Permissions

[Fallout2AM]

I usually don't have the need to discuss about this subject, I tend to not use peculiar resources. Even if I don't hide that when I make a metropolis in NV I would really love to use DC assets, who wouldn't love it?

However these past few days something "different" happened. I'm posting it here in this section because I would like to hear few opinions without making this thing too big.

A friend of mine is finishing his first big mod project, a pretty huge and nice work for New Vegas. Since I'm lending a hand when I can and do few testing, I also share opinions from time to time.
At a certain point in our speech comes out the fact that he used 3 animation files from Fallout 3, which are not present in NV bsas. I warned him that, since he's going to upload the mod, he should remove those assets and find a NV alternative for these animations. With a bit of sadness, because those animations were perfect, he agred. However he still wanted to contact Bethesda (since these come from FO3) to see if there was another alternative.

The answer he obtained was positive: who answered him, told him he could include these files in his mod until the mod has no profit.

Since that answer seemed a bit too much "standard" for me, I asked him to insist with a second mail, because maybe they didn't notice the fact the assets were coming from FO3 on a FONV mod.

The answer was positive the second time too.

Still, I asked him to talk about the fact he wanted to upload the mod on the Nexus, that maybe this could have made a difference for them.

But the answer was positive for the third time, adding that it was a very good idea.

I was somewhat surprised.
Any thoughts about this?

 

PS for curiosity, I'm pasting the emails down here, I will just put few ---- to remove details about my friend and the mod for a matter of respect

MAIL 1 - the request:

Dear sir\madam.
My name is -----.

I make a companion mod for Fallout New Vegas named -----.
Here are some videos:

-----
-----

She has many features which are not present in any companion mod nowadays. Also she has interesting story and characters.
She is 100% ready and I only wait on voice actress to record lines for her voice. (over 2200 lines)

During development of -----I used 3 animations from Fallout3:Broken Steel DLC to make custscenes more cinematographic

File1 : meshes\creatures\smspineb
reaker\idleanims\dlc03fawkeswaitspurity.kf
Video for file 1
-----


File2: meshes\creatures\smspinebreaker\idleanims\specialidle_purifier.kf
Video for file 2
-----

File 3: meshes\characters\_male\idleanims\dlc031stpersonplayerwakeup.kf
Video for file 3
-----
{Player wake up animation}

I haven't got any intention to get money of this mod - it will be absolutely free to download and there will be no "donate" button or else.
I would like to get a permission to use these 3 animation files and I hope you'll respond.

Yours faithfully,
-----

Mail 1 - Answer

Greetings!

Thank you for contacting The Bethesda Softworks Team. My name is Wolfgang.

While we do encourage the use of these creation tools, we do not allow distribution of user-created content for profit. Selling created content within our multiple creation tool sets is a violation of the EULA that is agreed upon before the use of these tools.

Thanks for contacting us and your continued support.

Warm Regards,

Wolfgang V.
Customer Support
Bethesda Softworks

 

Mail 2 - when I asked him to insist

Wolfgang,
Thank you for your respond.
Does your answer mean that I have permission to include these files in mod's package as long as I don't receive any profit for the mod?

Mail 2 - their answer

Hello ----- !

Thank you for your reply. Yes that is correct as long as there is no profit made from these you can use these mods.

If you have any further questions or concerns, please don't hesitate to contact us again.

I wish you all the best and a lovely day!

With warm Regards,
Sarah
The Bethesda Softworks Team

Mail 3 - when he warns about uploading on Nexus

Thanks for the answer, Sarah!

I indeed have one more concern to share. I wish to upload ----- on http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/. Do I have permission to upload mod package (including 3 custom anims) on this site?

Yours faithfully,
-----

Their last answer:

Greetings, -----,

Feel free to use Nexusmods. That's probably the best place for it.

Regards,

Steven
Bethesda Support

 

 

[Millenia]

Tech support can't really give you legally binding permission to use something, you'd need something much more tangible.

[micalov]

Looks more like a generic did not read your mail fully reply in all honesty as they never state you can port them just you can use assets in mods, and mill is correct they cant.

[TheVampireDante]

What to do:

 

1. What you suggested already, find usable replacements for those animations.

 

or

 

2. Remove the animations - but list FO3 as a requirement for the mod and list instructions on how people can add the animations themselves.

 

The second option limits your userbase a little, but it keeps you clear of legal issues while still allowing use of the desired content.

[Fallout2AM]

"Looks more like a generic did not read your mail fully reply" - I had the same feeling, that's why I asked him to insist, so that they (hopefully) could put a lil more attention to the specific situation, but even the next answers gave me the same feeling. I'll message my friend and I'll past your answers, thank you very much

[DrakeTheDragon]

The 1st one didn't read the mail at all and didn't address any of the points in their 'response'.

The 2nd one did neither know the original mail nor the other support's response to it.

And the 3rd one didn't pay attention to any of this but the last line of the last mail.

 

Contradicting their own corporation's EULA and allowing free redistribution of pay-for-download DLC contents included under license terms by a third party... that's a new level. And all 3 agreed! :ohmy:

 

(I wonder what would happen, if someone showed these conversations to GStaff now... would he roll on the floor laughing the rest of the day... or raise the alarms with the legal department and get some support seats 'replaced'? Not that anybody should do it, just genuinely wondering here. The damages caused would those responses be followed, or the wrong parties stumbled upon them by accident, if you think about it, though... unbelievable. Shows why they really can't ever give these permissions, if they don't even know what it is they're granting!)

[Jokerine]

~time to port all of Fallout 3 into NV now, ALL OF IT~

 

JK of course pls don't ban

[Fallout2AM]

 

The damages caused would those responses be followed, or the wrong parties stumbled upon them by accident, if you think about it, though... unbelievable. Shows why they really can't ever give these permissions, if they don't even know what it is they're granting!)

 

if it was happening to me, irl, at work for example, after the first warning (because everyone can make mistakes, reason why I asked him to send more mails like "are you really SURE of what you are stating?"...), maybe I would have taken advantage of the situation >>> Ipse dixit, they said so, you can't blame me.

 

But there's no place for this all, there's no place for sharks and jackals in modding, it's just the nice pretty perfect world I love and I hope it will always remain in this way. Anyway, without digressing... I was just warned he decided to replace with other files, I guess he too didn't see very serious those answers from Beth

[Thaiauxn]

Oof. I think like Mil said, Tech Support can't give legal advice. The right person to ask would be Nexus staff, and their answer is going to be no. I had to make that decision going from F3 to NV. Lost a lot of s#*!. But the act of working around that limitation made the content better.

 

With an animation, that's just narrative. You can always write around it. Good storytelling adapts quickly to changing circumstances.

[Zaldir]

From GStaff:

 

"That doesn't sound like something we would have granted permission on.

 

Let me look into it."

 

So most likely not, anyway.