Fallout 4 scepticism...

[JimboUK]

I'm not buying it at release to be sure. Its the sad state of gaming now a days. I miss the days you could buy a game and bugs were rare.

 

I'll be buying FO4 after all patches and in a sale. By then there will be some good quality of life type mods out there too.

 

That's probably what I'm going to do, my experience with Skyrim has put me off.

[RelicDuDe]

Everyone that is a Fallout fan, knows he/she is going to buy this game... so stop fooling yourself and buy it already....

 

We all expect it to be buggy... and it most likely will be. But that will not stop us from buying this game however, and you know it.

 

If it even touches a quarter of the fun i had with Fallout 3... it will be worth double the price. Fallout 3 was 7-8 years ago... and i am still playing it.. not many games have survived that long without un-installing in my Library. (except for the occasionally re-install because i had foocked it up with too many mods...;)

 

 

In fact, Out of the nearly 200 games i own on steam,... the only ones are:

 

Fallout 3.

Dragon age Origins.

Left 4 Dead. (The original, not the console kiddy's crap sequel)

Divinity 2

Half Life 2 (with the cinematic mod)

Skyrim.

 

So.. yeah... I already own Fallout 4.. how about you ?....

 

 

Hail Bethcrashda !!!....

 

 

(Maybe we should build a shrine to them..... no seriously.)

[thunderlord2200]

 

 

Fallout 4 will have bugs, but it's to be expected of a large open-world game developed by a relatively small team.

 

Do I think Fallout 4 will be awesome? F*** yeah, it's gonna rock! Got a problem with graphics? Mod them. Got a problem with the voiced protagonist? Mod it out. Want to tweak your game to be a paradise with rainbows and chocolate fountains? Then damn bloody well mod it. That's the beauty of Bethesda games! :D

 

If Fallout 4 didn't have mods? Then I wouldn't be looking forward to it quite as much. I'd still get it, but I wouldn't be hyped.

Sure, and get CTD every 5 minutes with broken saves every 10 :D

 

 

Yeah, but mostly that's the user's fault. As long as you be careful with the mods you install, you can still maintain a stable game. I have over 200 plugins for Skyrim, a high quality ENB and I get a stable 50-60 frames and hardly ever crash. You have to be meticulous with your installation. :wink:

 

and thats why we have DLC now and EA is the worst of the worst. look how many DLCS they force down gamers throughts to the point we are getting wrose the bare bone games. (sims 4)

[JimboUK]

Everyone that is a Fallout fan, knows he/she is going to buy this game... so stop fooling yourself and buy it already....

 

We all expect it to be buggy... and it most likely will be. But that will not stop us from buying this game however, and you know it.

 

If it even touches a quarter of the fun i had with Fallout 3... it will be worth double the price. Fallout 3 was 7-8 years ago... and i am still playing it.. not many games have survived that long without un-installing in my Library. (except for the occasionally re-install because i had foocked it up with too many mods... :wink:

 

 

In fact, Out of the nearly 200 games i own on steam,... the only ones are:

 

Fallout 3.

Dragon age Origins.

Left 4 Dead. (The original, not the console kiddy's crap sequel)

Divinity 2

Half Life 2 (with the cinematic mod)

Skyrim.

 

So.. yeah... I already own Fallout 4.. how about you ?....

 

 

Hail Bethcrashda !!!....

 

 

(Maybe we should build a shrine to them..... no seriously.)

 

Speak for yourself, there are plenty of Fallout fans who were not impressed with FO3 and are thus more than a little sceptical of FO4. I can't understand why anyone really looking forward to FO4 would want their first playthrough ruined by bugs and crashes? why not wait until it's been patched a few times? it only takes a little self control.

[Vagrant0]

- Less Events happening in the world (Loss of Radiant AI)

 

To be honest, none of their games really made use of the Radiant AI. FO:NV got the closest since it was handled by an outside team that structured their game in a less "sandboxy" way. But even that implementation was very minimal. The system allows for the world to behave dynamically around events, have NPCs do things without the player watching or even being aware of them until they're done. It can be used to add consequences for not completing a quest on time, make NPCs move around and attend to their own needs, have their own stories that are not obvious to the player. The reason why it wasn't used is pretty clear, time and budget. As more and more of the game became developed solely around the players actions and experience for sake of production concerns, NPCs became more simplistic. In short, all the capability was never utilized. Even the very basic things it allowed were rarely used since most NPCs just stood in the same exact spot all the time or became a nuisance to track down when you needed them.

[minimax1]

The first Bethesda game i played was Fallout 3...

adding mods to the game was brand new experience and it was awesome, graphics enhacements and script extension mods.These two alternate the visual and the gameplay, what else could a gamer could ask than to bring a game to his/her own tastes.

