New Dismemberment Mod

[HorseWhale]

Hey,

I'm new to the forums and had an intriguing idea for a new kind of dismemberment mod. Basically, when the arm WITHOUT a Pip-Boy on it gets crippled, it should have a chance of being blown off. Severed. Whatever you want to call it. The player would then have to use blood packs or bandages to stop bleeding, and then the player would have to find a clinic and "get" a new arm (arm transplant). This could also go for BOTH legs, so if you get two legs blown off, would have to crawl. And if you didn't have the caps to get a transplant, you could "make" your own prosthetic out of waste material. I think this kind of mod would definitely send a sense of realism and survival into the player's mind.

Please comment if this is a stupid idea or a good one.

[Lazrius]

a good idea however i would think very hard to do.

[HorseWhale]

Agreed. Still, it'd be pretty "sick", figuratively and literally.

[madmongo]

It would be cool but the game really isn't set up for it.

 

Fallout is kinda weird in that it has bodies and it has outfits, but the outfits include body parts. If, for example, you put on an outfit with a T shirt, your arms are visible, but those aren't the arms from the body model. Those arms are included in the outfit model.

 

This means that for every option you want (missing arm, missing legs, whatever) you would need not only separate body models for each of these, but separate clothing meshes for every single piece of clothing, both male and female, with the same options. And then since Fallout isn't designed for this, you need to do some fancy scripts to handle all of the transitions. What happens, for example, if you blow the leg off of a raider and he crawls away and dies later, leaving one boot (and the attached leg) a couple of miles behind him, and then you take his outfit? Are you now missing a boot with that outfit? Now you need even more models.

 

Also, there's no crawling animation that I'm aware of.

 

I would love it if someone would do this, but the amount of work involved is staggering.

[devinpatterson]

I'v looked into doing this and can offer a few insights.

 

It would be cool but the game really isn't set up for it.

In re: to the models, it's well withing hte capability of the engine and the game in general.

 

Fallout is kinda weird in that it has bodies and it has outfits, but the outfits include body parts. If, for example, you put on an outfit with a T shirt, your arms are visible, but those aren't the arms from the body model. Those arms are included in the outfit model.

You have a pretty good interpretation of the way rigged meshes like outfits and armor are used for npcs, but digging a little deeper there is also meatcaps for dismemberment and body part data. So actually virtually all outfits/armor/naked models contain the models (there are a few exceptions like I think the trenchcoat on the detective in the white gloves society) for a missing limb or limbss. It may be possible to leverage this for use in the mod.

 

This means that for every option you want (missing arm, missing legs, whatever) you would need not only separate body models for each of these, but separate clothing meshes for every single piece of clothing, both male and female, with the same options.

So if you went in this direction, the models are very, very easy to set up. I could literally do one per a minute if they were already extracted and ready to import into blender.

 

 

And then since Fallout isn't designed for this, you need to do some fancy scripts to handle all of the transitions.

The script required for this method wouldn't be overly complicated. Essentially your polling a AV, if it's a crippled limb you can decide if it's dimembered at that point or if it needs additional damage/hits, (that part might be a little tricky). But swapping out the model with this missing limb model (once determined it's been dismembered) automatically is a piece of cake.

 

What happens, for example, if you blow the leg off of a raider and he crawls away and dies later, leaving one boot (and the attached leg) a couple of miles behind him, and then you take his outfit? Are you now missing a boot with that outfit? Now you need even more models.

 

Well that's a bit different than what the OP is asking for (as his request applies to the player), but if it's for enemies there's another way, a hack. Essentially you still swap out the model, but your actually resurrecting teh dead actor in the next frame. Although a wrinkle is that a ressurected actor with a missing limb will be reanimated in that same form (although swapping out the model should take care of that floating dismembered limb).

 

In regard to a missing boot or such from a model, the OP is really just focused on the arm, and even if s/he wasn't I would worry about it. You don't need that kind of granularity to have fun with the mod.

 

Also, there's no crawling animation that I'm aware of.

 

It is true we don't have a crawling animation for the player to continue game play, but once again that's not really what the OP is looking for. However you can always force an idle and I suspect somewhere there is a loose kf of crawling that could be used for npcs. I don't know how likely you'll be able to keep the npc in that state if it continues to be attacked. Fallout2AM would be a good person to ask about that.

 

But yes, in general for the player, blowing off a leg is immersion breaking and as such, probably shouldn't be an option.

 

Animations in general is where things get tricky for our player. We can automatically make a weapon drop if a limb is blow off and your using a two handed weapon, and we can prevent two handed weapons from being equipped. However you (or at least I) can't swap left and right arms for weapon animations. Sooooooo that basicly means it's going to have to be the left arm (with the pipboy) that will have to come off if you still want to have any attacks. We can also easily disable the hud via script to simulate the loss of teh pipboy, and it's easy to make a model for the dismembered arm. You could even use it to beat your opponents to death with.

 

For NPCs we can probably have either arm blow off and the simply won't be able to attack if it's the right arm, or just attack via hand to hand (the left arm of the combo landing). We could do the same thing for the player, but most peeps aren't going to be happy if you can't attack except via hand to hand.

 

I would love it if someone would do this, but the amount of work involved is staggering.

 

I could be tedious if you have to convert over all the models (might take an hour or two), and can't leverage the meat caps and body part data directly in the mod, but staggering isn't the term I'd use. I believe it's probably do-able.

[devinpatterson]

OBTW if you want to just blow off the pipboy hand that's even easier. Just a glove that is an invisible mesh with a little gore attached and dropped on the left hand body slot (quest item, can't be removed, include teh preclusion of two handed weapons etc).

[HorseWhale]

I didn't think about enemies reacting without limbs. That's a good idea. Animations would have to be custom (obviously). Lastly, what if you could use one-handed weapons (guns, melee, grenades) while down and only having one arm?

[devinpatterson]

I didn't think about enemies reacting without limbs. That's a good idea. Animations would have to be custom (obviously).

We can't do a animation replacer, it's unrealistic (no one is going to do the animations), and the replacers are all or nothing (overwriting the kfs) so we wouldn't want to. But we can force some idles, like teh crawling I mentioned above, however no change to attack animations.

 

Lastly, what if you could use one-handed weapons (guns, melee, grenades) while down and only having one arm?

That can be simulated if I understand what your describing correctly. It's no problem to use one handed attack animations for the right arm, it's a no go for teh left. It's easy to prevent movement if that's what you mean by "while down" (via disablePlayerControls, which is also how we would disable the pipboy/hud).

[HorseWhale]

What I meant was, if you were "downed" without 2 legs, hypothetically, you could shoot a one-handed gun or knife kinda like in CoD. The player would still be able to access his/her Pip-Boy though.

[devinpatterson]

What I meant was, if you were "downed" without 2 legs,

If both legs were blown off and you were crouched it *might* look ok, but I doubt it. I suspect there would still be some invisible space between the bottom of your torso and the ground.

 

hypothetically, you could shoot a one-handed gun or knife kinda like in CoD. The player would still be able to access his/her Pip-Boy though.

As I mentioned in my two previous posts, if the left arm is blown off you can still use one handed weapon, just like normal (reloading might be a bit of a trick though), but since we can't replace teh animations (no one is going to do left handed animations) we cannot use a weapon (other than hand to hand, because it has an animation that takes advantage of both teh right and left arm as your sluggin) if the right hand is blown off. I don't believe there is any flexibility in this regard, and certainly I don't know a way around it.

 

If the left arm is blown off it makes sense to make it impossible to access your pipboy (unless maybe you pick up the limb and by adding it to inventory it re-enables the piboy.