Let's talk about the challenges of modding with a voiced protagonist

[Belthan]

 

And not really OT but being able to walk away from a conversation (player or NPC just walking away) is annoying as hell. :tongue:

 

 

Maybe not so off-topic. Jeff's theory is that all the game's dialogue problems are a ripple effect from the decision not have a "frozen" world in the background when the player is in a conversation. If combat can start while you're talking, you need to be able to break it off even if there's no "goodbye" option. The logic to remember what lines a player has already heard, and resume any previous conversation in the middle, would be unmanageable. That required radical oversimplification of the dialog tree. And that made voicing the protagonist feasible. I'm not sure I buy the last point, but then it becomes a "chicken and egg" question. Even if the decision to voice the protagonist came first, you can run the same line of reasoning in reverse.

[llamaRCA]

 

I don't know what's involved in splicing the vanilla PC dialogue, but it honestly sounds like it'd be more pain than it's worth. Not only would you have to do that for both Nate and Nora, but I'm pretty sure out of the 13K+ lines, at least 10k are the amazingly simple, one-word lines like "yup", "alright" and "good". Very rarely does the PC say anything of value, in my experience.. Finding enough to work with sounds like a pain in the neck.

 

I've pulled out about 2k lines for the player that I think can easily be reused. They are reusable specifically because they are the more generic lines (I could have pulled out more, because there are many variations on the yes, no, maybe, go on, etc line, but how many variations of those simple ideas does one need? Players aren't going to be fooled into thinking, "let's do that later" and "actually, let's do that later" are meaningfully different lines of dialogue).

 

 

And not really OT but being able to walk away from a conversation (player or NPC just walking away) is annoying as hell. :tongue:

 

I find this annoying too for a lot of reasons. I don't like how finicky the distance is to trigger convos with them, I don't like how easily convos are inadvertently interrupted by either the player or NPC moving around and I don't like their naggy remarks when the conversation is broken and it wasn't my fault. I mean yeah, I walk away and it's a problem. But if you're talking to someone else why do I have to stand right next to you while you drone on and on at another NPC. You want me there, force me into position. The whole free-roaming dialogue thing is rife with issues.

[Belthan]

Draft script for Vidi, Vici, Veni :

 

Player: <Short cough>

The Handler: Hello. I'm a mysterious woman with a troubled past. Will you help?

Player: Yup.

The Handler: Of course, you'll need to deduce my secrets and motivations from subtle inconsistencies in my story.

Player: Alright.

The Handler: So... questions? <sigh> Fine. [ten minutes of exposition later] Now do you understand why I had to return to the Commonwealth?

Player: Yup.

The Handler: Look, here are some coordinates. Just go kill everyone and blow things up, okay?

Player: I have to go.

The Handler: Wow. And I thought The Stag was brain-damaged.

[rickerhk]

Draft script for Vidi, Vici, Veni :

 

Player: <Short cough>

The Handler: Hello. I'm a mysterious woman with a troubled past. Will you help?

Player: Yup.

The Handler: Of course, you'll need to deduce my secrets and motivations from subtle inconsistencies in my story.

Player: Alright.

The Handler: So... questions? <sigh> Fine. [ten minutes of exposition later] Now do you understand why I had to return to the Commonwealth?

Player: Yup.

The Handler: Look, here are some coordinates. Just go kill everyone and blow things up, okay?

Player: I have to go.

The Handler: Wow. And I thought The Stag was brain-damaged.

You forgot to throw a "Player: [sarcastic] Yup" somewhere in there for some variety. :)

That does a good job of illustrating the problem of re-using vanilla voice clips.

[llamaRCA]

Plan A) Hire Brian and Courtenay. That may sound ludicrous, but here's how I look at it. I subscribe enthusiastically to the DIY ethic. I don't pay for anything I can get free or build myself (I use GIMP instead of Photoshop, Blender instead of 3ds Max, etc.) but I'm just as passionate about modding as my neighbor is about golf. A few hours of Brian and Courtenay's time would be expensive, but it would still cost less than my neighbor spends on clubs, green fees, etc. If a modder can't afford it out of pocket, they could try Kickstarter or other crowdfunding. So, I approached Courtenay's agent and got a somewhat encouraging response, contingent on receiving approval from Bethsoft. Unfortunately, I am getting a massive run-around from Bethsoft.

 

Did Beth ever get back to you about this?

 

 

I've been trying to write some dialogue reusing vanilla lines to see how it would go. It's miserable.

[minngarm]

The voice issue is hamstringing anyone wanting to get into quest and companion creation as most issues have already been illustrated in the thread. I for one have already decided if I do one it will be without voices for dialogue period. There is just no way to have intricate conversations based on events and character stats with the current system, and most of us do not have the luxury funds available to hire even a no name for voice acting.

 

Beyond that the running joke of computer voiced MC is great, that could work quite well, but you would have trouble explaining the other characters as well.

 

Of course if you want to hit up several art colleges you can find students willing to do the voice acting work for the credit on their resume so that could easily be an option. On top of that I'm sure there are a number of us who would also do small bit parts as well.

[Belthan]

Did Beth ever get back to you about this?

 

 

I've been trying to write some dialogue reusing vanilla lines to see how it would go. It's miserable.

 

 

Escalation manager finally referred me to Zenimax legal department (snail mail contact info only) so I wrote them a letter the other day. Waiting to hear back.

[llamaRCA]

 

Did Beth ever get back to you about this?

 

 

I've been trying to write some dialogue reusing vanilla lines to see how it would go. It's miserable.

 

 

Escalation manager finally referred me to Zenimax legal department (snail mail contact info only) so I wrote them a letter the other day. Waiting to hear back.

 

 

Cool. Hope you hear back.

[NDDragor]

I was thinking about the player getting his voice changed or losing it completely during a mod. It shouldnt be too hard to change somebodys voice with all the available technology in the F4 universe so it wouldnt be something completely unbelievable or absurd. Vanilla lines could be used at the beginning but later the player would get a completely new voice and in the end he would get back his original voice.

Edited February 19, 2016 by NDDragor

[Belthan]

If the player will be isolated for the duration of the mod as in most of the official DLC for FO3 and FNV, changing the player voice could work. "Something in the atmosphere" or whatever. Or here's a thought for the computer generated voice: Tobar says he used to travel to the Commonwealth when the Duchess Gambit was more seaworthy. Maybe Tobar Jr. carries on his dad's legacy but gives you a tracheotomy instead of a lobotomy. Unfortunately, for quests that involve vanilla locations and characters, it doesn't seem feasible without replacing most or all of the player's lines. It would be very disconcerting if you talk to Handy (or Willow Jr. :wink: ) in one voice, turn around, and talk to Preston in a different voice.