Thalmor secret

[117649AR]

And who are we to say what the definition of "traditional morality" is when considering the Altmer, let alone considering the Thalmor? Morality is a social construct: one culture's sense of what is moral or immoral is not another's, and our sense of morality is going to be very different from that of a particular political demographic of another culture of another species in a fictional setting. To the Thalmor, the unmaking of Mundus is the ultimate moral act: the removal of mortality, the removal of distinctions that have caused nothing but strife, the removal of suffering, the ascendance of all to the same state of Godhood enjoyed by the Aedra, the Ge, and the Daedra.

 

And mind that not all Elder Scrolls lore is solely present in the games: out-of-game sources comprise the vast bulk of it. The Dwemer became the "golden skin" of the Numidium, interpreted to mean that they collectively became the Oversoul of the Walk Brass. This was their ultimate goal: to become a God capable of destroying a universe that they had deemed false, to them a greater sin than anything. They did not want to live in the "false reality" of a Dream, and thus sought to destroy what they saw as a grand lie.

[kimmera]

And who are we to say what the definition of "traditional morality" is when considering the Altmer, let alone considering the Thalmor? Morality is a social construct: one culture's sense of what is moral or immoral is not another's, and our sense of morality is going to be very different from that of a particular political demographic of another culture of another species in a fictional setting. To the Thalmor, the unmaking of Mundus is the ultimate moral act: the removal of mortality, the removal of distinctions that have caused nothing but strife, the removal of suffering, the ascendance of all to the same state of Godhood enjoyed by the Aedra, the Ge, and the Daedra.

 

And mind that not all Elder Scrolls lore is solely present in the games: out-of-game sources comprise the vast bulk of it. The Dwemer became the "golden skin" of the Numidium, interpreted to mean that they collectively became the Oversoul of the Walk Brass. This was their ultimate goal: to become a God capable of destroying a universe that they had deemed false, to them a greater sin than anything. They did not want to live in the "false reality" of a Dream, and thus sought to destroy what they saw as a grand lie.

 

Oh here we go... the 'morality is all subjective' argument. That, frankly is another cop-out. There are common themes in philosophy regarding morality.

 

By your definition there is no such thing as nihilism, since anyone who might be accused of nihilism considers their beliefs moral and just, at least for them.

 

What exactly are all these out of game sources that are considered canon?

[notmyhome]

I'd say your common Thalmor grunt probably isn't all that excited about that whole "unmaking the world" business, and instead a simple, straight up racist and fascist.

[Lachdonin]

What exactly are all these out of game sources that are considered canon?

 

Well... There's Shor, Son of Shor... Both editions of the Pocket Guide to the Empire, the Nu-Mantua Intercept, the Seven Fights of the Aguludaga (probably spelled that wrong...), KINMUNE, WGT-One, The Trial of Vivec, Pantheon of the Magne'ge... The list goes on.

 

As for who says they're Canon... Kurt, Todd, MK, and Streich (probablly spelled his name wrong)...

 

As for moral subjectivity... We already know it's present in Tamriel, so trying to dismiss it is kind is a self defeating notion...

[kimmera]

 

What exactly are all these out of game sources that are considered canon?

Well... There's Shor, Son of Shor... Both editions of the Pocket Guide to the Empire, the Nu-Mantua Intercept, the Seven Fights of the Aguludaga (probably spelled that wrong...), KINMUNE, WGT-One, The Trial of Vivec, Pantheon of the Magne'ge... The list goes on.

 

As for who says they're Canon... Kurt, Todd, MK, and Streich (probablly spelled his name wrong)...

 

As for moral subjectivity... We already know it's present in Tamriel, so trying to dismiss it is kind is a self defeating notion...

 

 

Hmmm starting at the top, Shor, Son of Shor starts with the following MK quote:

 

 

Shor, son of Shor

Submitted by Lady N on Fri, 07/09/2010 - 11:12

Author:

Michael Kirkbride

Librarian Comment:

From MK:

 

This is a forum fragment, to be taken in the same vein as the posts on the long-ago WWPD? thread. Meaning this is not necessarily true...but if it were, what does it mean?

 

 

 

 

In other words, it is Kirkbride posting myth and legend, not necessarily historical fact.

 

Even to the extent there is such outside lore and it does represent historical fact, it is still trumped by in game lore with respect to that game. Keep in mind that part of the lore is the concept of infinite parallel dimensions. Since in the official lore, the various (PC) heroes weren't simultaneously the leaders of every guild in their respective regions, despite what is not just typically possible in game but what typically happens in large numbers of play-throughs, it follows that in game realities are themselves not part of the main continuity and therefore do not necessarily share identical histories.

 

And yes of course there is moral subjectivity. There is subjectivity in everything, including the existence of light, of gravity, and of the flight speed of coconut laden sparrows. That does not mean there is no such thing as objective reality or more specifically objective morality. Denial of the concept of objective morality is a cop-out used by those who don't want to think about morality, often those who have convinced themselves that morality equates to someone else telling them what to do.

Edited April 23, 2015 by kimmera