on dispel.

----------------------------------------

Bubble

School: Restoration

 

Camoflauge - sets bounty to 0 for duration, makes enemies not attack (invisibility)

School: Illusion

 

Channeling

School: Restoration

 

Cutpurse

School: Illusion

 

Disarm

School: Alteration

 

Daedric Intervention

School: Mysticism

 

Damage Life (%)

School: Mysticism

 

Divine Intervention

School: Mysticism

 

Fire Trap

School: Alteration

 

Fire Sprite

School: Destruction

 

Frost Trap

School: Alteration

 

Frost Sprite

School: Destruction

----------------------------------------

Judgement (Death)

School: Conjuration

Cast Type: Self, Touch, Target

Shader: Black with glowing edges

Duration: N/A (Does not have duration)

Magnitude: Magnitude / 5 = %chance to kill. If it "fails", will deal random damage between magnitude / 2 and magnitude.

Bonus Factor: Mysticism has a silent effect of reducing failburn. 75% of mysticism skill = safe fail chance.

Effect: When you cast, it will roll a value for "kill". Success, it displays a message and kills your foe. On failure, it deals random damage based on magnitude, and rolls a value for failburn. If this value is not inside your safe fail chance, you will suffer the normal damage instead of your enemy.

----------------------------------------

Magicka Shield

School: Restoration

----------------------------------------

Portal

School: Mysticism

Cast Type: Self

Shader: N/A

Duration: N/A (Does not have duration)

Magnitude: N/A

Bonus Factor: Trying to make high Conjuration skill lessen cost

Effect: There are two portals (doors). On casting the first time, it moves door A to your current position. On casting again, it moves door B. Then door A, etc. This replaces Mark/Recall as it is much more creative and requires a creative touch. The doors persist. More challenging than Mark/Recall.

Example Spell Name: Shortcut Through Oblivion

----------------------------------------

Pull

School: Mysticism

 

Push

School: Mysticism

 

Reflect Sunlight (vampire prot against sun)

School: Restoration

 

Repel (360 shockwave)

School: Mysticism

 

Sanctuary

School: Illusion

 

Shock Sprite

School: Destruction

 

Shock Trap

School: Destruction

 

Spectral Form

School: Mysticism

 

Stop Action (speed to 0)

School: Illusion

 

Summon Mount

School: Conjuration

 

Summon Wall

School: Conjuration

 

Tangle

School: Conjuration

Edited November 24, 2010 by zenkaidesign

[UmtheMuse]

Earlier, you'd mentioned adding "extra spell." Funny, since I was just thinking that it would be funny to have a "cast random spell" spell effect :tongue: . It would take a spell from your spell book (or possibly any spell in the game, but I would prefer having some control, especially since it rewards dedicated mages better). The spell cost should probably be an average of their other spells to be fair, if this is possible, but I think not having control is a pretty bad drawback. It could even be a spell effect: you might take the basic form and force the mage to keep casting random spells until they are out of magic. Magic Panic Attack, anyone?

 

Berserk--Since I tend to play as some sort of pure mage, I don't have enough experience with this. It sounds like people would need to be shown what it does before deciding whether to use this or not. What I mean is that an important part of why someone would think twice about using this spell in every battle is hidden. I think that we would need some way of revealing that it is indeed balanced by a powerful drawback. For example, you could have this included in a trailer video with an explanation of some sort. Or, you could have a quest where they have to use it (kind of like Henantier's dreamworld, where they can't use their items or spells, but they will be given this spell). Also, why is this Destruction? The boost is Restoration, the flavor feels like a power.

 

Bubble--I can sort of see why you chose restoration, but you might consider alteration. "Alter the fabric of reality," indeed. Same (to a lesser extent) for summon wall (lol, I almost typed whale. That would be hilarious, even if it's not lore friendly).

 

Channeling--When I hear the name channeling, I think "pay over time," not "pay with your blood." Both are interesting, but maybe including the word blood or similar might make it more obvious. Blood channeling? Blood price?

 

Portal--This sounds very cool. I think that we should just keep the name; it's short and describes what the spell effect is supposed to do. As for making Conjuration making it cheaper, you could make conjuration a "silent partner;" i.e. Have the spell include two spell effects. The first would be the Portal spell effect, and the second be a dummy that doesn't do anything but make the spell more effectively. Just lower the first cost to compensate! You could either make a spell effect that has no other purpose other than being the dummy (you might want to have one for each school, just in case) or I think that OBME included a flag to let you use an existing spell effect this way (I'm not even sure why JRoush would do that, or if I read that right in the documentation).

Shock trap is set to a different school than frost and fire traps. I think that the traps should be destruction, with a hidden bonus from alteration.

 

Judgement--at the risk of making an already complicated spell even more complicated, do you want to treat the undead differently? Maybe you could have two versions, one meant for undead (maybe vampires, too) and one for fleshies? Make the spell only affect humanoids/bipedals?

 

About the "smart" version of spells: I think the OBME can do that automatically. The readme said something about including a friendly flag, to go with Vanilla's hostile/neutral set-up. It should be easy enough to have the spell "look" at what it is affecting before doing its thing.

 

Also, this is a bit off topic, but how do you install the OBME? I normally turn my mods into OMODS, but I don't think that works in this case. I followed JRoush's instructions by extracting the RAR into the Oblivion folder (or wherever OBSE is). Then I ended up with another RAR? That can't be right :wacko: Also, it's supposed to come with a couple of example mods, right? I saw them when I tried to make an OMOD of the file, but can't find them now....