Of course i played Fallout New Vegas and Skyrim...hundreds of hours spent...maybe thousands if you add the three games together and the time spent in mod searching , installing , testing crashing and all the way from the start.

it was addictive as hell!!!!!!!!

so with FAllout 4 coming out....i know i will get a buggy game from Bethesda but being patient enough for some patches to come out and the contribution from creative modders who share their fabulous work,(we all simple gamers thank you for your creativity and efforts)this game is going to be much enjoyed i think from most of the people who like to "mess" with an open world RPG that can have more than one playthroughs and dont get bored...

[RelicDuDe]

 

Everyone that is a Fallout fan, knows he/she is going to buy this game... so stop fooling yourself and buy it already....

 

We all expect it to be buggy... and it most likely will be. But that will not stop us from buying this game however, and you know it.

 

If it even touches a quarter of the fun i had with Fallout 3... it will be worth double the price. Fallout 3 was 7-8 years ago... and i am still playing it.. not many games have survived that long without un-installing in my Library. (except for the occasionally re-install because i had foocked it up with too many mods... :wink:

 

 

In fact, Out of the nearly 200 games i own on steam,... the only ones are:

 

Fallout 3.

Dragon age Origins.

Left 4 Dead. (The original, not the console kiddy's crap sequel)

Divinity 2

Half Life 2 (with the cinematic mod)

Skyrim.

 

So.. yeah... I already own Fallout 4.. how about you ?....

 

 

Hail Bethcrashda !!!....

 

 

(Maybe we should build a shrine to them..... no seriously.)

 

Speak for yourself, there are plenty of Fallout fans who were not impressed with FO3 and are thus more than a little sceptical of FO4. I can't understand why anyone really looking forward to FO4 would want their first playthrough ruined by bugs and crashes? why not wait until it's been patched a few times? it only takes a little self control.

 

 

 

Nope... I play Skyrim.. what.. like 4-5 years now ?... There are still bugs in it... even "floating bugs" as i call them.. that is: sometimes they happen.. sometimes they do not, differers from play-through to play-through. without any load order changes.

 

Fallout 3 had bugs.. it still does... The Unofficial Fallout patch people solved many of them.. they do wonders.. but in doing so, created new ones that where never in the game before. I play with the Wanderers edition and with Mats Mutant mod on Max difficulty... you haven't lived until you walk in a scarcely lit metro tunnel.. and suddenly get jumped by 200 very angry feral ghouls of various strengths and size... the stuff of night mares.

 

Run.. or fight ?...

 

Oh, and the Raiders decide to help the feral ghouls.. while also still fighting them themselves.. Feral ghouls don't care, they'll fight everyone and anyone.. you only try to stay alive...perhaps a few nearby super mutants join the party... Chaos for everyone !....

 

Oh man.. I have had some memorable fights indeed.

 

Oh yeah.. and next to those.. another 60 or so mods, and an ENB... basically to make the game look better and be way more difficult.. oh.. and some Armour and a few weapon mods.. but trust me, with my set-up.. you'll need them. So please don't tell me Fallout 3 is no good.. I found it so good, that It hooked me to RPG's... and i was a hardcore FPS gamer.

 

Okay... Maybe YOU don't like it, fair enough.. I absolutely hate Fallout NV... not many people will agree with me.. so be it. What i am saying.. is.. There will always be bugs in a new game or an older...its part of gaming.

 

So why wait ?...

 

Besides... Maybe you have the time to wait, but i potentially do not, and i want to play Fallout 4 before its too late for me to do so..

[RelicDuDe]

The first Bethesda game i played was Fallout 3...

adding mods to the game was brand new experience and it was awesome, graphics enhacements and script extension mods.These two alternate the visual and the gameplay, what else could a gamer could ask than to bring a game to his/her own tastes.

Of course i played Fallout New Vegas and Skyrim...hundreds of hours spent...maybe thousands if you add the three games together and the time spent in mod searching , installing , testing crashing and all the way from the start.

it was addictive as hell!!!!!!!!

so with FAllout 4 coming out....i know i will get a buggy game from Bethesda but being patient enough for some patches to come out and the contribution from creative modders who share their fabulous work,(we all simple gamers thank you for your creativity and efforts)this game is going to be much enjoyed i think from most of the people who like to "mess" with an open world RPG that can have more than one playthroughs and dont get bored...

 

 

XXX Game makers put out a really good game, that crashes with every door you go trough. Freezes in almost any fight... and have dumb-ass NPC's that don't even remember the only 2 lines they have to say.

