Keeping it "real"

[Telyn]

I think you need a custom torches mod to run the combined one.

[MarkInMKUK]

Maybe - the ones on the torch mod may count as custom as they have adjusted life and light output. If not, I'll use the two separate mods.

 

Another realism mod we need - sight adjustment to darkness/light, with the appropriate delay. Now THAT would be fun - especially if YOU had something to make you immune and your enemy didn't - run out of the cave, turn, and slaughter them.

[Striker879]

Maybe - the ones on the torch mod may count as custom as they have adjusted life and light output. If not, I'll use the two separate mods.

 

Another realism mod we need - sight adjustment to darkness/light, with the appropriate delay. Now THAT would be fun - especially if YOU had something to make you immune and your enemy didn't - run out of the cave, turn, and slaughter them.

Something to keep in mind on this idea (and I do like it) is that torches will need to negate your dark adapt when they are used, and it will take some time to gain or regain your night sight after using one. In caves and dungeons without any light sources the night sight should be zero effect, so that the night effect is proportional to the available light level. Even outdoors, it should be tied to sky conditions and moon phases. This would perhaps make an effective spot for tweaking the vanilla night-eye effect ... tie it's effectiveness to available light, so that it boosts your 'natural' night sight (without the annoying black and white effect ... although all night sight should include some chromatic reduction now that I think of it).

 

A further note on goblins. In the vanilla game they are clannish, and where scripted to meet (as in Goblin Trouble) they will fight one another.

Edited April 18, 2011 by Striker879

[MarkInMKUK]

I was thinking much the same way on night sight and adjustment to darkness. Torches should certainly have quite an effect on your night sight - and should also "turn off" the Khajiit night-eye effect (and maybe be over-bright for those without a natural ability who are using a spell version?)

 

For Khajiits or wearers of "permenant night-eye" items, I was thinking a gentle transition to a monochrome look for the night-eye, probably by de-saturating colour and then adjusting darkness and gamma levels. I considered a greenish tint like night-sight goiggles but it looks too much like the default lighting in Ayleid ruins. Settings probably configurable by the user and held in an ini file. Possibly based on Khajiit Auto Night-Eye. Something based on this script could trigger the "slow adjust" phase of a light level change I'm sure.

 

There are alternative night-eye shaders around which I may try out once I have the spell or an object that gives me the ability - Less Overpowered Nighteye looks interesting as it also gives a mask effect to your field of vision, and some of the options in Nighteye Shader Replacement look very interesting too

 

Making actors in caves use torches has a few knock-on effects - the droppable torches have to work for them too, or you could get an excessive number of suicidal drops in the dark where npc's see you, grab their weapons, and run over a chasm edge... You may still get them, depending on WHERE they drop the torch :)

Edited April 18, 2011 by MarkInMKUK

[MarkInMKUK]

OK - the rest of my tutorial run-through with realism mods in place.

 

I didn't find an "improved" lockpicking mod that suited me, so stuck with vanilla. I'm not quite sure WHAT would improve it for me, although I may try the lockpick crafting mods later. Anyway, to continue...

 

Following the discussion above, I installed Dungeon Actors Have Torches 1.6 and Exterior Actors use Torches with minor fixes 1.32. I then worked my way through to the log pile, in sneak, carrying katana and torch. As the area was lit by torch and firelight, I put out the torch and snuck towards the pile - got spotted ... pushed and rolled the logs. Looted the corpses and chest, then on towards the goblin cave.

 

Staying well back, I swapped to the rusty iron bow. Waited til the first goblin was close then took him out with a single shot - remembering to aim a little high as Duke Patrick's oombat archery mod seems to make arrows drop more than vanilla Oblivion. Obviously his screech was still not enough to alert the other goblins. Picked off the other two "normal" goblins, then lined up to shoot the goblin witch. Shot - hit - and because of Duke Patricks Actors can miss now mod, he managed to miss me totally with the responding fireball and lightning. Killed by second shot.

 

Worked through to the Inperial Subterrene, and then noticed one effect of the Dungeon Actors Have Torches mod - nearly every Mythic Dawn assassin was preceded by a bright yellow glow as they were all carrying torches :)

 

Out to the sewer, where apart from the allowance for arrow drop, everything was as vanilla Oblivion.

 

Saved at sewer exit.

 

The main way this has differed from my "normal" run at the tutorial is I had to rely on my sword, and hardly used my bow except in the lit goblin cave. Once I get some kind of night eye ability I'll revert to my normal modus operandi, but til then I'm forced to use a blade :( - not an entirely happy camper at that. However, it DID make it more difficult and more "realistic" which is the whole aim.

Edited April 18, 2011 by MarkInMKUK

[Telyn]

Did you like the dungeon actors having torches? For me that one and the exterior actor ones have become must haves. Somewhere there is a mod that does vision adapting to darkness. I know I have seen it. Maybe it was reviewed by Arwen. I will check.

[MarkInMKUK]

For me, the "sneaky assassins with torches" made it less immersive, not more. Maybe an additional filter on the system to not use torches if in the subterrene area would do it for the tutorial. It's something I need to think about. Basically, anyone with a torch is an obvious and easy target, and has lost their night sight adaptation, so it's not as obvious as a realism mod as one might think. If you find that "eyes adjust to darkness" mod I'll try it as an alternative - I have savegames (of course).

 

Next two things to add - an Eating / drinking / sleeping mod (as yet undecided which one), and the Inventory is a backpack mod, and probably the Portable Campsite mod too. Obviously i won't be running those til I've sold my loot off. I'm also installing TheNiceOne's Enhanced Economy mod, so it makes it sensible to shop around when selling gear.

Edited April 19, 2011 by MarkInMKUK

[Mortrix927]

If no one else has recommended: (I'm not reading 5 pages of posts to look for a needle in a stack of needles)

 

1. Install COBL

2. Real Hunger (you just turn it on from within COBL)

3. Harvest Flora

4. Duke Patrick's Basic Hypothermia

5. Obscuro's Oblivion Overhaul (almost goes without saying)

6 All Natural

7. Better Cities. (Comes with TNO's Enhanced Economy, plus new shops, so be careful here

8. Most of the above require Wrye Bash, so get that too.

9. Also in COBL, you can turn on COBL races, which will make your "abilities" actually be "abilities". IE Argonians breath underwater w/o having to cast anything, Khajiit see in the dark, and so on.

Edited April 19, 2011 by dallen68

[MarkInMKUK]

Hi dallen,

 

I'm trying to avoid COBL at the moment, as a lot of people don't like the "adds loads of stuff" type mods, and even though it's a resource many people see it that way. I certainly intend to try another few setups, and one of those may well be COBL based.

 

Harvest Flora is a "must have" for me (I've installed it almost without thinking this time) - although I've never yet managed to get the "no mushroom stalks" bit working.

 

I may well install the Basic Hypothermia mod a little later on - not sure yet.

 

I'm also avoiding OOO, MMM, etc for one simple reason - they change too many things at once. I use them for my normal game play though, I have a full FCOM install .

 

Better Cities I have lumped in with Unique Landscapes - sure they add lots of stuff, but they don't actually alter the gameplay and that's what this is mostly about. If I start to run low on ESP slots the few cosmetic mods I have installed will all come back out too.

 

I'll look at alternatives to COBL Races, but as I'm not running an Argonian or Khajiit at the moment, it's less relevant.

 

Thanks for the ideas and input though, and welcome to the discussion.

[Telyn]

COBL isn't an all or nothing install. You can choose what features to use. I disabled the TNR stuff because of google eyes. COBL plays nicely with others, very configurable.