Health Care Bill's Constutionalty

[marharth]

I will go ahead and say this, I DO NOT THINK YOU SHOULD HAVE MANDATORY INSURANCE.

 

But this bill did nothing of the sort.

 

I think you should be able to go into a government insurance program, so your rates can be low and you will always have insurance without question.

You evidently have not read the Bill, either you have insurance or you face monetary and civil penalties levied against you.....read the Bill if you are going to post about it. The mandatory portion of the bill is what was declared unconstitutional in the recent federal ruling.

 

"Judge Vinson argued that this is an atypical case in which the individual mandate is so “inextricably bound” to the remaining provisions that it cannot be severed.The core of these cases is whether Congress has the power to require people to buy health insurance.In his 78-page opinion, Judge Vinson held that the insurance requirement exceeded the regulatory powers granted to Congress under the Commerce Clause of the Constitution. He wrote that the provision could not be rescued by an associated clause in Article I that gives Congress broad authority to make laws “necessary and proper” to carrying out its designated responsibilities. "

Post the exact words and a source that the bill has in it that makes it so you have to buy health insurance.

 

If that is there, which I didn't see, post the section of the Constitution that it collides with.

 

 

"In 2014, everyone must purchase health insurance or face a $695 annual fine. There are some exceptions for low-income people."`~ Source CBS News

If you read my post it's constitutionality is in question with the Commerce Clause of the Constitution. It's not my purview to do your research, use a search engine it will only take you a few minutes, less time than you use to post without bothering to be accurately informed. This is a complicated subject and it does affect you, take an interest in your government and how it affects you.

I didn't say a news source, I said the section in the bill that requires you to purchase insurance, as well as the source for where you got the bill.

 

Also the section in the constitution that it would violate.

[Harbringe]

Unfortunately, as much as I would now like to provide a bright, shining answer, I must come up short. I have run out of answers for today. But I am still thinking on it.

 

Ooh Ooh up here Canada youhoo bright and shiny answer.72% public option ,28% private insurance (Dental and electives ,hey if you want a nice smile or bigger boobs pay for them yourself) .Only 9.9 - 10.1 % of our GDP in cost vs 15.6 - 16.7 of your GDP in costs , depending who you listen to.Despite what Insurance lobbyists and the like would have you believe there are no Death Panels in Canada ,all decisions are made locally as in my Doctor has the final power and if I don't like what he says I can go get another Doctors opinion.We don't have rationing its done on a need basis ,in fact if you look at the rate of denied claims in the US insurance industry its you who have rationing ,which is what Bben is describing (google it you will be stunned).Health costs are the number one reason for bankruptcy in the US ,not here in Canada and who shows up when you go bankrupt ,insurers ,bankers and their lawyers.Wow talk about earning a buck on the flip side.As for quality of care the last meta study I looked at had Canada leading in 11 categories ,the US in 7 ,and we were tied in 4.In fact our systems are so close in nature that prior to us switching a Canadian could be in the States and use his Canadian health insurer in an American hospital and an American could do the same in a Canadian hospital ,after 1971 it all changed.

 

The whole health care thing isn't something new in the US ,it was FDR who first proposed it but the caveat was first WW 2 had to be won and after you would get health care ,same thing here in Canada ,but after the war FDR was dead and the health insurers said oh no don't worry we can deliver ,well here in Canada we waited 25 years for them to deliver and finally we said enough is enough ,your not delivering ,meanwhile you in the US have been waiting for 65 years and you still haven't gotten what they promised ,so really how much longer are you going to wait ,20 , 40 ,60 years ,when do you say enough is enough.That's the only real difference between Canada and the US we stopped waiting.

 

As for the Constitutionality of the current bill ,I don't even think it matters (though I lean toward it being unconstitutional) still I voted undecided because likely it will be a lot of political noise and thunder that will signify nothing ,because that is exactly where the health insurers want it ,leaves them free to keep on keeping on and making oodles of money.