 

Nexus modders that turn an almost unplayable game into a master piece... a sight to behold.

 

 

I wanna be there when it happens for Fallout 4.

[AfroAttack]

 

- Less Events happening in the world (Loss of Radiant AI)

 

To be honest, none of their games really made use of the Radiant AI. FO:NV got the closest since it was handled by an outside team that structured their game in a less "sandboxy" way. But even that implementation was very minimal. The system allows for the world to behave dynamically around events, have NPCs do things without the player watching or even being aware of them until they're done. It can be used to add consequences for not completing a quest on time, make NPCs move around and attend to their own needs, have their own stories that are not obvious to the player. The reason why it wasn't used is pretty clear, time and budget. As more and more of the game became developed solely around the players actions and experience for sake of production concerns, NPCs became more simplistic. In short, all the capability was never utilized. Even the very basic things it allowed were rarely used since most NPCs just stood in the same exact spot all the time or became a nuisance to track down when you needed them.

 

 

??? I know Follower Takes of Trip (think thats what the mod is called) touches base on that, but based on the Creation Kit engine from what I've seen, a player IS REQUIRED to be present inorder for specific cells to actually activate and do anything.

 

http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/3235409-npc-that-i-made-travels-to-dungeon-but-doesnt-actually-kill-anything-on-its-way/

 

This is actually something I'm trying to work on right now, but in this engine so far from what I've seen it isn't possible / hard to implement that feature. I'm a novice, but even with mods that exist now I haven't seen this technique being used at all to push quests or NPC content.

 

On topic, this is one of the things I'm afraid of for Fallout 4, because its using an enhanced version for the CK.

 

 

And no company has ever made it an issue to focus alot of resource on AI or making NPC's more than just signposts for players in an open world setting.

Edited October 13, 2015 by AfroAttack

[Vagrant0]

 

 

- Less Events happening in the world (Loss of Radiant AI)

 

To be honest, none of their games really made use of the Radiant AI. FO:NV got the closest since it was handled by an outside team that structured their game in a less "sandboxy" way. But even that implementation was very minimal. The system allows for the world to behave dynamically around events, have NPCs do things without the player watching or even being aware of them until they're done. It can be used to add consequences for not completing a quest on time, make NPCs move around and attend to their own needs, have their own stories that are not obvious to the player. The reason why it wasn't used is pretty clear, time and budget. As more and more of the game became developed solely around the players actions and experience for sake of production concerns, NPCs became more simplistic. In short, all the capability was never utilized. Even the very basic things it allowed were rarely used since most NPCs just stood in the same exact spot all the time or became a nuisance to track down when you needed them.

 

 

??? I know Follower Takes of Trip (think thats what the mod is called) touches base on that, but based on the Creation Kit engine from what I've seen, a player IS REQUIRED to be present inorder for specific cells to actually activate and do anything.

 

http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/3235409-npc-that-i-made-travels-to-dungeon-but-doesnt-actually-kill-anything-on-its-way/

 

This is actually something I'm trying to work on right now, but in this engine so far from what I've seen it isn't possible / hard to implement that feature. I'm a novice, but even with mods that exist now I haven't seen this technique being used at all to push quests or NPC content.

 

On topic, this is one of the things I'm afraid of for Fallout 4, because its using an enhanced version for the CK.

 

 

And no company has ever made it an issue to focus a lot of resource on AI or making NPC's more than just signposts for players in an open world setting.

 

There are some things they can do... Pick up objects, put down objects, activate levers or other things, ect. And some things which they cannot, such as fight. The reason for this is fairly simple, anything that NPCs do without the player watching has to be something, and usually things that are in a fixed predictable state before and after that action was performed. In the case of an NPC fighting things along a road between encounters, this really does not fit into those requirements. First off, those encounters might not have even been spawned since the leveled spawning mechanics require the player to load the cell before anything is spawned. Second, even in the case of fixed spawns, combat behavior is handled by different systems than just moving a character around and has many more variables involved. At best you could have the player come upon them fighting something if the pathgrid node the NPC was on at the time of entering the player's loaded area was near enemies. Or disabling fixed spawns as the NPC passes through certain points. But both of these essentially require some degree of advanced knowledge and setting up the scene you want the player to see.

 

From a game design standpoint though, most of that is unnecessary. If you're the one making the game, you don't need NPCs out fighting things on their own beyond the scope of the player's vision. You only need to show the aftermath (bodies everywhere) or show the fighting in progress. For anything else you could just simulate the desired result. And for both those cases of things you want to show, you don't even need a detailed AI since both are essentially just scenery and having complicated processing devoted to scenery means less processing for other things.