I've been going to Canada every summer since I was a little girl, and my family would spend the summers on a cabin by a lake. We met a family that lived nearby there, one of which was an older man named George. He was a great guy and well liked by everybody.

Well he had a cancerous tumor the size of a tennis ball coming out of his shoulder, he went to the hospital, and was put on an 8 month waiting list. Sad thing is, there was a good chance he could have lived if he had gotten treated on time, but instead he never lived the eight months.

My point is, if thats what universal health care is like, then I sure don't want it as a law passed in my country, considering what I've seen it do to Canada's.

 

Well then that was a misdiagnoses , my mother got lymph cancer 3 years ago and she was in the hospital in 6 weeks having her entire face removed ,parts of her jawbone cut away and her face put back on ,quite frankly it near killed her .Subsequent to that she went through 3 months of Chemo (Yes she pulled through it).My brother this past summer had a heart attack ,the next day he was over in Halifax getting operated on .!0 years ago my lung collapsed within 5 min of walking in the Hospital I was in an examining room having a hole cut into my chest.Seriously I hear the stories of horror wait times from Americans all the time about Canada's wait times but I have 5 sisters ,1 brother ,more cousins ,nieces and nephews than I can shake a stick at and what people describe from across the border as to what our wait times are like is just not what my experience is with in my life time and of any one I know.It's just not and this coming from Canada's smallest and poorest province.

[Aurielius]

I didn't say a news source, I said the section in the bill that requires you to purchase insurance, as well as the source for where you got the bill.

Also the section in the constitution that it would violate.

 

I'm afraid you are beyond debating with, you do not want to do any of your own research, you do not read previous posts well enough to understand what is being said and yet you persist in posting the same questions no matter what way the same facts are laid before you. The essence of a debate is being at least slightly informed on the topic in question which the evidence of your posts indicates that you are not. (polite exasperation) I could reverse this process and ask to to prove your unfounded statements but that would be a waste of time.

 

1 )The clause that is considered unconstitutional is the mandatory requirement to purchase health care insurance or face civil fines.

 

2) The mandatory requirement violates the Commerce Clause of the Constitution.

 

3) •HR 3590 (Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act) , look it up for yourself. Though I highly doubt that you will.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c111:5:./temp/~c111SvUssE:

[marharth]

I didn't say a news source, I said the section in the bill that requires you to purchase insurance, as well as the source for where you got the bill.

Also the section in the constitution that it would violate.

 

I'm afraid you are beyond debating with, you do not want to do any of your own research, you do not read previous posts well enough to understand what is being said and yet you persist in posting the same questions no matter what way the same facts are laid before you. The essence of a debate is being at least slightly informed on the topic in question which the evidence of your posts indicates that you are not. (polite exasperation) I could reverse this process and ask to to prove your unfounded statements but that would be a waste of time.

 

1 )The clause that is considered unconstitutional is the mandatory requirement to purchase health care insurance or face civil fines.

 

2) The mandatory requirement violates the Commerce Clause of the Constitution.

 

3) •HR 3590 (Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act) , look it up for yourself. Though I highly doubt that you will.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c111:5:./temp/~c111SvUssE:

Your saying its in the bill and can't quote the text in the bill, your the one not presenting facts. If its so easy to look up then it should be easy to post the exact text.

 

How do you think it violates the commerce clause?

[Aurielius]

@martharth

I have done everything but spoon feed you the information. Unlike you I have quoted sources, federal rulings and news analysis, whereas you have done nothing but spout your opinion backed by nothing more than ignorance of the facts. There was a link to the Health Care Bill of which you evidently did not want to avail yourself of. I am willing to bet that you do not know what the Commerce Clause is either, though looking it up would be a simple affair. If you are ignorant of all relevant facts in a debate why do you continue to post, unless it is to hear the sound of your own voice. This was supposed to be a debate on Health Care not a dialog with a petulant willful student.

[myrmaad]

LOL.

 

Why do you think this law is going to be reviewed by the Supreme Court? Because Constitutional experts do not even agree.

 

I got a good belly laugh over you guys trying to wrestle with it though. Locked.